Jaylon Smith is a major key in turning around this defense

Cowboyny · May 9, 2020

xwalker said:
Both are good in 2018 and then magically become bad players in 2019...I have some Ocean Front property in Kansas that I'll sell at a good price...

It is unfortunate that fans can't spend a few minutes actually reviewing game footage. Instead fans/media just make up things in their mind that seem plausible to them but often have no basis in reality.

The scheme was bad. The Rams exposed the scheme in the 2018 playoff game and other teams just copied that approach.

A 250 pound LB moving sideways is generally going to lose when a 320 pound OL that is unimpeded by any Defensive Linemen is out in space between the LB and the RB.

Either the DL scheme/assignments have to change or the LBs have to start guessing trying to avoid getting boxed out by OLinemen.

Marinelli would not change the DL.

The sad part is that Belichick ran a similar 4-3 in 2018 and tweaked it for the Super Bowl vs the Rams and shut down their running game that had gashed the Cowboys. The blueprint was right there on film but Marinelli refused to budge.

-So you are saying the dip in our LB's production was more about scheme and coaching. That other teams copied what the Rams did in the playoffs where Marinelli refused to change. That is discouraging and wonder why he kept his job for so long. Having multiple defensive coaches was a disaster, they seem to be never on the same page together.

-Where do you envision Jaylon playing next season? Do you believe the new coaching staff will indeed remove him from the MLB position? I've heard that he's not a candidate for the strong-side/designated pass rusher Hybrid role. It sounds like he will be moving to the weak-side. In your own assessment, what weaknesses do you see with Jaylon Smith, what are his strengths?

Kolemmitt · May 9, 2020

InTheZone said:
I like Smth, but whatever position he plays if he's going to be the Greg Ellis of 3-4 outside linebackers I don't think we need to be keeping him on the team any longer. If he still plays light on his feet and can't actually maneuver around a block he might not make it past preseason under MM.

I agree that he will not be good as traditional 3-4 outside linebacker, luckily they are not going to use him a traditional 3-4 outside lb.

Kolemmitt · May 9, 2020

xwalker said:
Both are good in 2018 and then magically become bad players in 2019...I have some Ocean Front property in Kansas that I'll sell at a good price...

It is unfortunate that fans can't spend a few minutes actually reviewing game footage. Instead fans/media just make up things in their mind that seem plausible to them but often have no basis in reality.

The scheme was bad. The Rams exposed the scheme in the 2018 playoff game and other teams just copied that approach.

A 250 pound LB moving sideways is generally going to lose when a 320 pound OL that is unimpeded by any Defensive Linemen is out in space between the LB and the RB.

Either the DL scheme/assignments have to change or the LBs have to start guessing trying to avoid getting boxed out by OLinemen.

Marinelli would not change the DL.

The sad part is that Belichick ran a similar 4-3 in 2018 and tweaked it for the Super Bowl vs the Rams and shut down their running game that had gashed the Cowboys. The blueprint was right there on film but Marinelli refused to budge.

Thank you!!! Very true. I knew were going to be in trouble, because the Rams put out the blueprint, the league copied, and that old staff was averse to adapting.

I have not gone back and watch the Indy game from 2018, but I am assuming they followed a very similar gameplan to what the Rams did a few weeks later.

InTheZone · May 9, 2020

Kolemmitt said:
I agree that he will not be good as traditional 3-4 outside linebacker, luckily they are not going to use him a traditional 3-4 outside lb.

sorry, was trying to say greg was not a good fit as a 3-4 OLB, just as smith isn't a good fit for MLB and if he plays "average" at other positions then we don't need to be keeping him around.

CalPolyTechnique · May 9, 2020

The Cowboys ran the same scheme in 2018 that they did 2019. So the argument from incredulity “it cant be the players because they were good the year prior (2018)” is self-defeating. You can’t speak to how great LVE and Jaylon were in 2018 and then turn around and blame the same scheme in 2019.

LVE had a neck issue last year that limited his ability to play linebacker. His agent said he was effectively playing with one arm. He went from a missed tackle rate of just 6.7% in 2018 to 15.3% in 2019.

