Emmitt Smith/Jerry Rice Double Standard (BTB)

[bandfan]

Oh, and since some other sports have been mentioned, Roger Federer never has had an offensive line worth dang....

 

[PJTHEDOORS]

Jim Brown was the GOAT RB, and it's not even close. All Pro, league leader in rushing yards in 8 years of his 8 year career, 100 yards+ per game in 7 years. Probably few RB records he didn't hold when he retired, and probably could have played years more if he had wanted to, retiring after 3 straight All Pro seasons. League MVP 3 times.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BrowJi00.htm

Emmitt had a 5 year stint of dominance plus a 9 year stint as a quality RB, giving him the career records. MVP once.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SmitEm00.htm

Jerry had a 10 out of 11 year All Pro tear *plus* a 8 year stint as a quality WR to give him the career receiving numbers. He's got the combination of Jim Brown's achievements and Emmitt's achievements. GOAT.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/R/RiceJe00.htm

I'm not that impressed with career accumulation of yardage. I'm against Frank Gore making it in. HOF to me is about being near the top for a chunk of time. That's not Frank Gore.

For GOAT, I lean toward Jim Brown's dominance over Jerry, but Emmitt isn't in the ballpark of either.

Pro Football Reference has a HOF Monitor metric for all positions. No metric is perfect, but it does sort them pretty sensibly.

Emitt is in a pack of Payton, Brown, and Sanders.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/hof/hofm_RB.htm

Jerry has twice the score of any other WR. GOAT.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/hof/hofm_WR.htm

So you'd take a prime Jim Brown over prime Bo Jackson?

 

[Bigdog]

And to think, we could have also had Joe Montana at QB as well.

And Tom Brady. Landry wanted Rice in that draft and did not think any other team knew about him due to the small school he came from. The Cowboys were total disarray when he was picked just ahead of them. They honestly did not have a backup plan.

 

[Super_Kazuya]

So you'd take a prime Jim Brown over prime Bo Jackson?

There no such thing as “prime Bo Jackson”. He never even started 10 games or had a 1,000 yards in a single season.

 

[PJTHEDOORS]

There no such thing as “prime Bo Jackson”. He never even started 10 games or had a 1,000 yards in a single season.

Ok. Prime Herschel Walker then.

 

[DFWJC]

Yep.

Michael Jordan is the GOAT NBA player because of his career accomplishments.

Jerry Rice is the GOAT WR because of his career accomplishments.

Tom Brady is the GOAT QB because of his career accomplishments.

Running back is the only position where they try to switch it up. Nope, not on my watch. Emmitt’s the GOAT RB. Period.

Not quite apples and apples there.

 

[Nav22]

Not quite apples and apples there.

Emmitt was the engine behind 3 Super Bowl wins and was MVP in 1 of those games.

He was NFL MVP in a year in which he missed the first 2 games. Dallas started 0-2. Emmitt ended his holdout and Dallas promptly went on to win their 2nd straight Super Bowl.

All-time records held by Emmitt:

- Career rush yds
- Career rush attempts
- Career rush TD (2nd-most total TD behind Rice)
- 1,000-yard rushing seasons
- 100-yard rushing games
- Rush TD in Super Bowls
- Rush yds in playoffs
- Rush TD in playoffs

Also consider that his all-time Rush yds (18,355) and Rush TD (164) records may NEVER be broken. Like, EVER.

Most Rush yds among active RB:

Frank Gore - 15,347
Adrian Peterson - 14,216
LeSean McCoy - 11,071

Most Rush TD among active RB:

Adrian Peterson - 111 (53 behind Emmitt)
Frank Gore - 79 (less than half of Emmitt’s total)
LeSean McCoy - 73

If there was a Tom Brady/Jerry Rice of running backs, it’d definitely be Emmitt.

There’s no other player in NFL history who has dominated his position’s all-time ranks like Emmitt has (not to mention has the championships to back them up)... and yet isn’t universally known as the GOAT of his position.

Part of that is because Emmitt played for the most hated team in the league.

Barry Sanders never won squat and holds exactly 0 all-time records, yet he gets more love than Emmitt almost universally. Barry was the GOAT of quitting on his team and turning a positive gain into a loss of 3, I’ll give him that.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

No. MJ won 6 rings with 11 total MVPs (regular season/Finals).

