Trade for O.J. Howard?

CowboysExchange · May 8, 2020

The te skillsets is not the argument Omar. The overinvolvement in our passing attack is the. Argument. Why is the worst skilled player/receiver on the roster playing every passing snap ???? Why not use better rbs and wrs and bench these blockers on passing downs????

OmerV · May 11, 2020

CowboysExchange said:
All those tes were in the huddle and ran routes. Just like the rest of the receivers and skilled players for 10 years under carrott top. They caught game losing passes short of the sticks a bunch of times or simply couldnt get open. I watched the games and I dont remember not 1 game winning reception by a Dallas Cowboy te in 10 years. Hanna started for 2-3 years and had how many career tds? Escobar, swaim, phillips, Bennett, schultz, Gathers? Along with #82 arent these our tes?

Ok. Were talking about passing downs and offensive production and youre talking about run blocking and pass protection but if you go back and watch the film they were out there running routes. They just couldnt make a play bro. We saw 10 years of no game winning plays being made by our entire te core.

Nobody is questioning the skillsets of these tes. Yeah they are old school. But this is a passing era and the slot wrs and receiving rbs and receiving tes have evolved and these one dimensional checkdown tes have been dissolved on passing downs to add more firepower.

Who leaves a player like swaim out there on 3rd and 24? He is the WORST RECEIVER IN THE NFL AND THE WORST ON THE TEAM!!! Why does he get to anchor down the slot when every wr and rb on the team is simply a better receiver?

We know the skillsets of a te. But those skillsets do not warrant playing any passing snaps on a regular basis much less all of them because they are not good receivers.

How did having these tes play every passing snap last year add to our red zone stats considering they were the featured receiver in the red zone? Ha ha.

I realize that ya cant have a steak at every position but you can sure substitute and run some dual rb and dual slot wrs formations if thats all ya got at te is a SCRUB RECEIVER WHO CANT BEAT A GOOD DEFENDER

You can talk about #82s talent but as a receiver he CAME UP SHORT WHEN IT MATTERED OVER THE PAST 6+ YEARS. Tes are not usually the top receivers on a team! Thats usually why you dont use them to play every passing snap.

lol - Hanna ever started for the Cowboys. You have a completely mindless view of all this. And, realistically, there aren't all the dramatic, game winning catches at WR either. You just have a video game mentality about this.

And if you want to talk about what was happening at TE 10 years ago, Witten was gaining 1,000+ yards per season, so don't act as if it was a useless position.

As far as Witten's talent fading in more recent years, yes, that's true, and it no way negates a single thing I have written. But, you can type in caps and pretend it somehow does argue against my comments. I don't expect you to think about the topic or what I write rationally anyway.

This "WORST RECEIVER IN THE NFL" thing is juvenile, both for your continued use of caps to show you are responding our of emotion, and not logic, but also your reliance on a ridiculously extreme position to fabricate an argument.

Cowboy Brian · May 12, 2020

I'd give a third TBH

Cowboy Brian · May 12, 2020

CowboyDAK said:
I always love these posts... We act like 4th round picks are gold...

Here's 2 decades worth of 4th round picks by the Dallas Cowboys

2019- Tony Pollard
2018-Dorance Armstrong Jr and Dalton Schultz
2017-Ryan Switzer
2016-Charles Tapper and Dak Prescott
2015-Damien Wilson
2014- Anthony Hitchens
2013- B.W. Webb
2012-Kyle Wilber and Matt Johnson
2011-David Arkin
2010-Akwasi Owusu-Ansah
2009-Stephen McGee and Brandon Williams
2008-Tashard Choice
2007-Isiah Stanback and Doug Free
2006- Skyler Green
2005-Marion Barber and Chris Canty
2004- Bruce Thornton
2003- Bradie James
2002- Jamar Martin
2001-Markus Steele
2000-Kareem Larrimore

So in 20 years and some with multiple selections in the 4th, we hit on Pollard, Hitchens, Dak, Barber, Canty, Free and Bradie James.

I would most certainly give up a 4th round pick for the talent level of OJ Howard and would not even look back. And when you look at skilled positions we only ever hit on Barber, Dak, and Pollard. No WR or TE amounted to anything.

Most teams have worse success rates in the first round.

Xavier187 · May 17, 2020

I honestly feel if there was a time to trade for O.J. Howard it would be today.
I would offer them Conner Williams and a 4th rounder for him. They need olineman badly it would be a big step for them to make this move. You could also look into adding Leary or Warford and solidify the line for the long haul. Or atleast 3 more years.

