2018: 23 years old; 4 years; 60 Million; 45 GTD

Whirlwin

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Yeah, I think after this year we could franchise him in 2020 and 2021. After that, with his workload, is a big contract the best thing for the team?
If he could get his mindset and his body at the same time. He could be one of the best ever if not the best. For me it's his Focus. There were times where he has taken the wrong angles there were times when he could have sprinted for a touchdown. Best running back after contact. But that seems to be already taken its toll. That's the life of a running back. Best running back in the league for me belongs to the Giants
 

buybuydandavis

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Sounds like an awesome investment. I can't use it or it'll break. But it'll look shiny out on the field in any case!

The NFL dresses their QBs in tutus. You protect your investment. You don't ride them like rented mules.
 

Ring Leader

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Why are you quoting an article that says "Sanders is believed to have had the most negative rushing yards in history" - he either does or he doesn't, this isn't an opinion - this is based on numbers. Does he or doesn't he?

The guy still averaged 5.0 YPC, you don't get that just by having a long run here and there. He was consistently moving the freakin' chains and, I will repeat, Barry didn't have the O-Line in the early to mid-90s Smith had.

And nothing here has shown that Zeke is turning "negative yards" into positive. Where are you getting that from? There is a difference between getting hit behind the line for negative yards, but still finding ways to turn negative into a positive, and already picking up positive yards and adding to it.

I haven't seen any stat that says Zeke was getting hit behind the line much or at any abnormal rate. I could be wrong, but I just haven't seen it.

The simple fact is, there are no RBs in the league right now that look like Sanders. Smith wasn't an elite runner, what made him elite was his legendary durability - in that regard, Frank Gore is becoming this generations Smith.

"Future" is right. Sanders also holds the all-time NFL record for the most carries for negative yardage. According to the NFL, Sanders is also the all-time leader in rushing yards lost by a running back with 1,114.

Think of it in baseball terms. Sometimes you just need a single to win a game, instead of striking out while swinging for the fences.

http://nflfilms.nfl.com/2012/11/26/tdif-barry-sanders-joins-payton/
 

Corso

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If he could get his mindset and his body at the same time. He could be one of the best ever if not the best. For me it's his Focus. There were times where he has taken the wrong angles there were times when he could have sprinted for a touchdown. Best running back after contact. But that seems to be already taken its toll. That's the life of a running back. Best running back in the league for me belongs to the Giants
Huh... sweet.
 

mattjames2010

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"Future" is right. Sanders also holds the all-time NFL record for the most carries for negative yardage. According to the NFL, Sanders is also the all-time leader in rushing yards lost by a running back with 1,114.

Think of it in baseball terms. Sometimes you just need a single to win a game, instead of striking out while swinging for the fences.

http://nflfilms.nfl.com/2012/11/26/tdif-barry-sanders-joins-payton/

Except, that's not what is really happening here. Your argument would need to be that he was getting long homerun runs every game - that's not exactly what was happening, now was it? Again, you don't end a career averaging 5.0 a carry if you're not putting up a ton of positive yards on the majority of carries.

And I will like to point out, that's still just a claim. There is no original source that you're linking me to.
 

mattjames2010

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Emmitt Smith played three years on his rookie contact and then got a big extension one year before the Salary Cap was implemented. I'd love to see someone say that was a mistake .

It's not the 90s.
 

mattjames2010

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Let me be clear You have your views, do not think for 1 second yours is the only one. Zeke had 2000 all purpose yards last season which was the most thus far in his career. You think it was a mistake taking him or extending him, fine. I don't sit around looking for your blessing. Most of the crap you spew is worthless. Hell there seems to be few things if any that you like.

Due to volume.
 

Hadenough

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Patterns in the modern NFL is not hard to notice - if you want to win a Super Bowl there are two ways to get there

1. Get a franchise QB, and those most often come in the first, second, and third rounds. Your chance of hitting on a top 5 QB comes with taking a QB within the top 15 on the draft

2. If you do not have a franchise QB, you need to rely on an elite defense to get you there

Building an elite defense in the modern era is much harder to do than finding a franchise QB due to FA ripping apart teams. IF you believe Dak is a franchise QB, you better hope the championship comes in 2019 or 2020, because his cap hit WILL impact the team and this will impact what we can do on the defensive side of the ball.

You can win a Super Bowl, and nearly every team that has won a championship since 2003 has one this without having a top 3 RB or WR on their team they are giving gigantic contracts to. It's unnecessary to do. Zeke should not get a big pay day and he certainly should not be paid like he's the best RB to ever step onto the freakin' field.

Dak, Zeke, or Coop - one of these guys have to go. Dak can't bring us a Super Bowl at his talent level, he doesn't elevate a team enough. So you need cap space to build an elite defense. It won't work, but since the front office is dead set on Dak, that is the route we must go.
Another problem with trying to build an elite defense is the rules have changed over the last 10 years. You can't hit players and be intimidating like years ago. Those elite defenses of years ago would beat up QBs.
 

mattjames2010

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Just bring back that underwear stealing guy!

