Featured What IS working

Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by jterrell, Nov 6, 2013.

  1. kramskoi

    kramskoi Well-Known Member

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    But what have they actually won in the past decade? That really is the only relevant question...at least for a fanbase and an organization that aspires to its rich history of championship caliber performance. Dallas is approaching nearly TWO decades with not even a deep playoff run to their credit.
  2. rwalters31

    rwalters31 Well-Known Member

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    Brother, I like your optimism, but at the moment we are still a 8-8 team. We are replacing players at an alarming rate. The last games are against Divisional teams that have a tendency of getting better at the end of the season. So, with this being said I look at the end of the season like this: 1. The Cowboys will be 8-8 after the last game; 2. The Cowboys will have a better Divisional record; 3. The Cowboys will be without key players after the last game and comb the streets for warm bodies; 4. The Cowboys will s _ _ k at the end but the rest of the NFCE will s _ _ K worse and the Cowboys will win the Division. The first playoff game will be be played at the AT&& Stadium with the Cowboys fielding a team with half the players picked off the Street the previous week. The final score is 45 to 9 ( not Cowboys) and the kicker is the most valuable player.:confused:o_O
  3. kramskoi

    kramskoi Well-Known Member

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    The thing is, I look at the offensive line...it could be argued that it has been retooled, notwithstanding the addition of Waters. They still need a guard through the draft. That said, that line needs to start performing at a higher level in both running and passing. For Garrett and the rest of the coaches to simply give up on cultivating a running game is almost profane. Garrett, Callahan and Romo checking out of run plays is too much power marginalizing the rushing attack. I always wondered why Callahan, with his predilection for passing, was chosen as a play-caller. The running game is not cultivated and the rushing totals per season continue to fall. In four weeks the offensive line has gone from the penthouse to the outhouse...even before the injury to Waters the shine was coming off. It was hailed as a much improved unit, as the defense was earlier in the year. At the half-way mark, the results are much more sobering.

    When you look at the Dallas - New Orleans matchup, we as fans must really ask ourselves if the team is better or worse than the the '09 team that dominated the Saints through three quarters, on route to handing them their first defeat of the season. Is this team better than New Orleans after four years of retooling?

    I watched the 09' contest last night and Barber's violence looked remarkable compared to where the team is now. He destroyed Jonathan Vilma on more than a few plays (sending him to the sidelines for a few). At 12:05 of the third quarter, they had 106 yds rushing and almost perfect balance. Straight out of the locker room...second half...13 play 7 min drive, 31 yds rushing, 43 yds passing...24 - 3. Everything flowed in that game, even when Free was getting abused at right tackle. Romo was fearless and commanding...the guy did not flinch in the face of a fierce fourth quarter rally by the Saints. Spencer put on clinic and Ware mopped up the mess. It was a signature win down the stretch and easily one of the best performances under Romo as quarterback.

    I really want to be wrong about Garrett and my concerns about him stem more from the fact that offensively the team has atrophied since he took over. It is a trend that he needs to correct "yesterday" or tomorrows for Dallas are likely to be more akin to the old adage, "the past is prologue".
    tantrix1969 likes this.
  4. Carharris2

    Carharris2 Well-Known Member

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    I see your point. It seems to me though both sides do this.
    As for the bias in the management of this site that is very possible. If that is true I don't agree with that at all. My opinion is this should be a place for free discussion. It's not my site though so they probably don't care much about my opinion.
    stasheroo likes this.
  5. LeonDixson

    LeonDixson Illegitimi non carborundum

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    This isn't a slam on you but I don't think that what came across in the bolded part is what you really meant. The OP saw it as a positive that Hatcher and Selvie are on pace for double digit sacks and now we're getting Ware back who statistically is #3. You disagreed. You don't see that as a positive?

    Your point that he is only #3 because he has missed games may be correct, but it's still a positive that we get him back in 3rd place.
  6. Gaede

    Gaede Well-Known Member

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    Great post. We can easily get caught up in little details that we lose perspective.

    I would like to see us beat a good team, however, before i start getting too optimistic
  7. TwoDeep3

    TwoDeep3 Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    I don't feel you can compare one game to another in the same season much less two franchises playing 4 years apart.
  8. skinsscalper

    skinsscalper Well-Known Member

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    10 to 1 says that 90% of the whining doom and gloom group were "time out" kids.
  9. Alexander

    Alexander What's it going to be then, eh?

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    Then there are those that whine about other people whining, which is just as bad if not worse.

    I disagree. Jones allowed his own sentimentality to be played by Ratliff, who I feel is one of the lowest character players to ever play for this franchise. He lied to and quit on his teammates for his own selfish reasons. Now the other two 30 year olds, I agree with.

    There is no reason why Romo should not be humming along with this offense, knowing it like the back of his hand by this stage. You see a little of that, but I still do not think after seven years together, the pair have a bond, like what you saw with Turner and Aikman. It also hurts Romo has not had a good positional coach since David Lee walked out the door.
  10. Alexander

    Alexander What's it going to be then, eh?

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    I just fail to understand why people misidentify the issues Johnson met when he went to Miami.

    A "first class offense" with an ancient Dan Marino? No running game? He did not inherit a quality offense and he did fail overall as a result.

    He became fallible with his drafts for several reasons. Number one being he only was able to secure the services of Ackles, not Wooten, Mansperger and others who were on the Dallas staff. Number two, he simply was a defensive coach and did not have the ability to draft the offensive talent needed. It really was not a lot different than in Dallas where he inherited Irvin, stumbled over Aikman and had to be convinced to draft Emmitt Smith by Joe Brodsky.

