Twitter: Fish: Dak wants $45m in 5th year

DakPresgoat said:

So we are disregarding anything Fisher says about cap hit. But then just cherry picking one aspect of what he is reporting as them requesting a base salary of 45 mil in year 5?


So throw out the rest of the article and just keep one snippet? How about just throw out the whole article then because none of us know what the actual final contract numbers are going to look like until
It happens.

Click to expand...

Well he doesn't really talk about cap hit. He basically starts at 185MM and breaks it down into 5 years of "salary".

What Simms claims (and yes, we don't know if it is true) is that he heard that in order to give that 5th year, the Prescott camp is talking north of $45MM. Any rational intrepretation of that is that is what Prescott would want IN CASH paid in that 5th year to agree to it. They aren't talking about cap hit because cap hit is just the number result of accounting tricks. It's not necessarily real cash paid to a player in that year. In other words, why would the agent demand a cap hit of $45MM in year 5 when $12-15MM of that could simply be the prorated signing bonus that was already paid and then only $30-32MM in base salary which is his tag number this year? He would do no such thing.

It's not cherry picking anything. It's the one flaw that flows throughout his entire analysis.

Sydla said:

Well he doesn't really talk about cap hit. He basically starts at 185MM and breaks it down into 5 years of "salary".

What Simms claims (and yes, we don't know if it is true) is that he heard that in order to give that 5th year, the Prescott camp is talking north of $45MM. Any rational intrepretation of that is that is what Prescott would want IN CASH paid in that 5th year to agree to it. They aren't talking about cap hit because cap hit is just the number result of accounting tricks. It's not necessarily real cash paid to a player in that year. In other words, why would the agent demand a cap hit of $45MM in year 5 when $12-15MM of that could simply be the prorated signing bonus that was already paid and then only $30-32MM in base salary which is his tag number this year? He would do no such thing.

It's not cherry picking anything. It's the one flaw that flows throughout his entire analysis.

Click to expand...

Agents and players do care about the reported APY though. Simply from a media and reporting perspective. They want to be “the highest paid” by reports even if its money they will never actually see. The agent wants to be able to show other players “see I got this team to agree to this” even if the player will never see it.


I agree it’s accounting tricks. But agents and players care about the appearance about how much a player is getting paid also.

Sydla said:

It will not be.

You realize the highest base salary paid to a player right now that isn't tagged is Jimmy G at $24MM. The base salary for QBs isn't going to nearly double in 3-4 years.

You are confusing base salaries and annual cash payments with average compensation.

Click to expand...

It will literally take 4 years for you to see that you could be wrong, hell I could be wrong. so I'm done arguing with you...

Dak is gonna get signed with the Cowboys no matter what we think.

Swagger said:

Ok maybe not Homer Simpson but I'm sticking with pretty much any starting NFL quarterback would look great in this offense. Even someone like Jacoby Brissett - a backup QB would produce similar results to Prescott imo. Any QB that failed to play well in this offense shouldn't really be in the NFL.

Click to expand...

You sound like a typical casual fan. The key to any offense performing efficiently is having a solid QB. If you think any QB could have produced almost 5000 yards last season with 30 TDs, only 11 INTs and almost a 100.0 passer rating you don’t have a clue about football. Another big reason our offense is productive is Dak’s ability to run the read option and use his legs. He’s had 21 rushing TDs during his four seasons. He’s only thrown 36 INTs in four seasons. Jameis Winston had 30 INTs last season. It’s laughable for anyone to think our offense would be real productive with an average QB, especially with an average defense that doesn’t get takeaways. Can you name a team that’s led the league in offense with an average QB? You would have to go back several decades. If you tell me Dak is an average QB this discussion will be over.

88sAndHeartbreak said:

It will literally take 4 years for you to see that you could be wrong, hell I could be wrong. so I'm done arguing with you...

Dak is gonna get signed with the Cowboys no matter what we think.

Click to expand...

We really don't have to wait until 4 years.

The highest base salary right now for an non-tagged player is Jimmy G at $24MM. You are confusing base salary with APY. Yes, Mahomes will likely have an APY above $40MM. But his base salary won't be over $40MM (largely because he'll be paid a huge signing bonus right at the start of the extension).

I think the team will sign him before the deadline but if they don't I don t think dak will play under the tag I think he plays hard ball and this will really hurt the team because he has a lot of people on the team that look up to him. when they sign him to this big new deal though he is going to have a lot of unbelievable pressure on him if he don't win and win big its going to ugly for him in dallas pretty quick

DakPresgoat said:

Agents and players do care about the reported APY though. Simply from a media and reporting perspective. They want to be “the highest paid” by reports even if its money they will never actually see. The agent wants to be able to show other players “see I got this team to agree to this” even if the player will never see it.


