Recap: Newton/Holley: Scarred by 10 Years of Bad Coaching

Kaiser said:

The Sig Line bet is also that Garrett will have a HC job next year and most people here said he wouldn't work in the NFL ever again.

You are the guy that said Garrett should have been fired after the 2015 season where the team went 13-3 and he won Coach of the Year. An objective person wouldn't say that is me "defending a clown", they would say that is you being "borderline psychotic".

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Kaiser, We were 13-3 in 2016. We were 4-12 in 2015. But that's neither here nor there... To this day, I still believe Garrett should have never been "given" the Head Coaching job to begin with. I said that the first year he went 8-8 all the way up to when he didn't get signed. He only had 4 winning seasons and I'm still convinced the winning seasons were inspite of him being head coach.... IMHO I don't think he was ever respected by the team ever since he threw Wade Phillips under the bus...

Am I being a Wade Phillips apologist? Not by any means. I think he needed to be gone too but not the way JG did it. I will say Wade Phillips is an elite defensive coordinator. I think he's exactly where he belongs... I would even go as far as to say I wouldn't mind him being our DC...He just didn't have the IT factor for being a head coach...

stasheroo said:

Really? I seem to remember a 4-12 record in 2015, when Romo wasn't there to bail him out, Garrett was exposed for the fraud he is...

Let me guess, this is yet the latest thing you've gotten totally wrong?

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I'll post the examples when I get back tonight. And the post of you saying Garrett should have been fired after a 13-3 record, nice deflection on Romo injury.

Qcard said:

Listen to Nate Newton (3 Time Superbowl Winning Guard) and Jesse Holley (Former Cowboy and Tarheel) @ 34 min mark talk about how we've been scarred by bad coaching over the last 10 years and how it affects our personal opinions as to how we build a Championship team...

#cowboyszone: Hangin' with the Boys: It's Not Marine Biology https://www.dallascowboys.com/audio/hangin-with-the-boys-it-s-not-marine-biology

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We may not have been as successful as we'd like over those 10 years but, Boy! We suuuuurrrre did look good coming out of the tunnel in our Sunday duds!

Qcard said:

Listen to Nate Newton (3 Time Superbowl Winning Guard) and Jesse Holley (Former Cowboy and Tarheel) @ 34 min mark talk about how we've been scarred by bad coaching over the last 10 years and how it affects our personal opinions as to how we build a Championship team...

#cowboyszone: Hangin' with the Boys: It's Not Marine Biology https://www.dallascowboys.com/audio/hangin-with-the-boys-it-s-not-marine-biology

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I like this post and that you took the time to list it. Look, I've been banging the drum on our horrendous coaching on this forum probably more than anyone, in fact, I have been the one blamming coaching limitations on why Dak hasn't lived up to some forum members expectations. I believe the coaching has been non cohesive for 10 years and cost many great players their careers. To me this is fact, and until we see some good coaches build this team properly we can't evaluate our players whatsoever. I think with Big Mike taking the reigns things should be much much better.

stasheroo said:

There's an easy way for you to "let him go" if that's what you feel the need to do.

Plenty of other threads where something else is being discussed.

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No, there really isn't. Need some more Prescott threads.

CowboyFanInLexKy said:

Kaiser, We were 13-3 in 2016. We were 4-12 in 2015. But that's neither here nor there... To this day, I still believe Garrett should have never been "given" the Head Coaching job to begin with. I said that the first year he went 8-8 all the way up to when he didn't get signed. He only had 4 winning seasons and I'm still convinced the winning seasons were inspite of him being head coach.... IMHO I don't think he was ever respected by the team ever since he threw Wade Phillips under the bus...

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Thanks for the typo catch, I edited it now. There has never been anything to back up the idea of Garrett undermining Wade except for malcontents like TO and Jason Hatcher making comments. Garrett was hired as OC with the idea from the start that he was to HC eventually, Wade was always a placeholder.

Kaiser said:

I'll post the examples when I get back tonight. And the post of you saying Garrett should have been fired after a 13-3 record, nice deflection on Romo injury.

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No deflection whatsoever. Just the latest thing you're wrong about. They went 4-12 in the 2015 season you referred to, not 13-3. Get your own house in order before you expect it of anyone else.

Kaiser said:

So who are they?

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Kaiser, I don't pay that much attention because I don't care. Why is it important to you to know who was still supporting Garrett?

Bad coaching definitely held us back the past decade. We never got the most out of the talent we had having an inexperienced HC going through on the job training.

Kaiser said:

Thanks for the typo catch, I edited it now. There has never been anything to back up the idea of Garrett undermining Wade except for malcontents like TO and Jason Hatcher making comments. Garrett was hired as OC with the idea from the start that he was to HC eventually, Wade was always a placeholder.

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And the idea was always a terribly flawed one. That's the problem.

Kaiser said:

Thanks for the typo catch, I edited it now. There has never been anything to back up the idea of Garrett undermining Wade except for malcontents like TO and Jason Hatcher making comments. Garrett was hired as OC with the idea from the start that he was to HC eventually, Wade was always a placeholder.