    He did not suddenly become a bad football coach, nor did he lose his ability to select defensive talent, which is clearly evident with the excellent defensive players he was able to draft with the Dolphins.

    But I see his failure in Miami being held up way too often as some sort of "proof" that Jerry Jones can actually build a champion without him.

    We have already seen the results after Jones cleared out the scouting minds in Dallas that helped build a champion.

    Fact is, both failed when the "perfect storm" was no longer in effect.
    tantrix1969 likes this.
  11. jobberone

    jobberone Kane Ala Staff Member

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    I never tried to make that point.

    As to Jones it's clear his stumbled and fumbled with talent acquisition until Parcells got him on the right path. I do see talent here as improving overall.

    As to Miami, Marino put up good numbers until 99. The offense was above average in points and yardage although not top ten. And the defense was mediocre.

    You are giving Jerry deserved criticism for doing poorly in talent acquisition in that period yet are making excuses for Johnson over the same time. Who cares if Jimmy couldn't keep his own guys. He left those guys to fend for themselves, was out of football awhile and then jumped back in. If you think I'm arguing about those two then no. All I've said is Jimmy didn't appear to be a great coach in Miami and he didn't exactly start from scratch there at the very least. He had three years to do something and couldn't. I love Jimmy and I think he's got a great eye for talent and coaches as well as being a fairly dinkum good defensive coach. I just don't put him up there with the greats of the game as he only had three winning seasons for the Boys and three for the Dolphins. Those latter were 9-7(2) and 10-6 winning two WC games and losing by the second largest margin of loss in playoff history in the other 62-7. He backed into the playoffs with the two 9-7 seasons.
  12. Alexander

    Alexander What's it going to be then, eh?

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    Not at all. I was pointing out that yes, he did have success drafting his specialty which is defensive talent. That is unquestionable, but people still want to mischaracterize his tenure in Miami as a complete failure, which is nothing but grandstanding to deflect attention from what Jones did which was bring a franchise to its knees during the same time period by horrible drafting on both sides of the football.
  13. jobberone

    jobberone Kane Ala Staff Member

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    I agree. It was decidedly not a complete failure and I'd say not a failure. But I'd say it was a failure to achieve the glory of the early 90s Cowboys' teams and a failure to achieve greatness as a coach compared to Landry, Lombardi, Shula and the like.
  14. Alexander

    Alexander What's it going to be then, eh?

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    Landry had the benefit of beginning and ending his career in Dallas. Shula built winners in Baltimore and Miami. Lombardi failed in Washington.

    I do not think most people would rank Johnson at the top legendary echelon. But in terms of Cowboys history, he is the second best and still belongs on the second tier of all-time great head coaches IMO.
  15. Plankton

    Plankton Well-Known Member

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    Shula inherited a team four years removed from back to back championships in Baltimore that was .500 in 1962, and still had an in their prime Johnny Unitas, Jim Parker, Gino Marchetti, Lenny Moore and Tom Matte - there wasn't much rebuilding required at all. Lombardi didn't fail at all in Washington - he coached one season (1969), and led them to their first winning season since 1955. He died before he could do anything else.

    As for Johnson, no, he was not a success in Miami. However, since he took over in Miami in 1996, Johnson has won as many playoff games as Jerry Jones' Cowboys - two.

    And Johnson hasn't been active in football in 14 years.
  16. TwoDeep3

    TwoDeep3 Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    I stole that from a post you made. I had not considered that, but you, as you do so many times, made it clear that something is out of sync between two guys who have been together for seven years.

    My belief the fundamental culture of this team with Jerry so close to the organization and wearing two hats causes him to throw mixed messages and could be construed as passive aggressive, which is the case with Ratliff.

    Alex, I disagree with your disagreeing. Jerry called out Ratt in front of others. Ratt may have thin skin, but Jerry feels he has a familiarity with the players that puts him on their level, until he pulls out the boom stick as the GM/Head coach.

    Some men are built in a way they can ignore that type of leadership - if you want to call it that. Ratt evidently wasn't and took the money and hauled the mail.

    As to your first point, I get it. But I tire of this game of second class citizen because I will not eat from the bowl of ignoring the elephant in the room. Sometimes I express it.

    Nice seeing you again.
  17. TwoDeep3

    TwoDeep3 Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    Lombardi failing in Washington does have a small caveat that he had cancer and didn't spend the time with that franchise to perhaps succeed.
  18. 5Stars

    5Stars Here comes the Sun...

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    No salary cap...
  19. Eddie

    Eddie Well-Known Member

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    Yes, we have LOTS to be optimistic about. 1 playoff win in 17 years just calls for eternal optimism. A lunatic control freak running this team has done a wonderful job.

    A perennial .500 team with $31 million in the hole for next year. Again, wonderful job.

    Jerry Jones will do anything to win ... except remove the main problem from the equation. He may WANT to win, but he obviously doesn't know how.

    The team has become a laughing stock of the league. Jerry wants relevance ... he's got it.
  20. dallasdave

    dallasdave Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget Jimmy Johnson took over the worst team in the league in 1989 and turned it into a Superbowl championship team in 4 years. I won't say who's team he took over to avoid conflict on old coaches, but it's fair to say Jimmy inherited a total mess. He built the team from the ground up and that's what the Cowboys need now a coach who will build the team, to a championship team. A coach of the future not afraid to do whatever's needed to get to the Super Bowl Victory. A coach who will stop at nothing to have the # 1 team in the NFL, in other words a man like Jimmy Johnson.

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