The hybrid 4-3 we will be playing

[CowboyRoy]

This has been the most accurate assessment of what we will see schematically. Kudos to you sir.

Amazing how after one press conference where Quinn mentioned the 3-4 base all of a sudden everyone is an expert on our defense and EVERY player we picked is perfect for it and even 6 round picks will be starting.

 

[CowboyRoy]

What i would like them to do based on what Quinn and Other players say is run a 3-4 like so

run down:
DL:
LDE URBAN / Watson
0/1T Bohanna / Galimore
RDE DLAW / Golston
LB:
DPR Parsons
SMLB LVE
WMLB Smith
LEO Gregory

Passing downs
DL:
LDE DLAW
LDT Hill
RDT Odighizuwa
RDE Gregory
LB:
LB1 COX
LB2 Neal

Sorry, a 6th round pick is not starting at NT. That would be a miracle.

 

[75boyz]

Amazing how after one press conference where Quinn mentioned the 3-4 base all of a sudden everyone is an expert on our defense and EVERY player we picked is perfect for it and even 6 round picks will be starting.

So true. But it is a forum of experts on multiple topics.
Opinions optional or so I'm told.

 

[Cowboyny]

There are a lot of folks, still, who think we will be running a 3-4. There are a lot of folks, still, who think we're rid of the Tampa 43 that Marinelli used.

Simply put, the front that Seattle began to use in 2010 is the same front that Monte Kiffin used on Tony Dungy's Tampa 2, just on steriods.

Compared to the old Tampa 2 front, rather than having a DE, 3T, 1T and DE, you have a Leo, a 3T, a 1T and a big end. Or maybe you have a big end, a 3T, a 1T and a big end. Or maybe you have a Leo, a 3T, a 1T, and a 1 gapping big end.

It's not uncommon for the DC to switch out player roles on a game to game basis.

So what's a big end and what's a Leo? Big end is the end on the strong side of the formation. Leo is on the weak side. According to SI, an ideal two gapping big end is 280-295 pounds, 20 pounds lighter than a 3-4 DE. Leos can be regular 43 DEs, but because they are weak side, successful Leos can be lighter. And they can be hands in the dirt or 2 point stance, according to what they prefer.

The base therefore is a 4-3 under where 1/2 of the defense is using 3-4 techniques and the other half (the weak side half) is using 4-3 techniques.

But on a game to game basis, it doesn't have to be that.

In 2010, when they came up with this, they had to deal with Seattle's then horrible run defense. And it worked out of the box. If you want specific links, I can DM you my wikipedia draft..

D-

Excellent explanation.

 

[john van brocklin]

There are a lot of folks, still, who think we will be running a 3-4. There are a lot of folks, still, who think we're rid of the Tampa 43 that Marinelli used.

Simply put, the front that Seattle began to use in 2010 is the same front that Monte Kiffin used on Tony Dungy's Tampa 2, just on steriods.

Compared to the old Tampa 2 front, rather than having a DE, 3T, 1T and DE, you have a Leo, a 3T, a 1T and a big end. Or maybe you have a big end, a 3T, a 1T and a big end. Or maybe you have a Leo, a 3T, a 1T, and a 1 gapping big end.

It's not uncommon for the DC to switch out player roles on a game to game basis.

So what's a big end and what's a Leo? Big end is the end on the strong side of the formation. Leo is on the weak side. According to SI, an ideal two gapping big end is 280-295 pounds, 20 pounds lighter than a 3-4 DE. Leos can be regular 43 DEs, but because they are weak side, successful Leos can be lighter. And they can be hands in the dirt or 2 point stance, according to what they prefer.

The base therefore is a 4-3 under where 1/2 of the defense is using 3-4 techniques and the other half (the weak side half) is using 4-3 techniques.

But on a game to game basis, it doesn't have to be that.

In 2010, when they came up with this, they had to deal with Seattle's then horrible run defense. And it worked out of the box. If you want specific links, I can DM you my wikipedia draft..

D-

Cool

 

[817Gill]

Amazing how after one press conference where Quinn mentioned the 3-4 base all of a sudden everyone is an expert on our defense and EVERY player we picked is perfect for it and even 6 round picks will be starting.