I agree it’s accounting tricks. But agents and players care about the appearance about how much a player is getting paid also.

Click to expand...

Again you are just throwing terms out there that don't really equate. Saying agents care about APY doesn't prove your point either. Because APY is just another calculation and not necessarily real money paid to players.

So again, what Dak's agents would want isn't what the cap hit would be in Year 5. They'd want to negotiate what Dak would ACTUALLY POCKET IN CASH in that 5th year. So they wouldn't ask for a cap hit of $45MM. They'd ask for a base salary or base salary + roster bonus in that 5th year because in the end, that's all that really matters to a player....... the cash in his pocket, not what his cap hit would be in a given year.

It's easy to follow logically. Dak and his agents had been asking for only a 4 year deal. That is because they want to cash in on the big guaranteed money now and then be able to cash in on another big guaranteed deal in 4 years. The sooner the better. Dallas wants that 5th year for cap purposes. So what Dak and his agent did is say, sure, here's your 5th year but it's going to cost you. Meaning they want BIG CASH PAID TO DAK in Year 5. Not a cap hit that could be split between salary and the prorated bonus. They want Dallas to have to possibly pay a significant premium in cash that year for Dak to give up getting to FA a year earlier.

Dak is giving up nothing here. He either gets a 4 year deal and then in Year 5 gets to sign another huge contract potentially OR he gets a 5 year deal where Dallas has to pay him a significant amount of money in Year 5 that compensates him for having to wait a year to sign a new deal with a lot of upfront money.

I'm so over this. Either pay the man or let him hit the door. Just do something so we can focus on the upcoming season and not this situation. Who knows? Maybe McCarthy can squeeze something out of Dalton and we can use Dak money to sign some other pieces.

WillieBeamen said:

Click to expand...

what that means is his next signing bonus is probably 40mil because that 5th yr would be the yr they extend him and restructure him. Taking 40mil of that 45mil and turning it into a signing bonus. DUH

JD_KaPow said:

The article covers this pretty well. Dak would prefer a 4-year deal. If they want a fifth year, he's asking for a contract $10 million higher than what they've offered ($185 vs. $175).

Sounds like
Cowboys offer: 5 years, $175, $105 guaranteed

Dak's offers:
4 years, $140 OR
5 years, $185

I don't know what the guarantees he's asking for are.

Click to expand...

really comes to 37 million year. - just sign him and move on - you know they will anyways

LatinMind said:

what that means is his next signing bonus is probably 40mil because that 5th yr would be the yr they extend him and restructure him. Taking 40mil of that 45mil and turning it into a signing bonus. DUH

Click to expand...

One problem. Dak doesn't have to do anything. He could say, screw you, pay me $45MM base salary to play in Year 5 and then you can come to me with a new contract the next year with a big signing bonus. That would put more cash in his pocket over that 2 year period than a 5th year that gets blended into a new deal.

BigD_95 said:

really comes to $ 37 million year. - just sign him and move on - you know they will anyways

Click to expand...

If $ 35 million per year was the most recent baseline then mutually agree to $ 36 million over 5 years and get this deal done.

Sydla said:

One problem. Dak doesn't have to do anything. He could say, screw you, pay me $45MM base salary to play in Year 5 and then you can come to me with a new contract the next year with a big signing bonus. That would put more cash in his pocket over that 2 year period than a 5th year that gets blended into a new deal.

Click to expand...

This is over-complicating things, in my opinion. In no case will he see the 5th year. There's only 2 options - he's either performed well enough to earn another big deal, or he hasn't. If he hasn't, he's an easy cut. If he has performed well enough, then the team should have no hesitation in signing him to a big extension. He'd be a fool to pass up hundreds of millions of dollars in guaranteed money to play hardball in a sport where any given play can end your career. It gives him a small bit of leverage to not rush a deal, but won't sway him from accepting a fair market deal.

Why are so many upset with Prescott? If we can trust the rumor mill, mostly controlled by the Joneses, the sticking point on this new deal has been the length of the deal. They don't want to be back here in 4 years and that's exactly where he wants to be.

Consider this if you are a NFL QB. In 2016, just 4 short years ago, the highest QB salary cap hit was 24M by Eli Manning and Rothliesberger with actual cash spent in the 18M ball park. Now, where is the QB salary cap hit, just 4 short years ahead? That would be Prescott's tag at 31.5M followed by Wilson at 31M, Goff at 28M and Garoppolo at 27M.

Based on that with players like Mahomes, Watson and Jackson coming up, where do you think it's going to be in 4 more short years?

This is not Prescott or his agent's fault, they do not want a deal beyond 4 years and the Jones just won't stop trying to make that happen so his agent fires back a Mahomes number for that 5th year and they're not the bad guys here.