What was Jaylon’s excuse?

I hate to break the news to people but there is no defensive scheme in football that allows your linebackers to run completely free and clean 100% of the time. Your linebackers will have to take on blocks at times to disrupt running lanes and allow their teammates to cleanup.

So while Nolan’s defense may help the linebackers (we’ll see) it’s not the panacea for Jaylon’s shortcomings. He will have to take on blocks; he will have to make tackles on ball carriers coming at him in space; he will have coverage duties at times.

Redball Express · May 9, 2020

Cowboyny said:
Many will argue that Jaylon Smith production took a major hit last season. The novice fans who watched the games would see:

-Jaylon struggling against the run. Had a very difficult time disengaging from blocks.
-Was exposed somewhat in pass coverage
-Probably his best attribute was as an inside blitzer.
-Certainly didn't help losing LVE, along with assistant coaches fighting over how to use him.
-Clearly still has some physical limitations
-Doesn't possess elite instincts at the position
-Possesses elite athletic attributes, tremendous short area burst and straightline speed.

In my opinion, Jaylon Smith has been miscast playing the Middle Linebacker position. He clearly is a run and hit type of linebacker, not the type who can consistently take on oncoming blockers in the run game. The new staff needs to put him into better positions to succeed, need to have him play more to his strengths. Mike Nolan last stop was as a LB Coach, it's up to him to figure out how to best use Jaylon. If Jaylon can return to 2019 form, it will be a major key in turning around this defense.

I guess I am unclear on your post..

it was recently announced he was being moved from MLB to OLB.

Are you just agreeing here?

What interests me is the imbalance of the loyalty to the player.

Had a fabulous college career, was probably a top 3 pick in the draft before his injury. We all know his deal.

Yet fans dog him becuz he is not the player he could have been.

Then he makes the Pro Bowl as an alternate in 2019 and still..

grumbles are heard.

I think he has overachieved by any stretch of the imagination and do not understand.

What I have seen is he he runs better to his right than his left, better forwards than backwards becuz of his injuries.

But by moving him to outside LBer, the defense will be better becuz it better streamlines his liabilities by doing so.

He is a tremendous leader on a defense that up until this year has had little.

There is little doubt losing Wolf Hunter hurt Smith. It hurt the entire defense after 2018.

So I think you are being positive but not sure. I think you are praising the player AND the coaches here but I just am not sure how you end your post.

You happy or critical? Both?

Cowboyny · May 9, 2020

Redball Express said:
I guess I am unclear on your post..

it was recently announced he was being moved from MLB to OLB.

Are you just agreeing here?

What interests me is the imbalance of the loyalty to the player.

Had a fabulous college career, was probably a top 3 pick in the draft before his injury. We all know his deal.

Yet fans dog him becuz he is not the player he could have been.

Then he makes the Pro Bowl as an alternate in 2019 and still..

grumbles are heard.

I think he has overachieved by any stretch of the imagination and do not understand.

What I have seen is he he runs better to his right than his left, better forwards than backwards becuz of his injuries.

But by moving him to outside LBer, the defense will be better becuz it better streamlines his liabilities by doing so.

He is a tremendous leader on a defense that up until this year has had little.

There is little doubt losing Wolf Hunter hurt Smith. It hurt the entire defense after 2018.

So I think you are being positive but not sure. I think you are praising the player AND the coaches here but I just am not sure how you end your post.

You happy or critical? Both?

-I'm giving an honest opinion about Jaylon Smith.
-My point is I believe the new staff has to play him more to his strengths.
-He didn't play on a pro bowl level last season, matter of fact nobody within the defense did.
-We have seen flashes of excellent play, same goes with Lve, they are key proponents of turning around this defense.

buybuydandavis · May 9, 2020

Cowboyny said:
Many will argue that Jaylon Smith production took a major hit last season. The novice fans who watched the games would see:

-Jaylon struggling against the run. Had a very difficult time disengaging from blocks.
-Was exposed somewhat in pass coverage
-Probably his best attribute was as an inside blitzer.
-Certainly didn't help losing LVE, along with assistant coaches fighting over how to use him.
-Clearly still has some physical limitations
-Doesn't possess elite instincts at the position
-Possesses elite athletic attributes, tremendous short area burst and straightline speed.

