Unofficial 40 times for Mark Barron were 4.54 and 4.73.

Discussion in 'Draft Zone' started by cowboyjoe, Mar 29, 2012.

  1. Doomsday101

    Doomsday101 Well-Known Member

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    We signed Pool so we don't have to reach for one. Barron I don't think Dallas takes him at 14. Depending on how things fall they could move back and take him higher but part of being active in FA was to put us in a situation where we are not having to reach out of pure need
  2. jblaze2004

    jblaze2004 Well-Known Member

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    man these bama guys are big. Richardson only a 4.58????(but for someone so physical and big I guess thats okay). He is going to get the tough 3 and break alot of tackles, but may not break a sweep 80yards for a touchdown.
  3. 28 Joker

    28 Joker 28 Joker

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    Maybe, I'm being too hard on Cox, because he is still raw. However, that is the point. I know at some point, the Cowboys are probably going to have to take a gamble on a d-linemen in round 1, however, I just think there are much better football players to be had and better values.

    Evidently, the Cowboys really like him, and they do need a young, impact defensive lineman. However, Cox is going to have to develop his pass rush just like Brockers. Plus, from what I've gathered, Cox is raw and plays high, and he really wasn't the sudden pass rusher at Mississippi State that his combine numbers might suggest. I think there is some significant risk there when you need to nail a pick. The fact that Cox plays too high causes some significant problems for him. Plus, Cox's instincts to find the football consistently have been questioned. I think he's a project, and I'm not sure that he could come in day one and be a starting 5 technique from the start. Is this guy going to be a strong 2-gap player right from the start. Derek Sherrod, who I liked last year, wasn't ready to start at Green Bay. He is from Mississippi State, too.

    I'd much rather draft Malik Jackson from Tennessee and develop him and draft a better player than Cox or Brockers in round 1.

    I think Peter Konz would whip Cox's rear-end inside, because Cox plays too high, and he tended to get "washed up inside" against the run according to Wes Bunting. The Dallas scouts and coaches should be challenged on this match-up.

    Who would win that match-up?

    I think Peter Konz would soundly defeat Fletcher Cox, a player who plays too high and is better off with some space.
  4. jblaze2004

    jblaze2004 Well-Known Member

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    so 4-3 DE?
  5. jblaze2004

    jblaze2004 Well-Known Member

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    you are correct.
    yeah he can run fast in a straight line the problem was turning and running. How did barron look in the drills? anybody know. The game is played in pads.
  6. jblaze2004

    jblaze2004 Well-Known Member

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    yeah but not in the 1st round.
  7. MichaelWinicki

    MichaelWinicki "You want some?" Staff Member

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    I wouldn't say that.

    They made a living out of signing safeties to one-year deals lately.
  8. kmd24

    kmd24 Active Member

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    I think Konz, with his questionable upper body strength, tendency to overextend, and struggles in pass protection, would have a hard time keeping his QB upright in that matchup.
  9. InmanRoshi

    InmanRoshi Zone Scribe

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    If Wes Bunting doesn't like Cox, that means he's going to at least 6 or 7 Pro Bowls.
  10. Cowboy Junkie

    Cowboy Junkie leonargized

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    I would stay away from all these Bama guys. they are too slow.
    if pick was a late first then maybe take the chance but I would not take a chance on slow at 14
  11. 28 Joker

    28 Joker 28 Joker

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    Broaddus did a report on Cox, too. The Georgia game was not a good one for Cox. Cox is a raw player and presents risk, because he is not a developed pass rusher. If Cox or Brockers can't develop into pass rushers, good luck to the team who takes them in the top 10-20 picks.
  12. 28 Joker

    28 Joker 28 Joker

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    I disagree.

    Konz is solid in pass protection, and he has good short-area quickness and pass protection instincts. Konz has a strong anchor, and he plays much stronger on tape than some bench press competition. He is a converted OT. Konz would pick up Cox's games inside and wipe him out. Konz is tough and finishes his blocks, and he would own the raw, unrefined Cox inside, imo. Konz doesn't give ground in pass protection, either.

    Broaddus did an excellent report on Konz.
  13. Teague31

    Teague31 Defender of the Star

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    Don't want any part of the Alabama guys at 14. If we trade down that's a different story.
  14. Risen Star

    Risen Star Likes Collector Zone Supporter

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    Smart man.

