This would be the ultimate offseason move for this team

ArtClink

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Here's the problem with the first thing you said. Jones as owner and GM has THREE Super Bowl wins and ZERO losses, while owner Clint Murchison with an actual GM has only TWO Super Bowl wins and THREE losses.
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Jimmy Johnson had the last word in all football matters in his contract and built the team that won three Super Bowls. Conversely, Jerry the "GM" has spent the past 25 years unraveling ANY theory that he might have had something to do with winning those championships other than hiring Jimmy & signing paychecks. Any thought that Jerry made any football decisions and overruled Jimmy is fool's gold as evidenced by the quarter of a century and still no div playoff win for Jerry the GM, a historic low for the Cowboy's franchise.
 

Diehardblues

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You make some good points here X.

But it cannot be said that Jerry Jones “hasn’t meddled” in a while. We had video evidence of it multiple times from the 2017 NFL films documentary “All or Nothing”. We saw JJ literally overrule his coaches who wanted to discipline Zeke for loafing after an INT in the Denver loss. Jerry was on tape overruling that. He was also on tape holding up coaches meetings so he and Stephen could either be there in person or be there on a phone conference. That’s just off the top of my head.

In 2006 with TO being forced on Bill Parcells, 2015 with Greg Hardy being forced on Garrett...Not meddling? I can see the argument that perhaps SJ is doing more. But saying Jerry Jones doesn’t cross the line where it becomes micromanaging...I don’t see how that can be said.
Jerry is the GM . If he’s not meddling then he’s even a worse GM than we thought. Hopefully he’s friking doing something.

Sorry, but I have no hope he’s not still in the same role he’s always been . Front and Center.
 

Diehardblues

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Jimmy Johnson had the last word in all football matters in his contract and built the team that won three Super Bowls. Conversely, Jerry the "GM" has spent the past 25 years unraveling ANY theory that he might have had something to do with winning those championships other than hiring Jimmy & signing paychecks. Any thought that Jerry made any football decisions and overruled Jimmy is fool's gold as evidenced by the quarter of a century and still no div playoff win for Jerry the GM, a historic low for the Cowboy's franchise.
While I would agree , Jerry does deserve credit for providing Jimmy everything he wanted or needed. That’s what an owner and or GM should be doing.
 

ArtClink

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While I would agree , Jerry does deserve credit for providing Jimmy everything he wanted or needed. That’s what an owner and or GM should be doing.

Jimmy gets 99% of the credit. Once Jerry started making all the football decisions and after jimmys talent got old and lost to free agency, well ... here we are 25 yrs later. Where has Jerry the GM led us the past 25 yrs? The results always speak for themselves.

Jerry the GM would be heralded as a success for the Browns for making playoffs occasionally, but the bar is very high here in Dallas. 25 consequetive yrs of no div playoff wins is pitiful and a historic low for a once proud franchise.
 

Bobhaze

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Here's the problem with the first thing you said. Jones as owner and GM has THREE Super Bowl wins and ZERO losses, while owner Clint Murchison with an actual GM has only TWO Super Bowl wins and THREE losses. Not to mention that during Murchison's time there was no salary cap or free agency so he could build a good team up without any worries about losing players in free agency or having to release a player because of a cap.

Now it's obvious you have a very strong dislike for Jones. There are some things he's done that I didn't like but to put all of the blame for not winning another Super Bowl is just hatred talking. There is more than enough blame to go around from head coaches, to coordinators, special teams coaches, players, the scouting department with their recommendations on who to draft and yes bad calls in games. You're going to come back with Jones then should have fired those coaches but you just pointed out that Jones sticks his nose into things to much. Now if you just mean head coaches then you would want to be another browns who fire their head coach every other year and never get any better. What do you think the players on the browns think when they keep getting new head coaches. Gee I wonder how many games it will take before he gets fired. When a team hires a new head coach there usually is a big turnover on the other coaches and then there's the new systems, plays and verbiage that has to be learned.

Yes I'm disappointed that the Cowboys haven't won several more Super Bowls, but to put all the blame on one person isn't realistic or right.
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Some points:
  • I don’t have a strong dislike for Jerry Jones. I have a strong dislike for the results he gets. Hall of Fame businessman. Mediocre at best GM.
  • I’m thrilled with the 3 Super Bowl wins we had under Jerry. But my 36 year old son was 12 the last time Jerry’s Cowboys won a divisional playoff game, much less a Super Bowl. Tony Romo was a Sophomore in HS. Dak Prescott was not quite two. It’s been a while.
  • Those Clint Murchison years you poo-pooed make me think you may have missed some big accomplishments on the Clint Murchison watch
    • Under Murchison’s ownership, the Cowboys played in 10 NFC championship games in 13 seasons, winning 5. We have been to zero in the last 25 years.
    • Yes they lost 3 SBs. (I wouldn’t mind getting to a SB again someday) But they won 2.
    • In the Murchison years of 1960-84, 25 seasons, the Cowboys won 20 playoff games, played in 10 NFC championship games and 5 SBs. In the 31 seasons under Jerry, the Cowboys have won 15 playoff games, played in 4 NFC championships and 3 SBs. Not knocking those accomplishments but saying he’s accomplished more than Murchison did in his time is a little misleading if not inaccurate.
Hey at least we can agree on something- we both want the Cowboys to return to glory. If we win another one under Jerry, I will be absolutely thrilled. I’m just not shy about saying that 25 years of doing things “his way” has not been a great era for this storied franchise.
 