In my opinion, Jaylon Smith has been miscast playing the Middle Linebacker position. He clearly is a run and hit type of linebacker, not the type who can consistently take on oncoming blockers in the run game. The new staff needs to put him into better positions to succeed, need to have him play more to his strengths. Mike Nolan last stop was as a LB Coach, it's up to him to figure out how to best use Jaylon. If Jaylon can return to 2019 form, it will be a major key in turning around this defense.

Jaylon was miscast at MLB, but I wouldn't pin your hopes for success on Jaylon. He looked a little off at the beginning of last year, and worse and worse as the year went on.

Watch Jaylon get completely stonewalled by the first heavy bag of the Gridiron Gauntlet Pro Bowl 2020 - You actually have to push 3 bags and he couldn't push 1. Goto 43 seconds and play on slow mo.

Jaylon ain't right.

Redball Express · May 9, 2020

Cowboyny said:
-I'm giving an honest opinion about Jaylon Smith.
-My point is I believe the new staff has to play him more to his strengths.
-He didn't play on a pro bowl level last season, matter of fact nobody within the defense did.
-We have seen flashes of excellent play, same goes with Lve, they are key proponents of turning around this defense.

Ok..

So we pretty much agree. Some people seem to be of the belief he is too cocky or something.

He comes off confident with his 'clear-eyed view's stuff bit I think he has done an amazing job with his situation.

Had he have been healthy in the Draft, we would never have sniffed him and his new contract would have been unaffordable.

I wish Dak was half as grateful as Smith for what Dallas has done for Dak.

But no can do. Dak sees himself as too self-important.

FuzzyLumpkins · May 9, 2020

Cowboyny said:
Many will argue that Jaylon Smith production took a major hit last season. The novice fans who watched the games would see:

-Jaylon struggling against the run. Had a very difficult time disengaging from blocks.
-Was exposed somewhat in pass coverage
-Probably his best attribute was as an inside blitzer.
-Certainly didn't help losing LVE, along with assistant coaches fighting over how to use him.
-Clearly still has some physical limitations
-Doesn't possess elite instincts at the position
-Possesses elite athletic attributes, tremendous short area burst and straightline speed.

In my opinion, Jaylon Smith has been miscast playing the Middle Linebacker position. He clearly is a run and hit type of linebacker, not the type who can consistently take on oncoming blockers in the run game. The new staff needs to put him into better positions to succeed, need to have him play more to his strengths. Mike Nolan last stop was as a LB Coach, it's up to him to figure out how to best use Jaylon. If Jaylon can return to 2019 form, it will be a major key in turning around this defense.

People who know my history know that I have been a Jaylon supporter for years. I was hugely disappointed in him last season.

He started ducking as opposed to taking on blocks. He would dodge traffic and run behind piles like a DB.

I don't see physical limitations. What I see is a heart and determination limitation. And then he would get on twitter and campaign for pro bowl votes. That really pissed me off.

xwalker · May 9, 2020

Kolemmitt said:
Thank you!!! Very true. I knew were going to be in trouble, because the Rams put out the blueprint, the league copied, and that old staff was averse to adapting.

I have not gone back and watch the Indy game from 2018, but I am assuming they followed a very similar gameplan to what the Rams did a few weeks later.

Yes, it really started with Indy exposing the problem.

The Rams (and Colts) realized there was a very simple problem with the Cowboys DL scheme.
- On run plays (especially outside zone run) that started to the side where the 1tech DT was aligned, the Marinelli scheme had a huge flaw.

Notice how on a run outside the LT that in alignment 1, both the front-side and back-side DT is 1 gap farther from the LT than in alignment 2.

