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VIDEO COMPARISON: The Phillips 3-4 vs The Parcells 3-4

Discussion in 'Artwork Zone' started by TEK2000, May 17, 2007.

  1. Billy Bullocks

    Billy Bullocks Active Member

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    That's because the philosophies are different. Parcells likes to set up individual match ups with his players against the opponent, and then relies on the individuals to make plays.
  2. TEK2000

    TEK2000 New Member

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    Not really. Parcells/Zimmer didn't adjust the defense to what the offense was doing. So you can't really say that they were setting up for individual matchups. The defense was matching up with whatever the offense gave them... instead of Wade Phillips that adjusted his defensive alignment to get his players matched up on who HE wanted instead of what the opponent wanted.

    Almost every play, the Chargers defense would switch sides depending on the alignment of the offense. RARELY did the Cowboy defense ever switch based on the alignment of the offense.
  3. theogt

    theogt Surrealist Zone Supporter

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    And the Chargers, Steelers, and Ravens play it to an extent as well. They'll all sometimes 2-gap one side of the line and 1-gap another side or 1-gap both sides. None of them play a 2-gap as exclusively as Parcells, however, so it's extremely hard to make a comparison one way or the other.

    Funny, I was thinking of Aaron when I typed it. They're both small, old, Parcells' guys.
  4. superpunk

    superpunk Benched

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    Not really. All defensive linemen, in any scheme ar e eventually gonna have to switch from playing run to pass and vice versa. A comarison of how well they do it can be made. Extent to which they play 2 gap versus 1 gap is irrelevent.
  5. theogt

    theogt Surrealist Zone Supporter

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    It's entirely relevant. In fact, it's the whole point of the discussion. You have to compare 2-gap to 2-gap and 1-gap to 1-gap.
  6. Alexander

    Alexander What's it going to be then, eh?

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    The players are the ones who ultimately have to execute the play/scheme that is called.

    Coach Parcells isn't the first, nor the last, to run a predominantly two-gap defense.

    Whether or not we have the right talent is more relevant than just the scheme.

    Someone said is there anyone who could function well in this system.

    That is a very good question. It is well known it is a very very hard defense to play. Anyone can attest to that.
  7. TEK2000

    TEK2000 New Member

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    You're right, but the purpose of my comparison was to simply show what is typical of what Wade Phillips did with his defense in San Diego last season and show what the Cowboys typically did on defense last season. It's not a comparison of how good or bad each group of players is.

    Nor is it an attempt to put down Parcells and Zimmer. Its simply an educational piece for those people that may not have seen the kinds of things Wade Phillips did in San Diego compared to what we have seen with the Cowboys.

    I believe that the production of last season's defense was a combination of personell issues as well as scheme issues. In some instances the scheme was limited because of the capabilities of the personell, while in some other instances the personell was limited by the scheme.

    I look forward to seeing what our DLinemen can get done under this new style that Wade Phillips brings.
  8. adbutcher

    adbutcher K9NME

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    :hammer:

    The uninformed would say there is not a difference between 1 gapping and 2 gapping...these videos beg the differ!

    Thanks!
  9. BigDFan5

    BigDFan5 In Tebow I Trust

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    Come on now my "Caption the Redskins fan" has to be top 5 :)
  10. eduncan22

    eduncan22 Benched

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    2006 San Dog run defense 100.8 ypg ranked # 7
    2006 Cowboys run defense 103.7 ypg ranked # 10

    Total difference is only 46 yards.


    Again, over the last half of the season, our pass defense died.

    2006 San Dog pass D 200.8 ypg ranked # 13
    2006 Cowboys pass D 219.1 ypg ranked # 24

    Total difference is 294 yards.
  11. Bob Sacamano

    Bob Sacamano Benched

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    excellent work, the difference is astounding, watching the 2's play against the run, their linemen attack the gaps while our linemen, pause, and then fight past the line of scrimmage, albeit w/ not much success, that's how it was for basically all our plays

    1 thing I noticed though w/ the clip showing San Diego's NT and DE stunt, their DE actually pushed his way into the backfield, for all the whining and crying about lack of stunting, the linemen still need to push their man back when it comes down to it, you're not always going to find a gap to run through, and that was one our DE's biggest problems, they were neutralized once the Olineman got their hands on them, so hopefully another year of strength and conditioning will help our ends

    but again, excellent work
  12. theogt

    theogt Surrealist Zone Supporter

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    That's strange considering we have a better secondary but they had a better pass-rush. Clearly we should replace our secondary rather than upgrade the pass-rush.
  13. big dog cowboy

    big dog cowboy THE BIG DOG Staff Member

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    Thanks for posting this. I knew last night when I read what you did that it was a must see video. Is it Sept. yet???
  14. CowboyFan74

    CowboyFan74 Cowboys Analyst

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    I like the play where Faneca gets blown off the line:laugh2:

    Nice work TEK..
  15. superpunk

    superpunk Benched

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    Go back and read it again. Alexander said they didn't transition well from run to pass mode - which is true. You questioned whether there were any defensive players that DID do that well, and then went off on some irrelevent tangent about Bellichick. All players have to transition from run to pass. All players will play the different styles. The extent to which they do so is irrelevent in a comparison of how well they do it.
  16. theogt

    theogt Surrealist Zone Supporter

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    My point was that the ends that have been successful overall in Belicheck's system don't necessarily transition from run to pass any better than our ends. Their "success" may be the result of being able to play 1-gap and 2-gap. We would have to look at their success only while playing 2-gap. Some people think that the Belicheck system = the Parcells system. That is completely untrue. They're very different sytems, so you can't just compare ends that easily. That's why it's relevant.
  17. Mr Cowboy

    Mr Cowboy Well-Known Member

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    The thing that I noticed on the clips, is what I have complained about for years about our defense, and blitzing.

    When we blitz, it is never to the path of least resistance. Our blitzers always run straight into a blocker. It is almost as if the blitzing scheme calls for them to run into a blocker first to make sure that blocker doesn't block anyone else, and then go for the QB. We very seldom had a straight shot at the QB unless the rusher beat his blocker right off the bat.
  18. superpunk

    superpunk Benched

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    Your point is a tangent.

    Point about our ends: They do not transition from playing run to pass well.

    Theo's point: Who does? And don't say Bellichick's players, because he runs less two gap scheme.

    See the disconnect yet? All players have to transition from playing run to pass. The gap assignment was not in Alexander's original observation, you set it up in some fallacy. ALL players must transition at some point in every game from playing the run on a run call to pass, and vice versa. Our ends do it poorly. Leave your tangents at the door.
  19. theogt

    theogt Surrealist Zone Supporter

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    In what context did our players have to transition from playing run to pass? In what context do other players have to transition from playing run to pass?

    The split second you give O-line in a 2-gap system allows them to set up and be ready for the pass-rush. They have a huge advantage over the D-line as compared to a 1-gap system. The more a player is forced to play 2-gap the worse he is going to appear at transitioning from run to pass. Other players may appear better at the transition, but that may be the result of playing more 1-gap vs. 2-gap.

    How can you not see how relevant this is?
  20. superpunk

    superpunk Benched

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    You're setting up a litany of strawman arguments to attempt (and fail) to make a point. Not interested....

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