PJTHEDOORS · May 17, 2020

Xavier187 said:
I honestly feel if there was a time to trade for O.J. Howard it would be today.
I would offer them Conner Williams and a 4th rounder for him. They need olineman badly it would be a big step for them to make this move. You could also look into adding Leary or Warford and solidify the line for the long haul. Or atleast 3 more years.

No. Jarwin just needs reps.

Xavier187 · May 17, 2020

PJTHEDOORS said:
No. Jarwin just needs reps.

But Howard is so dynamic and would still get reps

PJTHEDOORS · May 17, 2020

Xavier187 said:
But Howard is so dynamic and would still get reps

Jarwin can get downfield. No need to trade OL depth.

Xavier187 · May 18, 2020

Its why u should add a warlord or leary. Its gonna be hard since we lost Fredrick

CowboysExchange · May 18, 2020

OmerV said:
lol - Hanna ever started for the Cowboys. You have a completely mindless view of all this. And, realistically, there aren't all the dramatic, game winning catches at WR either. You just have a video game mentality about this.

And if you want to talk about what was happening at TE 10 years ago, Witten was gaining 1,000+ yards per season, so don't act as if it was a useless position.

As far as Witten's talent fading in more recent years, yes, that's true, and it no way negates a single thing I have written. But, you can type in caps and pretend it somehow does argue against my comments. I don't expect you to think about the topic or what I write rationally anyway.

This "WORST RECEIVER IN THE NFL" thing is juvenile, both for your continued use of caps to show you are responding our of emotion, and not logic, but also your reliance on a ridiculously extreme position to fabricate an argument.

Hanna was a 2nd Starting te and played 25%-30% of passing snaps for 2+ years and he had 3 receptions in that timeframe. All these Tes suck on paper for 6+ years. You can argue about all the Run Blocking on run plays but 4 tds between the whole te core against scrubs in blowout games or in losing fashion is trash. A little substitution for some dual slot wrs or dual rbs formations is Long Overdue!

We've never won a single game throwing to our tes. Measely Beasley made 5xs more game winning plays then all of our tes combined have in 15 years.

You can argue the tes strong points and their pointless receptions but 1 playoff td on 57 targets in 8 playoff appearances and over 300 passing snaps is Garbage and everybody knows it.

CowboysExchange · May 18, 2020

Tyler Clutts has as many playoff tds as #82. Lmao. Nobody is arguing #82's skillsets. The ARGUMENT is that he and the rest of this bonepile of tes are overinvolved in our passing scheme. Theyve been out there on every game and season ending passing play for 15 yrs and our game or season ended in losing fashion. Not one game changing passing play ever! Old school tes suck on passing plays. One could argue that their old schoool blocking sucked at the playoff level but Im not even gonna go there. Im just talking about shooting blanks as a receiver. Its not ok to play a scrub receiver on passing plays. #82 wouldn't come out and he had no biz having all that involvement

OmerV · May 19, 2020

CowboysExchange said:
Hanna was a 2nd Starting te and played 25%-30% of passing snaps for 2+ years and he had 3 receptions in that timeframe. All these Tes suck on paper for 6+ years. You can argue about all the Run Blocking on run plays but 4 tds between the whole te core against scrubs in blowout games or in losing fashion is trash. A little substitution for some dual slot wrs or dual rbs formations is Long Overdue!

We've never won a single game throwing to our tes. Measely Beasley made 5xs more game winning plays then all of our tes combined have in 15 years.

You can argue the tes strong points and their pointless receptions but 1 playoff td on 57 targets in 8 playoff appearances and over 300 passing snaps is Garbage and everybody knows it.

Hanna played about 20-25% of the snap and you call that a starter for the sake of fabricating an argument. :facepalm:

I have no problem with occasionally running 4 WR, but your flip flopping about a TE being absolutely essential at one point, and completely unnecessary at other times is laughable. As for never winning game throwing to TE's, I have to ask huh? Every game the Cowboys win includes throwing to the TE.

As for game winning plays, I don't think Beasley has had 5, much less 5X more than anyone else. Your propensity to exaggerate for the purpose of manufacturing an argument is humorous.

Again, you really have no concept of a TE. Sure they can be used differently, and clearly JArwin has the ability o spread wide, and there can be sets with no TE's, 1, TE or multiple TEs, but your video game knowledge and viewpoint of the game isn't worth discussing. Even if you did have a point, Jarwin represents a changing of the guard, so give him a chance.

CowboysExchange · May 19, 2020

OmerV said:
Hanna played about 20-25% of the snap and you call that a starter for the sake of fabricating an argument.

I have no problem with occasionally running 4 WR, but your flip flopping about a TE being absolutely essential at one point, and completely unnecessary at other times is laughable. As for never winning game throwing to TE's, I have to ask huh? Every game the Cowboys win includes throwing to the TE.