    You generally do add a tenth to the individual workout times, but considering they're all run on different surfaces they're even more meaningless than the combine numbers.
  15. boysfanindc

    boysfanindc Well-Known Member

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    In the video I have seen it looks like Brockers always gets a push, sometimes he takes the wrong angle, but he always seem to be on the right side of the line of scrimmage and the few times he is not he gets his arms up in the passing lane, those are pretty high arms as tall as he is.
  16. 28 Joker

    28 Joker 28 Joker

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    I use different sources to form an opinion on the players in the draft. I really like Wes Bunting's work in the offensive line, and Bunting stated that Tyron Smith looked like a top 10 pick in December of 2010. I like Bunting in general, too. Bunting is big on Brockers, but I'm not. I listen to Mike Lombardi and Charley Casserly, too. I really like them. I like Mike Mayock. The CBS Sports/NFL Draft Scout stuff is very detailed and pretty good, so I've used those. I used Bryan Broaddus' college scouting reports last year, and I've read some of them this year. I certainly don't agree with all of Broaddus' opinions or with all of his work, but his work on the college players is a good source of information. So, I do use more than one source to base my arguments and opinions on.

    These players like Brockers, Cox, and Poe are raw players, and they don't have the pass rushing pedigree coming out of college. All three of them are going to have be developed, especially in the pass rushing aspect of the game. They are projects in this regard, especially. Can the Cowboys afford to give a defensive lineman a red-shirt season when they have other pressing issues or needs on the team? The best player among them will probably be the player who develops into a pass rushing threat. That is why all three players are very risky in the top 20, especially to a team like the Cowboys. Dallas can't afford to miss on this pick, because they have too many needs. Will any of them develop those pass rushing skills? If so, which one? Defensive line has a significant bust rate in round 1, and the highly touted LSU defensive linemen have not lived up to the hype (Dorsey, Jackson, Spears). There is no disputing that.

    So, yeah. Drafting Peter Konz (the undisputed best center in the draft) and replacing Phil Costa, Bill Nagy, or Kevin Kowalski is very appealing to me. Again, only the very best interior offensive linemen get drafted in the first round, and that makes them even safer picks. You draft Konz and plug him in to start at center. The defensive linemen get overvalued and overrated every year, and they have a high bust rate in round 1 as a result.
  17. supercowboy8

    supercowboy8 Well-Known Member

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    I agree, just look at what konz did against worthy, still, ans short. Three top bid 10/12 DTs, he owned them all.

    Konz would own Poe, Cox, and Brockers
  18. 28 Joker

    28 Joker 28 Joker

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    According to Mike Lombardi, LSU took Brockers out in their nickel defense. Lombardi talked about Brockers again today. Lombardi stated that Brockers is a raw player who doesn't use his hands well. He even used the word "project" when talking about Brockers and Poe today, and he talked about the tough transition to the NFL for defensive linemen. Lombardi talked about needing to "red-shirt" them. Furthermore, he talked about how Brockers will need to be re-trained and taught how to recognize when it's run or pass and "get going". Also, Lombardi stated that Brockers will need to learn how to use his hands and feet "at the same time", so he can get to the passer. Finally, when discussing Brockers and Poe, Lombardi stated that teams would have to determine which player can be the best pass rusher (on passing downs). Lombardi stated that both Brockers and Poe are "raw" players. He did say that Brockers was "long" and "athletic".
  19. Beast_from_East

    Beast_from_East Well-Known Member

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    Wow, no way I take him at 14 with these numbers.
  20. kmd24

    kmd24 Active Member

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    Yeah, I'm just pointing out that you're taking a couple of negative things out of Cox's report and ignoring Konz's negatives from the same guy.

    Say what you want, but Cox and Konz are graded just about the same by nationalfootballpost.

    Konz has plenty of red flags. Allows defenders under his pad level. Isn't a consistent puncher in pass protection. Will get overextended in pass protection. Lacks elite power (18 reps at the combine). These are all from Wes Bunting, I believe. Add in a medical condition that could cut his career short, and he's far from a sure thing.

    Some of the same things said about Cox (tendency to get upright and get washed out of plays) were said about Quinton Coples.

    The thing I like about both guys is that they are hard workers and play through the whistle. I don't know that I'd be happy with either at 14, but I'm hearing Cox might be gone by then anyway.

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