Kareem won 6 rings but was only the Finals MVP for 2 of those (8 MVPs total).

Kareem’s resume is insane and that’s why he’s considered one of the greatest. Not better than MJ though.

Kareem has more MVPs, more all defense, more all NBA.

Karen's accolades outshine Jordan's, and he's never mentioned in the top 3 of NBA players. I do like how you tried to find a way to fit your narrative though by combining finals MVPs and season MVPs lol, it was inventive.

 

[Nav22]

Kareem has more MVPs, more all defense, more all NBA.

Karen's accolades outshine Jordan's, and he's never mentioned in the top 3 of NBA players. I do like how you tried to find a way to fit your narrative though by combining finals MVPs and season MVPs lol, it was inventive.

Finals MVPs mean nothing to you?

Pippen’s 6 rings mean the same to you as Jordan’s 6 rings?

Not true about “nobody” putting Kareem in their top 3. ESPN, Bleacher Report and CBS all put out a list this year, and they each put Kareem at #3.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Finals MVPs mean nothing to you?

Pippen’s 6 rings mean the same to you as Jordan’s 6 rings?

They don't mean nothing(that was never said) they don't outweigh all the other accolades that Kareem has over Jordan.

A regular season MVP is worth at least 3x that of a finals MVP though to be sure.

 

[Nav22]

They don't mean nothing(that was never said) they don't outweigh all the other accolades that Kareem has over Jordan.

A regular season MVP is worth at least 3x that of a finals MVP though to be sure.

Highly debatable, considering Finals MVP generally goes to the best player on the championship team.

In 2016-17, Russell Westbrook won MVP before getting knocked out of the 1st Round. Kevin Durant won Finals MVP and is twice the player Westbrook is. Who had the better season???

Being the best player for a 6-time champion... vs being the best player for 2 titles and the 2nd-best player for 4 titles is a HUGE difference.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Finals MVPs mean nothing to you?

Pippen’s 6 rings mean the same to you as Jordan’s 6 rings?

Not true about “nobody” putting Kareem in their top 3. ESPN, Bleacher Report and CBS all put out a list this year, and they each put Kareem at #3.

My reply should have been:
Do all-NBA, all defense, and all star appearances mean nothing to you?

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Highly debatable, considering Finals MVP generally goes to the best player on the championship team.

In 2016-17, Russell Westbrook won MVP before getting knocked out of the 1st Round. Kevin Durant won Finals MVP and is twice the player Westbrook is. Who had the better season???

Being the best player for a 6-time champion... vs being the best player for 2 titles and the 2nd-best player for 4 titles is a HUGE difference.

Not debatable at all lol.

It's being the best player out of roughly 20 players for a 4-7 game span, or being the best player out of 300 players for an 82 game sample size.

That's just silly.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Highly debatable, considering Finals MVP generally goes to the best player on the championship team.

In 2016-17, Russell Westbrook won MVP before getting knocked out of the 1st Round. Kevin Durant won Finals MVP and is twice the player Westbrook is. Who had the better season???

Being the best player for a 6-time champion... vs being the best player for 2 titles and the 2nd-best player for 4 titles is a HUGE difference.

Ahh so Andre Iggy had a better season than Lebron the year he won finals MVP by default?

Didn't think so lol

 

[atlantacowboy]

I just finished reading a BTB article that talks about this, and I saw in the comments that even Cowboys fans sell Emmitt short in this discussion. Without trying to sound biased, here are my thoughts on it:

Jerry Rice is the equivalent of Emmitt Smith at the wide receiver position. Just like Emmitt does for running back, he holds the majority of the major NFL records for receivers.

They also have a couple of career parallels: They both slid in the draft because of concerns over their measurables at the NFL Combine. Neither was the first player selected at their position in their drafts. They both won 3 Super Bowls. They even retired the same year.

But......Jerry actually played on more stacked teams than Emmitt. His supporting cast had a combined 69 Pro Bowls and 18 All-Pro (1st Team) selections between them. If you include his offensive lines, that makes 126 Pro Bowls and 33 All-Pro selections. By comparison, Emmitt's supporting cast had 48 Pro Bowls and 14 All-Pro selections.