There are two different QB's we are discussing here. The one the Dakaters think he is and the one he thinks he is, along with the Daksters. He sees himself as one every bit as good as the other QB's. He thinks he should be compensated as well as they will be.

Who in the hell is anybody here to establish the value and worth of another person, that is up to them and if they can get that, more power to them.

Forget the money, remove the money because it really has nothing to do with football. Either you want him or some other option at QB, the money isn't your problem.

ksg811 said:

This is over-complicating things, in my opinion. In no case will he see the 5th year. There's only 2 options - he's either performed well enough to earn another big deal, or he hasn't. If he hasn't, he's an easy cut. If he has performed well enough, then the team should have no hesitation in signing him to a big extension. He'd be a fool to pass up hundreds of millions of dollars in guaranteed money to play hardball in a sport where any given play can end your career. It gives him a small bit of leverage to not rush a deal, but won't sway him from accepting a fair market deal.

Click to expand...

If he doesn't play well, sure the decision is easy.

But let's say he does play well. In Year 4 the Cowboys approach him about an extension so they can essentially re-work the 5th year and trim that salary down in Year 5. So they offer a big deal with $60MM signing bonus. Dak could simply say I will play for $45MM in that 5th year and then you are going to have to come up with another big signing bonus the next year.

Just think it through. Dak is giving up nothing here. He wants a 4 year deal to get to that 3rd contract sooner. He counters the 5 year request by saying sure, I'll give you 5 years but it's going to cost you. In other words, he's setting up a situation that the best case scenario for him is Dallas pays him $45MM in cash in Year 5 and the has to fork over a big signing bonus 12 months later. Worst case, he gets what he wants and Dallas basically rips the contract up after 4 years and gives him an extension with a huge signing bonus.

He's giving up very little here.

Wow Cowturd is killing Dak!!! Moseley did not give him any negatives in his segment. So the turd decides to crush Dak in the next segment. France get Dak his money....

CouchCoach said:

Could be what he wants. He pockets 31.4M this season and is either tagged next season for north of 35M or he's a FA while possibly Mahomes and Watson get new deals.

The Joneses are pathetic. They're like the guy that keeps proposing to the girl and she keeps saying maybe. They should have backed off after the tag and let it lay in his court but they're really lousy negotiators and keep telling everyone at work that the girl is going to marry them.

Prescott is going to get what he wants and they will try and make it look like they didn't roll over. They're the clown act at their own Big Top.

Click to expand...

So true yet so sad

Sydla said:

If he doesn't play well, sure the decision is easy.

But let's say he does play well. In Year 4 the Cowboys approach him about an extension so they can essentially re-work the 5th year and trim that salary down in Year 5. So they offer a big deal with $60MM signing bonus. Dak could simply say I will play for $45MM in that 5th year and then you are going to have to come up with another big signing bonus the next year.

Just think it through. Dak is giving up nothing here. He wants a 4 year deal to get to that 3rd contract sooner. He counters the 5 year request by saying sure, I'll give you 5 years but it's going to cost you. In other words, he's setting up a situation that the best case scenario for him is Dallas pays him $45MM in cash in Year 5 and the has to fork over a big signing bonus 12 months later. Worst case, he gets what he wants and Dallas basically rips the contract up after 4 years and gives him an extension with a huge signing bonus.

He's giving up very little here.

Click to expand...

And worst case scenario is he gets his leg bent under him and snaps his leg and his career is over, ala Alex Smith and he never gets his next big deal. Sure, the odds of that are slim and he very well could do what you are suggesting. But I find it hard to believe he would give up that much guaranteed money for that kind of risk, no matter how slim it may be.

Regardless, I still think a 5th year automatic void is the best solution for both sides. Dak gets his 4 year deal and the Cowboys get their extra year of cap flexibility.

Sydla said:

If he doesn't play well, sure the decision is easy.

But let's say he does play well. In Year 4 the Cowboys approach him about an extension so they can essentially re-work the 5th year and trim that salary down in Year 5. So they offer a big deal with $60MM signing bonus. Dak could simply say I will play for $45MM in that 5th year and then you are going to have to come up with another big signing bonus the next year.

Just think it through. Dak is giving up nothing here. He wants a 4 year deal to get to that 3rd contract sooner. He counters the 5 year request by saying sure, I'll give you 5 years but it's going to cost you. In other words, he's setting up a situation that the best case scenario for him is Dallas pays him $45MM in cash in Year 5 and the has to fork over a big signing bonus 12 months later. Worst case, he gets what he wants and Dallas basically rips the contract up after 4 years and gives him an extension with a huge signing bonus.

He's giving up very little here.

Click to expand...

It’s basically giving the middle finger to the Jones’. Not saying I care either way but this relationship between both parties is deteriorating fast.