As for game winning plays, I don't think Beasley has had 5, much less 5X more than anyone else. Your propensity to exaggerate for the purpose of manufacturing an argument is humorous.

Again, you really have no concept of a TE. Sure they can be used differently, and clearly JArwin has the ability o spread wide, and there can be sets with no TE's, 1, TE or multiple TEs, but your video game knowledge and viewpoint of the game isn't worth discussing. Even if you did have a point, Jarwin represents a changing of the guard, so give him a chance.

So did Swaim and they let him play every passing down and we sucked. One 2 yard td pass all season.

There is no reason for these tes to be involved much on passing downs. The everydown te system is trash if he isnt a stud receiver. Guys like Austin and Pollard are better options. Js.

If a te is gonna play every passing snap he better be the best option.

There is no way Swaim, Witten, or Jarwin has ever been the best option in 6 plus years on passing downs. There is no dominance.. No scoring. No winning to amount to beans.

Take out all the trash games against the Giants and your prince turns into a frog.

The raiders will prolly cut #82 and Jerry will pick him up and make him an everydown receiver.

OmerV · May 19, 2020

CowboysExchange said:
So did Swaim and they let him play every passing down and we sucked. One 2 yard td pass all season.

There is no reason for these tes to be involved much on passing downs. The everydown te system is trash if he isnt a stud receiver. Guys like Austin and Pollard are better options. Js.

If a te is gonna play every passing snap he better be the best option.

There is no way Swaim, Witten, or Jarwin has ever been the best option in 6 plus years. There is no dominance.

lol, so Swaim and Jarwin are the same guy and therefore have to have identical results? Sorry, that doesn't qualify as any close to a rational argument.

And, to make it worse, you are pretending Swaim's total of 2 TDs somehow applies to Jarwin even though Jarwin has 6 TDs in limited playing time over 2 seasons. Again, you aren't even approaching a rational argument.

And, sorry you don't understand the TE position. That you don't understand that he is a bigger target, or that he is a hybrid between blocker and receiver that allows teams to go either way without tipping their plan to the defense, or that there is a reason NFL teams don't use run and shoot offenses, or that even teams without a Travis Kelce or Zach Ertz or George Kittle still use a TE on most downs.

And, by the way, who is the 4th WR on the Cowboys that has proven to be better than Jarwin?

A video game viewpoint appears to be all you understand.

CowboysExchange · May 19, 2020

OmerV said:
lol, so Swaim and Jarwin are the same guy and therefore have to have identical results? Sorry, that doesn't qualify as any close to a rational argument.

And, sorry you don't understand the TE position. That you don't understand that he is a bigger target, or that he is a hybrid between blocker and receiver that allows teams to go either way without tipping their plan to the defense, or that there is a reason NFL teams don't use run and shoot offenses, or that even teams without a Travis Kelce or Zach Ertz or George Kittle still use a TE on most downs. A video game viewpoint appears to be all you understand.

There is a reason teams use a spread offense on critical passing plays. Nobody is insinuating the Boys should use a run n shoot passing scheme except you. I just said they need to use better weapons on passing downs than a te thats a loser on paper for 6 + years.

Dual slot wrs and rbs are better options with this talent. You act like these tes are drawing top defenders and all theyre drawing is sorry defenders and containment coverage while the top guys get doubled and blanketed.

OmerV · May 19, 2020

CowboysExchange said:
There is a reason teams use a spread offense on critical passing plays. Nobody is insinuating the Boys should use a run n shoot passing scheme except you. I just said they need to use better weapons on passing downs than a te thats a loser on paper for 6 + years.

Dual slot wrs and rbs are better options with this talent. You act like these tes are drawing top defenders and all theyre drawing is sorry defenders and containment coverage while the top guys get doubled and blanketed.

Onand individual play once in awhile, sure. I never said there should never be a single play without a TE, and that hasn't been what you have argued either. You are just flip flopping around more trying to keep a fabricated argument alive.

And by the way, in case you don't actually watch the games or somehow missed it, the team does sometimes go with multiple receivers, empty backfields, no TEs or TEs spread out wide. Your notion of only one way to do things is laughable, and would be more predictable than a Jason Garrett offense.

By the way, you just showed more of your complete ignorance on this topic. Jarwin hasn't been with the team for 6+ years, so that comment has no bearing on the current situation with the Cowboys.

And, again, who is this 4th receiver on the team that has proven to be a better player than Jarwin?

CowboysExchange · May 20, 2020

OmerV said:
Onand individual play once in awhile, sure. I never said there should never be a single play without a TE, and that hasn't been what you have argued either. You are just flip flopping around more trying to keep a fabricated argument alive.