If Jerry Rice is widely considered the GOAT wide receiver and gets a pass for the teammates he played with, why does Emmitt Smith get penalized for his teammates when his name is mentioned as an all-time great?

Emmitt's supporting cast was top-notch, but HE was the most important and indispensable out of the group. Even with all the talent that Emmitt had surrounding him, teams still feared him the most when they played the Cowboys. He routinely faced defenses stacked with 8 and 9 men in the box. They wanted to take their chances with the passing game and not let Emmitt get going.

I have a little bit more to add, but for right now I'll leave off here and give you a link to the article below:

https://www.bloggingtheboys.com/202...itt-smith-is-also-the-greatest-rb-of-all-time

You can be a cowboy fan without being a homer. Statistically, Emmitt is the most prolific rusher of all-time........ by stats. BUT, he was not the most talented or gifted and thats what these discussions about GOAT revolve around. If you could have any RB in their prime, you taking Emmitt over Jim Brown? Walter Peyton? Barry Sanders? Earl Campbell? Most NFL fans who have seen all 4 guys would put Emmitt behind these rbs. Heck, I'd take Tony Dorsett over Emmitt.

In contrast. When you see Jerry Rice on a football field, its easy to see that he is unique. Nobody has ever had his combo of hands and route running. In an all-time fantasy draft, he's going #1 at WR.

 

[CATCH17]

Love Emmitt I'd say top 50 for sure All time. Rice is one of the top 5 players I ever saw step on a field. Is what it is.

Randy Moss > Jerry Rice

 

[gjkoeppen]

Imo, rb is the toughest position to play in the nfl. 25-30 touches a game with almost all ending in being tackled. What emmitt accomplished was unbelievable. His game against the giants playing with a dislocated shoulder was one for the ages.

I will agree that the RB position may be the physically toughest position although both the offensive and defensive linemen have contact on every play, but most agree that the overall toughest position in all of sports is the QB. They have to have both physical talents and mental abilities. Most other players only need worry about what their responsibilities are and where they are to go but the QB has to know where every player is.
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[atlantacowboy]

Randy Moss > Jerry Rice

Nope. Not even close.

 

[gjkoeppen]

Won't ever deny Emmitt's credentials, but man when you go watch some video of Jim Brown......

This is true. Brown led the league in rushing all but one year of his career. That's 8 years out of 9. No other RB has come anywhere close to dominating the league like that. That being said, Emmitt is still the best because a RB's job is primarily running the ball and Emmitt has the most career yards.
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[jazzcat22]

Emmitt was the engine behind 3 Super Bowl wins and was MVP in 1 of those games.

He was NFL MVP in a year in which he missed the first 2 games. Dallas started 0-2. Emmitt ended his holdout and Dallas promptly went on to win their 2nd straight Super Bowl.

All-time records held by Emmitt:

- Career rush yds
- Career rush attempts
- Career rush TD (2nd-most total TD behind Rice)
- 1,000-yard rushing seasons
- 100-yard rushing games
- Rush TD in Super Bowls
- Rush yds in playoffs
- Rush TD in playoffs

Also consider that his all-time Rush yds (18,355) and Rush TD (164) records may NEVER be broken. Like, EVER.

Most Rush yds among active RB:

Frank Gore - 15,347
Adrian Peterson - 14,216
LeSean McCoy - 11,071

Most Rush TD among active RB:

Adrian Peterson - 111 (53 behind Emmitt)
Frank Gore - 79 (less than half of Emmitt’s total)
LeSean McCoy - 73

If there was a Tom Brady/Jerry Rice of running backs, it’d definitely be Emmitt.

There’s no other player in NFL history who has dominated his position’s all-time ranks like Emmitt has (not to mention has the championships to back them up)... and yet isn’t universally known as the GOAT of his position.

Part of that is because Emmitt played for the most hated team in the league.

Barry Sanders never won squat and holds exactly 0 all-time records, yet he gets more love than Emmitt almost universally. Barry was the GOAT of quitting on his team and turning a positive gain into a loss of 3, I’ll give him that.

Also Barry Sanders had 3 pro bowl / all pro OL. 2 before he got there, 1 after, and was a high draft pick.

Nate Newton said they were no body until Emmitt got there, and Emmitt made them pro bowl players.
But yet no one wants to talk about that. And no 1st round draft picks at OL.