Jason Witten - now ranked 4th among TEs this season

ABQCOWBOY

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He probably ends up in the 60s-70s as far as receptions go, maybe 600-700 yards. I don't really consider that elite.

Ertz was elite level last year 116 for 1,163. Kelce was elite level last year 103-1,336. This year, Austin Hooper (46-526) and Darren Waller (44-485) are maybe playing on that level, Witten's level is top-10, which is not bad because he's still more productive than two-thirds of the starting TEs in the league, but it's not the great numbers he's put up in the past when he was the Ertz or Kelce of his time.

Philly doesn't have much in the way of WRs. You kinda have to take that into consideration as well. Ertz would never see that kind of production on a team that had Offensive fire power IMO. Don't get me wrong, it's a real accomplishment but I think that the numbers Ertz puts up aren't necessarily the mark of elite. That's just my opinion.
 

Mr_437

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So I guess this isn't a good place to discuss a trade for O.J. Howard?
 

gimmesix

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Philly doesn't have much in the way of WRs. You kinda have to take that into consideration as well. Ertz would never see that kind of production on a team that had Offensive fire power IMO. Don't get me wrong, it's a real accomplishment but I think that the numbers Ertz puts up aren't necessarily the mark of elite. That's just my opinion.

In some ways, though, that makes the accomplishment more difficult. If you are the main receiving threat, then teams are going to try to take you out of the game.
 

Scotman

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I love Witten. He was the first "pet cat" I ever had in the draft. I was screaming when we didn't pick him up in the second....beside myself when we did in the third.

All that said, I thought he was done. I don't know how much gas is in the tank, but enough for 7 games so far.
 

Chuck 54

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https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/te/2019

On a DYAR basis, Jason Witten is ranked as the #4 TE so far this season.

Long story short, don't doubt the all-time greats. If he keeps this up, he easily has another season or two to go.


Tight ends are ranked according to DYAR, or Defense-adjusted Yards Above Replacement. This gives the value of the performance on plays where this TE caught the ball, compared to a replacement-level TE in the same game situations and then translated into yardage. DYAR (and its cousin, YAR, which isn't adjusted based on opponent) is further explained here.
Love Jason, but wouldn’t his DYAR be lower if we actually had a top quality TE who was athletic and effective?
 

Doomsday101

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Uhhh not what I said, but cry as you wish.

Jason Garret sucks. The team wins in spite of him and loses because of him. I will say that now, I will say that if they win the Super Bowl. He's bad and you can't read.

That is your view, I think it is a load of crap. I have never let him off the hook for any loses but this whinny crap of oh he has nothing to do with winning but when we lose it is all him. Your a joke
 

charron

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He has drops?


Before the eagles game he was catching about 71% 12 yards a catch VS Witten 86% 10.5 yards a catch. Both are good numbers by themselves but with so many guys dropping passes we need every catch. He had at least 1 drop the prior week, as he caught 2 of 4 passes for 6 yards.
 

smitty313

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Not to bash Wit, I love the guy and think he's an all time great Cowboy who is a sure fire lock for the HOF. And I'm not saying anything about playing Jarwin over him or anything like that, but I'm curious, he's 4th in what exactly? IMHO, he's been ok, not great and maybe just barely considered good compared to some other TE's around the league this year.

According to NFL stats he's:

8th in receptions- 26 (#1 has 46)
10th in total yds- 263 (#1 has 541)
12th yds/gm- 37.6 (#1 has 85.7)
T7 for TD's- 2 (#1- 2 guys with 4)
20th for longest rec- 33yds (#1- 75yds)
T24th for 20+yds rec- 2 (#1 has 10)
11 TE's have a fumble (he's 1)

And FYI, in my fantasy league he's the 11th ranked TE with 53.53 pts. (#1 has 108.07pts)

Hey don't get me wrong those numbers certainly aren't bad for a guy his age especially after missing an entire year.