What does my comment have to do with anything you said lol

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I don't think you will see Parsons at Sam. Parsons himself said he's going to be playing Mike / Will. Also if Parsons is playing Sam, that means he's coming off the field in passing situations. If you are teaching him all 3 lb positions in year 1, that's probably a bit overboard for any rookie. I'm guessing Jaylon will play Sam

Yeah I really think Jaylon is still going to be out there on passing downs. I guess it depends on how Parsons progresses....does seem a bit overboard to get him to learn all the positions and have to do it in a year where we want to contend.

 

[JBS]

Yeah I really think Jaylon is still going to be out there on passing downs. I guess it depends on how Parsons progresses....does seem a bit overboard to get him to learn all the positions and have to do it in a year where we want to contend.

If you put jaylon at Sam, you can use him downhill and minimize his reps in the pass game

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Sorry, a 6th round pick is not starting at NT. That would be a miracle.

So I've seen you say the a few times....I think you're issue you are having is that because this team has refused to address the position you think its hard to find a nose tackle in this league. The objective of a nose tackle is to get the center and guard to double him and take up two blockers. Its a unsexy position and its a position not valued by a lot of teams including the Cowboys in the past. But it is not hard to find these guys. Snacks Harrison wasn't even drafted. Dontari Poe in his prime would've been great. He was just cooked by the time he got here.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

If you put jaylon at Sam, you can use him downhill and minimize his reps in the pass game

I honestly think they want him in the past game. I've always belied this front office and coaching staff thinks far more highly of Jaylon than the fans do.

 

[CowboyRoy]

So I've seen you say the a few times....I think you're issue you are having is that because this team has refused to address the position you think its hard to find a nose tackle in this league. The objective of a nose tackle is to get the center and guard to double him and take up two blockers. Its a unsexy position and its a position not valued by a lot of teams including the Cowboys in the past. But it is not hard to find these guys. Snacks Harrison wasn't even drafted. Dontari Poe in his prime would've been great. He was just cooked by the time he got here.

My issue is how fans now come on here and make up excuses for every pick. They were all great, they will all work out, yada yada yada.

I would love for Bohanna to work out, but its not likely. Lets hope he does. But Im not coming on here and saying he will be starting. That's just ridiculous. If that happens its a miracle.

Why do I keep hearing about Snack Harrison? So some one in a hundred pickup means Bohanna will be like Snacks?

 

[dwmyers]

Amazing how after one press conference where Quinn mentioned the 3-4 base all of a sudden everyone is an expert on our defense and EVERY player we picked is perfect for it and even 6 round picks will be starting.

Some of us live in Atlanta and actually watched his defense play.

Dontari Poe in his prime would've been great.

Before the draft, Dontari Poe was the rare example of a 1 gapping 320+ lb DL. Probably should have been employed as a 3T.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Some of us live in Atlanta and actually watched his defense play.


Before the draft, Dontari Poe was the rare example of a 1 gapping 320+ lb DL. Probably should have been employed as a 3T.

Oh yah, that great Atlanta defense?

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

My issue is how fans now come on here and make up excuses for every pick. They were all great, they will all work out, yada yada yada.

I would love for Bohanna to work out, but its not likely. Lets hope he does. But Im not coming on here and saying he will be starting. That's just ridiculous. If that happens its a miracle.

Why do I keep hearing about Snack Harrison? So some one in a hundred pickup means Bohanna will be like Snacks?

I for one am not sitting here telling you Bohanna will be a good pick or if he will even start. I don't see that this year honestly. If he even make the team I'd consider that a plus.

Chances are out of all of these picks...probably 3 or 4 will stick. Hell if 3 or 4 stick that's a damn good draft.

But what I WILL say is that what Bohanna will be asked to do isn't some elite skill that no one can give. He doesn't need to be a 1st round talent. We need him to be serviceable.

And its not just Snack Harrison.

Shelby Harris who at one point was on the Cowboys practice squad was a 7th round pick.

DJ Reader a 5th round pick.

Grady Jarrett 5th round pick

Javon Hargrave 3rd round

Akiem Hicks 3rd round

These guys are found all over the draft.