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Agree. That was the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

kskboys said:

Kaiser, I don't pay that much attention because I don't care. Why is it important to you to know who was still supporting Garrett?

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Because he's near the front of that line and needs company.

CouchCoach said:

No, there really isn't. Need some more Prescott threads.

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A whole page full of 'em.

Kaiser said:

Just like that sniveling wuss Bill Parcells. Nothing but Yes Men for Jerry, you nailed it.

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We were talking about Garrett. And Jerry didn’t want Parcells, he wanted a new stadium. Jeez, try to keep up.

it's not been just the Coaching ...Management has had a played hand in some of the past failures ...and set backs too.

- WR Roy Williams (2008) .for a 1st and 3rd ? …….. set us back for years in top draft picks investment... (and thank goodness miles Austin emerged just in time)

- 2009 draft class (traded out of 1st/2nd rounds) … (3rd Jason Williams, western Illnois, ..3rd Robert Brewster ball state,4th QB Stephen McGee texaAM,....4th OLB Victor Butler oregon state, ..4th rd. Brandon Williams Texas tech …5th round DeAngelo Smith DB...... 5th rd. S Michael Hamlin Clemson …5th rd. K David buechler USC…6th rd LB Stephen hodge …6th john phillip TE ..7th rd. mike Mickens DB

- Considering what we passed over in favor of the Taco draft class (ala TJ Watt).. and reaching for a DE just for the sake of having a Marinelli type DE - that set us back for years

- and it could have been even much worse if Jerry had it his full way (ala QB Johnny Manziel) …

- we had to improve past record Day 3 draft class, ..

- we’ve got some huge franchise-changing big breaks - ala Dak vs QBs Payton Lynch/Conner Cook, .. Jaylon Smith vs DE’s Kevon Dodd/Emmanuel Ogbah ……and WR Amari Cooper trade
vs WR Sammy Watkins FA signing,…

- the re-signing of Twill (WR Terrence Williams) for 4 more years was ridiculous.. (and he's still avaliable on the streets last heard of) a JAG wide out.

- we've had (still have ?) our issues with backup QB depth here - Brad Johnson, Matt Cassell, kyle orton, and still huge questions -

- This comes hand in hand with coaching issues too, but I always say that we tend to wait until we have to hit a reality brick wall, before we finally decide to address a dire position
(backup QB per Dak, ..a declining OL,(youth movement) .. sean Lee replacement, ..... much.better RB than Rod Smith.. etc.

Turnover ratios are the biggest indicator of wins and losses. You win the turnover game and odds are overwhelming, you win the game. Nolan will improve Dallas immensely in that department.
Good luck w/Marinelli Raiders.

They ain't lying. Holley also said the Cowboys will be in the SB in 2020

DeathMonkey said:

I think part of his the problem is the same mistake you see in a lot of old coaches posters. They stubbornly stick to their own systems opinions that the rest of the NFL forum has evolved beyond...

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FIFY

quickccc said:

it's not been just the Coaching ...Management has had a played hand in some of the past failures ...and set backs too.

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That ties in somewhat with the coaching side.

Garrett was selected as coach and remained coach because Jones knew there would be no push back from Garrett for really.. anything Jerry ever did.

He was inexperienced and not ready for a coordinator position at the time, not to mention being a head coach.

An experienced head coach whose position would be judged by his results and not by how much he could be embarrassed by the owner without quitting, would have stood his ground on a lot of issues and either forced Jerry to change somewhat or would have been fired.

Garrett however did allow the Jones to run roughshod over him in a litany of embarrassing ways and was happy to allow it as it kept him on the sidelines (and made him rich).

We couldn't assemble a staff to save our lives with this setup, who was going to tie their career to this mess? The only decent ones we may have had bailed as soon as possible.

I personally did not have any problem with guys liking Garrett and wanting him to stay. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

What i did not like was years and years of nonsense where people complaining about our coaching had to listen to the constant something is good=Garrett and something is bad=Jerry.

For years we heard how Garrett was changing everything; the drafting (RKGs etc..), the offense (throw 40 times way ahead in a playoff game you're damn right it was the thing to do) , the defense (we were told he was going to be stop calling plays so he could use his 'unique organizational skills' to help the defense), he was reeling in Jerry and had his ear etc etc.. it was all nonsense yet it was repeated to us ad nauseam for years.

Anybody who has been here for the entire Garrett tenure can remember all the stuff that was said in defense of this moron, (Khalidi has a great memory he remembers it all ), guys were being put down all the time for daring to question the genius of Garrett.

Some posters here, as Stash has been saying, defended this guy blindly for years despite all evidence to the contrary, it was one of the weirdest dynamics in this boards history.

stasheroo said:

No deflection whatsoever. Just the latest thing you're wrong about. They went 4-12 in the 2015 season you referred to, not 13-3. Get your own house in order before you expect it of anyone else.

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It was a typo and you have made a bunch of them. The truth is you said Garrett should have been fired after the 13-3 season when he won Coach of the Year. That's proof its not about football with you, its about personal issues.