And by the way, in case you don't actually watch the games or somehow missed it, the team does sometimes go with multiple receivers, empty backfields, no TEs or TEs spread out wide. Your notion of only one way to do things is laughable, and would be more predictable than a Jason Garrett offense.

By the way, you just showed more of your complete ignorance on this topic. Jarwin hasn't been with the team for 6+ years, so that comment has no bearing on the current situation with the Cowboys.

And, again, who is this 4th receiver on the team that has proven to be a better player than Jarwin?

Pollard and austin are both better weapons imo This team hasnt run a formation without a te in 10 years is my guess. #82 never came off the field his entire career.

OmerV · May 20, 2020

CowboysExchange said:
Pollard and austin are both better weapons imo This team hasnt run a formation without a te in 10 years is my guess. #82 never came off the field his entire career.

lo - again, your arguments continue to be based on players not with the team. Swaim and Witten are gone, get over them and live in the present.

As for Pollard and Austin (who, by the way, also isn't with the team at the present, and has never accomplished anything with the Cowboys), sure, depending on the formation and what the team is trying to do, they might be a better weapon. But you have an incredibly narrow minded and simplified view of how offenses work. There are a lot of moving parts, different formation, and different assignments on every play. It's not just a matter of putting the guys who run the fastest on the field. Your ideas would actually make it easier on defenses because you don't understand the need to have options. A TE is one of the keys for optionality because he can set up tight like a blocker where he can either run block, or pass protect or go out on a pass pattern, or he can split out wide. Just putting 4 receivers outside every play makes it easy for defenses to adjust because they know those guys aren't available to pass protect or take on a DE or LB. Again, you have a run and shoot mentality, and somehow don't get that all 32 teams have rejected that mentality. But keep laying your video games and fantasy football.

CowboysExchange · May 20, 2020

OmerV said:
lo - again, your arguments continue to be based on players not with the team. Swaim and Witten are gone, get over them and live in the present.

As for Pollard and Austin (who, by the way, also isn't with the team at the present, and has never accomplished anything with the Cowboys), sure, depending on the formation and what the team is trying to do, they might be a better weapon. But you have an incredibly narrow minded and simplified view of how offenses work. There are a lot of moving parts, different formation, and different assignments on every play. It's not just a matter of putting the guys who run the fastest on the field. Your ideas would actually make it easier on defenses because you don't understand the need to have options. A TE is one of the keys for optionality because he can set up tight like a blocker where he can either run block, or pass protect or go out on a pass pattern, or he can split out wide. Just putting 4 receivers outside every play makes it easy for defenses to adjust because they know those guys aren't available to pass protect or take on a DE or LB. Again, you have a run and shoot mentality, and somehow don't get that all 32 teams have rejected that mentality. But keep laying your video games and fantasy football.

Im not limiting the formations to te only. Tes running routes on 3rd and 20 are statistically inept. Football is situational and we play the man. Play the skillset. These tes skillsets is all hype. Their skillsets dont win games. Witten was the starter and Jarwin played alot of passing snaps. What top team or defender did they produce stats or score against? They are situational players. Neither Witten or Jarwin produced beans to deserve to be a an everydown receiver. They didnt win a single game as a receiver and scoring is king when youre hogging all of the red zone snaps. Lol.

Jarwin scored 1 td against a beat up philly d team and the rest against the giants. He went 8 games without a td and is expected to be an everydown receiver. Why? He went cold and no substitution. So did #82

Youre not even gonna try a better wr or rb some? Why not. These tes ate up snapcounts from bigger play guys

Get a baller who can go up and get a ball deep or for a score and cut the checkdowners. If youre not winning and they played they are the problem if they play every snap bro. Not making a td is LOSING THATS 8-8 BUT IN YOUR CASE HES EXCUSED. BUT HES NOT IF HES GETTING ALL THE RED ZONE PASSING SNAPS. A NO SUBSTITUTION TE SCHEME GOT US 8-8. LOL FOR A DECADE

No superbowls in 25 years but its a winning formula. Right!!! It sucks. Its the vanilla Anchor in our offense.

CowboysExchange · May 20, 2020

Tom Landry had a winning record for like 20 years 30 yrs ago . These last 15 years have been missing some west coast offense. These blocking tes cant beat anybody passing. They only good between the 20's then they fold like a cheap suit. Lol check out those 3 yard td passes when the defender slipped.They are the cancer in our red zone offense. A bunch of non impactful possession receivers

Our offense is the easiest to beat come playoff time because it never changes. Its like duck duck goose

Trade for O.J. Howard?

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