On the outside zone run, the RB has the option to stay outside, cut back just inside the LT or cut back behind the 1tech DT
- If the 1T moves quickly outside, the RB will cut back behind him. The 1T runs himself out of the play and it's easy to get an extra OL out to block a LB
- It becomes easy for the RB to "read" the 1T and the 2 LBs. He just has to read inside or outside.
- There will be 2 OL out to block LBs. The RB get needs to go the the side of the block(s) opposite of the LB.
- If the RB reads 1 of 3 correctly, he likely gets a couple of yards.
- If he reads 2 or 3 correctly, he likely gets a good gain.
- If he reads all 3 correctly then he is likely celebrating a TD.

Belichick made an adjustment and moved the OLB to the outside and up.
- The DE on that side then played the gap inside the OT if it was a run play.
- Now the Rams can't cut off the OLB from moving horizontally because he is already outside.

Alignment 1 (Backside DT is 3T, Front-side DT is 1tech)
..........RT.....RG.....OC.....LG.....LT.....
LDE........3T................1T................RDE
...........LB..........................LB....................

Alignment 2 (Backside DT is 1T, Front-side Dt is 3tech)
..........RT.....RG.....OC.....LG.....LT.....
LDE....................1T...............3T..........RDE
...........LB..........................LB....................

Belichick's version of 4-2-5 vs Rams in the Super Bowl
..........RT.....RG.....OC.....LG.....LT.....
LDE........3T................1T................RDE.............OLB
...............................MLB...........................

davidariust24 · May 9, 2020

Cowboyny said:
Many will argue that Jaylon Smith production took a major hit last season. The novice fans who watched the games would see:

-Jaylon struggling against the run. Had a very difficult time disengaging from blocks.
-Was exposed somewhat in pass coverage
-Probably his best attribute was as an inside blitzer.
-Certainly didn't help losing LVE, along with assistant coaches fighting over how to use him.
-Clearly still has some physical limitations
-Doesn't possess elite instincts at the position
-Possesses elite athletic attributes, tremendous short area burst and straightline speed.

In my opinion, Jaylon Smith has been miscast playing the Middle Linebacker position. He clearly is a run and hit type of linebacker, not the type who can consistently take on oncoming blockers in the run game. The new staff needs to put him into better positions to succeed, need to have him play more to his strengths. Mike Nolan last stop was as a LB Coach, it's up to him to figure out how to best use Jaylon. If Jaylon can return to 2019 form, it will be a major key in turning around this defense.

I think he had a slump last year because he wasn't a surprise anymore. He will be much better next season. With that said I do think LVE is more of a natural Mike LB. I'd put LVE at the MIKE and let Jaylon play the WILL. I really feel Jaylon is going to have a great season this year if the season happens.

jwooten15 · May 10, 2020

xwalker said:
Yes, it really started with Indy exposing the problem.

The Rams (and Colts) realized there was a very simple problem with the Cowboys DL scheme.
- On run plays (especially outside zone run) that started to the side where the 1tech DT was aligned, the Marinelli scheme had a huge flaw.

Notice how on a run outside the LT that in alignment 1, both the front-side and back-side DT is 1 gap farther from the LT than in alignment 2.

On the outside zone run, the RB has the option to stay outside, cut back just inside the LT or cut back behind the 1tech DT
- If the 1T moves quickly outside, the RB will cut back behind him. The 1T runs himself out of the play and it's easy to get an extra OL out to block a LB
- It becomes easy for the RB to "read" the 1T and the 2 LBs. He just has to read inside or outside.
- There will be 2 OL out to block LBs. The RB get needs to go the the side of the block(s) opposite of the LB.
- If the RB reads 1 of 3 correctly, he likely gets a couple of yards.
- If he reads 2 or 3 correctly, he likely gets a good gain.
- If he reads all 3 correctly then he is likely celebrating a TD.

Belichick made an adjustment and moved the OLB to the outside and up.
- The DE on that side then played the gap inside the OT if it was a run play.
- Now the Rams can't cut off the OLB from moving horizontally because he is already outside.

Alignment 1 (Backside DT is 3T, Front-side DT is 1tech)
..........RT.....RG.....OC.....LG.....LT.....
LDE........3T................1T................RDE
...........LB..........................LB....................