Or Demarco Murray who had more single season rushing yards than Zeke has had...

Or Darren McFadden who would have equaled Zeke's 2018 total rushing yards if he had similar amount of carries in 2015...

That's really the problem with the RB position, isn't it? McFadden and Murray aren't near the talent level of Zeke, yet one surpassed him in single season rushing yards, and some washed up bust came in and got 1,000 yards in 10 games in 2015. The production from decent/good to great backs simply aren't that drastically different. It just is what it is.
 

Corso

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Or Demarco Murray who had more single season rushing yards than Zeke has had...

Or Darren McFadden who would have equaled Zeke's 2018 total rushing yards if he had similar amount of carries in 2015...

That's really the problem with the RB position, isn't it? McFadden and Murray aren't near the talent level of Zeke, yet one surpassed him in single season rushing yards, and some washed up bust came in and got 1,000 yards in 10 games in 2015. The production from decent/good to great backs simply aren't that drastically different. It just is what it is.
Oh my goodness! You type so forcefully!
Consider myself convinced.

Yay...

Maybe I should have bolded tha
t "Yay"...
 

ESisback

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If he could get his mindset and his body at the same time. He could be one of the best ever if not the best. For me it's his Focus. There were times where he has taken the wrong angles there were times when he could have sprinted for a touchdown. Best running back after contact. But that seems to be already taken its toll. That's the life of a running back. Best running back in the league for me belongs to the Giants

Yeah, Barkley. IMO, he’s today’s Barry Sanders.
 

Corso

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Yeah, Barkley. IMO, he’s today’s Barry Sanders.
He's a more forward moving version on Barry.
Barry danced and he was transcendant at it.
I have seen no player that has his here-we-go moment like him and then go through circus moves to get there like Barry.
And that's no dog on Barkley.
 

Toruk_Makto

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Let me be clear You have your views, do not think for 1 second yours is the only one. Zeke had 2000 all purpose yards last season which was the most thus far in his career. You think it was a mistake taking him or extending him, fine. I don't sit around looking for your blessing. Most of the crap you spew is worthless. Hell there seems to be few things if any that you like.
You're certainly entitled to your wrong opinion.

I like a lot of stuff. Discuss them here quite often. The difference is...is that i'm willing to take the correct unpopular decision where necessary.
 

Toruk_Makto

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The time to judge an extension for Zeke is when you have some idea of the numbers, amount guaranteed, etc. There are arguments to be made on both sides at that point. But this thread saying you don't resign him because he could get hurt is laughable. Its like saying you can't go to work in the morning because you might get in a car wreck on the way.
My argument isn't solely you don't invest in Zeke because he might get hurt. And you know that.

But to help:

1) RBs get hurt at much higher rates than other positions. Investing in them, therefore, is inherently more risky. When you have limited resources to allocate investing them in less risky resources seems like a smart thing to do.

2) RBs are fungible. Every single year we see a significant amount of lower-drafted and non-drafted guys be very productive. We have seen that happen here in recent years from Murray to Darrenn to Morris to Barber etc. We can fill Zeke's production more cheaply and reliably than we could for say Lawrence or Jones.

3) No other position is more dependent on the success and level of talent around them than the RB position. We have invested heavily in the resources that would surround a RB. It makes even less sense therefore for us to add more resources to the RB position.

To put it all together investing in a RB is stupid because they are risky from a health perspective, overly reliant on talent around them and can reliably be found cheaply.

But sure keep dumbing down my argument so that you can process it easily.
 

Corso

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My argument isn't solely you don't invest in Zeke because he might get hurt. And you know that.

But to help:

1) RBs get hurt at much higher rates than other positions. Investing in them, therefore, is inherently more risky. When you have limited resources to allocate investing them in less risky resources seems like a smart thing to do.

2) RBs are fungible. Every single year we see a significant amount of lower-drafted and non-drafted guys be very productive. We have seen that happen here in recent years from Murray to Darrenn to Morris to Barber etc. We can fill Zeke's production more cheaply and reliably than we could for say Lawrence or Jones.

3) No other position is more dependent on the success and level of talent around them than the RB position. We have invested heavily in the resources that would surround a RB. It makes even less sense therefore for us to add more resources to the RB position.

To put it all together investing in a RB is stupid because they are risky from a health perspective, overly reliant on talent around them and can reliably be found cheaply.

But sure keep dumbing down my argument so that you can process it easily.
Just bring back that undie stealing guy! Totally replace Murray!
 

Corso

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Yeah... goofy poops like to relate the tale of RB's can come and go.
This team tried that. Remember Randall? Remember Hambrick?
It didn't work.

They forgot.

They also don't learn. They're stubborn and that's...

I used to respect some posters more than I do now.
 
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