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What A Complete Disaster

Discussion in 'Political Zone' started by CoachParcells, May 5, 2004.

  1. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    Not really. I would know that physical retribution would be wrong.

    Humans can be emotional people however. When you say something to be as deeply offensive as questioning my patriotism I would very likely do something that I don't agree with in principle.

    I'm far from perfect. I got caught up in this whole war thing and have since realized what a mistake it was. Which means maybe I am still wrong? None of this changes my shame I am feeling for our country right now.
  2. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    Maybe I smell real bad? :)

    Sorry to dissapoint you but me and my family aren't going anywhere.

    Today's military does nothing to preserve my right to "spew filth". Trust me, if this right was ever taken away from the citizens, the military would become the enemy as they are now simply an extension of the executive branch.
  3. BrAinPaiNt

    BrAinPaiNt Bad Santa Staff Member

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    For the record I never said you were wrong in your viewpoint....I just do not agree with them.

    What is right for you is right for you....does not mean it would be right for me...and vice versa.

    You know how I used to be....I would be doing the same or worse before...I have tried to learn and temper myself in many areas...I know we are all human and nobody is perfect and that it is very hard to temper oneself when they read stuff that they take as insults...even if they were not meant to be that way.

    Typing words on an internet forum leaves much to be desired and opens up so many chances of being misread.

    We can not hear the tone or inflection in anothers voice when they state something...we can not see facial expressions or body language, we can not see if someone is red faced or just being calm.
    Those areas can lead to many things because it leads the interpretation to the person reading the message and not truly knowing how it was meant.

    I think it is fair to say we have all been guilty of that....I do remember getting on to you one time and it was my mistake because my temper got the best of me.
  4. BrAinPaiNt

    BrAinPaiNt Bad Santa Staff Member

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    Wanted to comment on the soldier situation.
    I think you have seen my posts before and Know that I am one to jump right up and defend the soldiers...one who gets upset with people that say bad things about the soldiers or takes them for granted....one that beleives that people should be lucky for those soldiers that give them the freedom to say what they want.

    With all of that said I will now say that I AM ashamed of those soldiers that were caught in pictures doing those things to the Iraqis.
    Not only were they wrong for doing that type of thing...but they were just plain stupid for taking pictures of it and posing in those pictures with big smiles on their faces.

    That is as wrong AND stupid as someone video taping the kids playing...those kids doing something you feel is wrong....leaving the video camera recording on a tripod...walking over to the kids and physically abusing them (no I am not talking about giving them a spanking or washing out their mouths with soap...I am talking physical abuse).

    Wrong is Wrong....and with what happened I am ashamed of THOSE soldiers....but just because those soldiers did bad things....does not mean that the majority of soldiers would do that type of thing....and I would imagine that if many of the soldiers saw these other soldiers doing that...they would have done something to make it stop.

    Speaking of which....someone had to see those pictures (another soldier, a soldiers loved one) and reported it to the papers because they felt it was wrong.

    The actions taken by those soldiers doing that type of stuff, only gives the rest of the soldiers a black eye and hurts all of the good that the other soldiers may be doing.
  5. Irving Cowboy

    Irving Cowboy The Chief

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    You sir, are a walking contradiction.


    Let me guess... you probably agreed with the people who spit on the Vietnam Vets when they came back, right?? Since you are ashamed of our military, would you spit on one of these guys when they come back?? I would think not.. I think someone would be "struggling for oxygen"...
  6. gbrittain

    gbrittain Well-Known Member

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    Hello there Mr. Boyer.

    My name is Gary Brittain, but most people I work with call me Captain Brittain.

    That is because I am a member of the US Army. I am very proud of it as well.

    I suggest you gather a group of soldiers preferably the ones in Afghanistan and Iraq and tell them you are ashamed of them.

    Unlike you, they would just think you are nuts and leave you alone and they probably would not leave you "struggling for oxygen".
  7. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    you round up those soldiers that engaged in abuse and bring them to my doorstep and I will be happy to oblige you.

    If I can sign up to serve on the jury that gets to judge them just point me in the right direction.
  8. BrAinPaiNt

    BrAinPaiNt Bad Santa Staff Member

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    So are you going to join the armed forces so you can be part of the court martial :D

    Now as far as the other civilian agencies that MAY be behind this stuff...I would sign up along with you to serve in the jury.
  9. Irving Cowboy

    Irving Cowboy The Chief

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    I am ashamed of what THEY DID too... You brought up children, I know when my boys do something bad, I am not ashamed of them, I am ashamed of what they did... and they know that.

    For that matter, Eric did not make a distinction between the soldiers who are in those abhorrent pictures and the other 99.99% of the military... that's what I took offense to.
  10. gbrittain

    gbrittain Well-Known Member

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    No, Mr. Boyer.

    You did not insult just the bad apples you insulted the entire country and the military.

    Good try though.

    Those "said" soldiers are already rounded up and pending an article 32.
  11. BrAinPaiNt

    BrAinPaiNt Bad Santa Staff Member

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    Well...I honestly do not know if he meant them all or just the current ones under investigation....I took it as just the current ones because of the start of this thread.

    But maybe he did mean the other ones as well....like I said I just took it that he meant the ones doing the this crazy stuff.
  12. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    Of course I didn't mean them all.

    I'm speaking collectively. I also said voters but I don't mean all voters, just those that are respnsible for the shame I am currently feeling.

    You will be hard pressed to find me critical of our military. I will never be critical of somebody expressing their patriotism.
  13. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    So now I "insulted" them all huh?

    Care to elaborate?
  14. gbrittain

    gbrittain Well-Known Member

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    Sure.


    "I am ashamed of the arrogance the citizens of this country possess. I'm ashamed of the troops, the media, the president, congress, the voters, and myself."


    You broad brushed the citizens, media, president, congress, and voters.

    It stands to reason you broad brushed the troops as well. That is what you did.

    You did not say anthing about the bad apples who the good ones a bad name.

    And is there somone out there who is proud of what the bad apple soldiers did?
  15. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    One of the guys that practiced abuse? I would like to do more then spit.

    I'm not the kind of guy that would burn the flag either.
  16. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    When Goodrich killed people driving a car and then ran away he cast shame on the entire Dallas Cowboys organization. You still haven't showed how I insulted them though. The only insult I see was calling the citizens arrogant.

    Let me also add that the wording "troops" does not convey what I am trying to express. These actions have shamed our entire military and those in charge need to take responsibility as well.
  17. gbrittain

    gbrittain Well-Known Member

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    Spin it however you want Mr. Boyer.

    I am ashamed of what those soldiers did. I am in no way ashamed of the other million plus soldiers in the military.

    You obviously are, and that is an insult wether you choose to see it as one or not.

    These soldiers sacrafice way too much for the actions of a few to cause you to be ashamed of them.
  18. Eric_Boyer

    Eric_Boyer Well-Known Member

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    Are you ashamed of the fact that this could happen in the military?

    I am.
  19. CoachParcells

    CoachParcells Benched

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    For all of you who think "Eh, it's just a few bad apples"

    Do you honestly think that matters?

    Even hardcore neo-conservatives know the actions of even a few soldiers will lead to more casualties and further erosion of what little credibility we have in the eyes of the international community.
  20. gbrittain

    gbrittain Well-Known Member

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    Two different subjects.

    Credibility is a problem. Retaliation could also be a problem. All of this as a result of what those soldiers did.

    Now am I ashamed of the vast majority of good soldiers? The answer is no.

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