Alignment 2 (Backside DT is 1T, Front-side Dt is 3tech)
..........RT.....RG.....OC.....LG.....LT.....
LDE....................1T...............3T..........RDE
...........LB..........................LB....................

Belichick's version of 4-2-5 vs Rams in the Super Bowl
..........RT.....RG.....OC.....LG.....LT.....
LDE........3T................1T................RDE.............OLB
...............................MLB...........................

I always appreciate your breakdowns. Thanks man

BIGDen · May 10, 2020

ondaedg said:
Personally I'm not sure he actually regressed as much as our opponents watched a little game film and saw several weaknesses to his game. For example his inability to engage with a blocker and still make a tackle. Jaylon tries to go around the blocker or starts back pedalling allowing the blocker to launch him out of the play with one arm. Or his inability to read the play quickly. Can't tell you how many times he was frozen by play action or just was way too late getting to the ball carrier or covering the screen. He has glaring weaknesses that weren't known in 2018.

Now what to do with him is a different story. Hoping Nolan has an answer.

This is 100% correct. His flaws are enormous and very significant for a LB. LBs NEED to be able to quickly diagnose a play, disengage from blockers, and change direction. He does all of those things poorly. Stupid draft choice and even dumber contract extension.

pitt33 · May 10, 2020

CATCH17 said:
I just want Jaylon running sideways and downhill.

Him doing anything else is putting us at a disadvantage defensively.

This really says it all.

He is what he is after that devastating injury.

It’s a miracle he’s even playing.

fivetwos · May 10, 2020

Ballerina...you must have seen her...dancing in the sand.

fivetwos · May 10, 2020

I havent seen the specifics on his deal, but the team was up against it with the deals for 21 and 19 and still managed to get themselves reasonable outs after not all that long.

I'm guessing 54s contract is structured similarly.

He will need to be accountable on the field now, and he needs to forget about sunglass sales and looking like Huggy Bear and play football.

Nothing worse than someone who walks into the stadium the way he does then stinks it up on the field.

fivetwos · May 10, 2020

InTheZone said:
I like Smth, but whatever position he plays if he's going to be the Greg Ellis of 3-4 outside linebackers I don't think we need to be keeping him on the team any longer. If he still plays light on his feet and can't actually maneuver around a block he might not make it past preseason under MM.

I dont know about that. The guy had talent and his best position is 43 OLB. Which one I'm not sure. He would blitz when he rushes, which he can do. Despite the injury, he can run. He has been out of position which I'm not at all shocked about.

The way he conducts himself would be a lot more tolerable if he would perform better on the field.

Whyjerry · May 10, 2020

Cowboyny said:
Many will argue that Jaylon Smith production took a major hit last season. The novice fans who watched the games would see:

-Jaylon struggling against the run. Had a very difficult time disengaging from blocks.
-Was exposed somewhat in pass coverage
-Probably his best attribute was as an inside blitzer.
-Certainly didn't help losing LVE, along with assistant coaches fighting over how to use him.
-Clearly still has some physical limitations
-Doesn't possess elite instincts at the position
-Possesses elite athletic attributes, tremendous short area burst and straightline speed.

In my opinion, Jaylon Smith has been miscast playing the Middle Linebacker position. He clearly is a run and hit type of linebacker, not the type who can consistently take on oncoming blockers in the run game. The new staff needs to put him into better positions to succeed, need to have him play more to his strengths. Mike Nolan last stop was as a LB Coach, it's up to him to figure out how to best use Jaylon. If Jaylon can return to 2019 form, it will be a major key in turning around this defense.

Trouble disengaging from blocks? He does everything he can to avoid taking on blockers. Smith will run away from blockers. The guy has 100 pct Hollywood in him and 0 pct dawg.

Creeper · May 10, 2020

Its amazing how the team that Tom Landry coached had no idea how to use DTs and LBs. Landry instituted the philosophy of keeping the MLB clean to make plays when he had Sam Huff on the Giants. In fact, this strategy made Sam Huff a Hall of Fame LBer. But somewhere along the line Jerry Jones decided DTs could be found working at K-Mart.

Jaylon Smith is a major key in turning around this defense

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