 

[CATCH17]

There are a lot of folks, still, who think we will be running a 3-4. There are a lot of folks, still, who think we're rid of the Tampa 43 that Marinelli used.

Simply put, the front that Seattle began to use in 2010 is the same front that Monte Kiffin used on Tony Dungy's Tampa 2, just on steriods.

Compared to the old Tampa 2 front, rather than having a DE, 3T, 1T and DE, you have a Leo, a 3T, a 1T and a big end. Or maybe you have a big end, a 3T, a 1T and a big end. Or maybe you have a Leo, a 3T, a 1T, and a 1 gapping big end.

It's not uncommon for the DC to switch out player roles on a game to game basis.

So what's a big end and what's a Leo? Big end is the end on the strong side of the formation. Leo is on the weak side. According to SI, an ideal two gapping big end is 280-295 pounds, 20 pounds lighter than a 3-4 DE. Leos can be regular 43 DEs, but because they are weak side, successful Leos can be lighter. And they can be hands in the dirt or 2 point stance, according to what they prefer.

The base therefore is a 4-3 under where 1/2 of the defense is using 3-4 techniques and the other half (the weak side half) is using 4-3 techniques.

But on a game to game basis, it doesn't have to be that.

In 2010, when they came up with this, they had to deal with Seattle's then horrible run defense. And it worked out of the box. If you want specific links, I can DM you my wikipedia draft..

D-

It’s going to be a 4-3 under essentially don’t you think?

Edit: NvM I seen you commented on that.

Where do you see Parson in this defense???

 

[gimmesix]

What i would like them to do based on what Quinn and Other players say is run a 3-4 like so

run down:
DL:
LDE URBAN / Watson
0/1T Bohanna / Galimore
RDE DLAW / Golston
LB:
DPR Parsons
SMLB LVE
WMLB Smith
LEO Gregory

I believe our run-down defense will include one more big player, possibly Osa with Lawrence as the Leo. Unless we're playing a weak running team, I don't think we want to have two smaller ends out there in Gregory and Lawrence even if Lawrence is a good run defender. Gregory and Lawrence may alternate some, but I think only one of them will be on the field at a time on run downs while both will be out there in the nickel.

 

[dwmyers]

It’s going to be a 4-3 under essentially don’t you think?

Edit: NvM I seen you commented on that.

Where do you see Parson in this defense???

You need to maximize his potential. That's middle linebacker. He might not start there but he should end there.

There are three fronts that Seattle used last year, and those three are the 4-3 under, the 4-3 over and the Bear front. The Si article I quoted above said that Seattle did not
turn around its season until they started using the Bear against RPO teams.

 

[gimmesix]

I was thinking they put him there only for those pass rush chances,,or leave him there but you may be correct.

I know McCarthy and Quinn have specifically mentioned the SAM/LEO when talking of getting Parsons pass rush opportunities.

In any event, that is the type of thing that can be done differently with the personnel that Dallas has.

I could see them putting him at the Will and leaving Lawrence at left end instead of switching him to the right side. Then on early downs in the 3-4 "look," we'd be able to bring Parsons off the right side on run and pass blitzes (or even stunt him up the middle) with Lawrence coming off the left. Maybe Osa, Bohanna and Urban as the three "big" down linemen (although I think Lawrence will play with his hand in the dirt as well).

 

[gimmesix]

You need to maximize his potential. That's middle linebacker. He might not start there but he should end there.

There are three fronts that Seattle used last year, and those three are the 4-3 under, the 4-3 over and the Bear front. The Si article I quoted above said that Seattle did not
turn around its season until they started using the Bear against RPO teams.

I'd play him at the Will because he's more free to use his speed and run to the ball. I see him being the designated MLB in the nickel.

 

[AsthmaField]

I could see them putting him at the Will and leaving Lawrence at left end instead of switching him to the right side. Then on early downs in the 3-4 "look," we'd be able to bring Parsons off the right side on run and pass blitzes (or even stunt him up the middle) with Lawrence coming off the left. Maybe Osa, Bohanna and Urban as the three "big" down linemen (although I think Lawrence will play with his hand in the dirt as well).

So, are you saying that Parsons would be the LEO? Or in addition to the LEO (at WILL)?