Don't attack me cause you love Witten and want to act like I don't. I'm just pointing out that he may not be having as great a year as some of ya'll maybe thinking he is.
An ok/good year sure, but nothing special so far. I hope he lights it up and catches another 75 balls for 600yds with 15 TD's, but I doubt that will be the case.

This. It takes some creative accounting to claim Witten is the 4th best TE this yr
 

TheMarathonContinues

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Before the eagles game he was catching about 71% 12 yards a catch VS Witten 86% 10.5 yards a catch. Both are good numbers by themselves but with so many guys dropping passes we need every catch. He had at least 1 drop the prior week, as he caught 2 of 4 passes for 6 yards.
Yeah but Witten got a lot more targets his way than Jarwin.
 

charron

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Yeah but Witten got a lot more targets his way than Jarwin.


Because coaches trust him. Dak trusts him. It's really not much more honestly. 26 catches VS 11. We don't throw heavy to that position.

That TD catch last week was perfectly setup by Moore. Witten motions to the left drawing defenders while Jarwin quickly hits the end one to the right at the snap.
 

smitty313

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Sometimes Football Outsiders is the absolute worst thing in the world.

That metric has Evan Engram ranked 41 out of 42. Are we really going to sit here and say that there are 40 better receiving TEs and that he's a sub-replacement-level player, by 50 yards? That thought is just...LMAO

Totally stupid metric, especially with such a small sample size.
Their rankings are a joke, they have Kelce at #8
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Witten's Snap %:

1 - 66
2 - 77
3 - 51
4 - 79
5 - 83
6 - 88
7 - 76

Witten's snaps is directly aligned with the team's worst offensive performances. Those are also the games where JG got in the way of Moore.

I don't really care who is the starter but that lack of balance is absurd. Jarwin down the seam can kill teams. Witten catching 6-yard passes on third and 5 with an impossibly slim margin of error will bite you eventually. Witten shouldn't be a real part of the passing game - in place of Jarwin - other than third-and-short and inside the 10.
those are also the games that Dak was getting pummeled and we needed better pass blocking to protect Dak...specially the Jets game were both tackles were out. and the difference is really 5 or 6 snaps per game..... which is a call made by OC based on how the game is going.. but hey, using stats make it look better :)
 

LACowboysFan1

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Does your eyes not tell you the same?

On the slower, sure, no doubt.

But on what basis would anyone say Jarwin is better? Because he had the 3 td game? One game doesn't prove anything. Better blocker? Maybe. Better hands? No, Witten has great hands. Team leader? Hardly. Route runner? Guess not, else he'd have more receptions.

Does anybody really believe they would bring Witt back just for sentiment's sake?

Even JJ's not that stupid...
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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What do you mean how is it quantified? That's the percentage of offensive snaps.

The thing about facing pressure is theoretical. It made no difference against the Jets or Saints, and hasn't in years. You beat the pressure by hitting big plays, and Witten doesn't do that, relative to Jarwin. Any TE in the league can run three yards and turn around on a hot.

Sample size is too small for YPC to matter. Jarwin has three catches of over 20 yards, Witten has 2, but one was that dumb catch and run against. Witten presents no danger beyond 12 yards or so.

Again, I don't care who starts, and yes, context of the game matters. But I don't see a scenario where it makes sense for Witten to be playing 88% of the snaps when you're down by 21 in the first quarter. It means you're throwing constantly, and choosing to put in a less dangerous receiver. That's part of the whole JG influence that is problematic. It's the idea of designing an offense designed to get 5 yards instead of explosive plays.
the thing about facing pressure is not theoretical. its real. did you watch the saints game? or the Jets game? in the Jets game we were missing two starting tackles...so how else are you going to protect the QB? with Jarwin!?

and I am not against using Jarwin, I like to see more double TE sets and perhaps Jarwin in obvious passing situations (long 3rd downs). but Jarwin is far from a complete player. he is still learning the nuences of being a TE...

btw, Jason witten has had two catches of over 20 and one for 18 (ok, almost 20)…..
 
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