gjkoeppen

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Jimmy Johnson had the last word in all football matters in his contract and built the team that won three Super Bowls. Conversely, Jerry the "GM" has spent the past 25 years unraveling ANY theory that he might have had something to do with winning those championships other than hiring Jimmy & signing paychecks. Any thought that Jerry made any football decisions and overruled Jimmy is fool's gold as evidenced by the quarter of a century and still no div playoff win for Jerry the GM, a historic low for the Cowboy's franchise.

You are spouting the same garbage so many have and still do EXCEPT that in the pregame for Super Bowl XLV in Texas Stadium there was a round table discussion with Jones, Johnson, Emmitt, Irvin, Aikman and The Moose where Johnson admitted in front of millions of viewers that he DID NOT have all the power and authority those outside of the Cowboys organization thought he had. He said that one thing that bothered him his entire time in Dallas was having to go to Jones for things he thought he should be able to handle. He said he was surprised that when the talks about trading Walker started that when he told Jones he had a personal history with the vikings GM that Jones gave Johnson the green light to do the negotiating. Most think that what Jones said the night before a Super Bowl while intoxicated when he said any coach would have gotten the team there,even Switzer that it was that when Johnson found out about it was what caused the split. But Johnson later said that having to go to Jones for so many things just festered in him and that last statement was just the straw that broke the camel's back.

So you continue to believe all the things that people outside of the Cowboys have always speculated on and I'll believe what Johnson admitted in front of millions of people.
 

Diehardblues

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Jimmy gets 99% of the credit. Once Jerry started making all the football decisions and after jimmys talent got old and lost to free agency, well ... here we are 25 yrs later. Where has Jerry the GM led us the past 25 yrs? The results always speak for themselves.

Jerry the GM would be heralded as a success for the Browns for making playoffs occasionally, but the bar is very high here in Dallas. 25 consequetive yrs of no div playoff wins is pitiful and a historic low for a once proud franchise.
I understand but what if Jerry doesn’t agree to trade Herschel for example ? Or doesn’t go after Haley?

Jerry should receive more credit for the moves as GM that supported what Jimmy wanted or needed.
 

Bobhaze

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You are spouting the same garbage so many have and still do EXCEPT that in the pregame for Super Bowl XLV in Texas Stadium there was a round table discussion with Jones, Johnson, Emmitt, Irvin, Aikman and The Moose where Johnson admitted in front of millions of viewers that he DID NOT have all the power and authority those outside of the Cowboys organization thought he had. He said that one thing that bothered him his entire time in Dallas was having to go to Jones for things he thought he should be able to handle. He said he was surprised that when the talks about trading Walker started that when he told Jones he had a personal history with the vikings GM that Jones gave Johnson the green light to do the negotiating. Most think that what Jones said the night before a Super Bowl while intoxicated when he said any coach would have gotten the team there,even Switzer that it was that when Johnson found out about it was what caused the split. But Johnson later said that having to go to Jones for so many things just festered in him and that last statement was just the straw that broke the camel's back.

So you continue to believe all the things that people outside of the Cowboys have always speculated on and I'll believe what Johnson admitted in front of millions of people.
Hey man, if you’re happy with the results we’re getting with Jerry, my hats off to you. Enjoy. You wear a set of rosier glasses than I can, lol.
 

Diehardblues

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You are spouting the same garbage so many have and still do EXCEPT that in the pregame for Super Bowl XLV in Texas Stadium there was a round table discussion with Jones, Johnson, Emmitt, Irvin, Aikman and The Moose where Johnson admitted in front of millions of viewers that he DID NOT have all the power and authority those outside of the Cowboys organization thought he had. He said that one thing that bothered him his entire time in Dallas was having to go to Jones for things he thought he should be able to handle. He said he was surprised that when the talks about trading Walker started that when he told Jones he had a personal history with the vikings GM that Jones gave Johnson the green light to do the negotiating. Most think that what Jones said the night before a Super Bowl while intoxicated when he said any coach would have gotten the team there,even Switzer that it was that when Johnson found out about it was what caused the split. But Johnson later said that having to go to Jones for so many things just festered in him and that last statement was just the straw that broke the camel's back.

So you continue to believe all the things that people outside of the Cowboys have always speculated on and I'll believe what Johnson admitted in front of millions of people.
Yep

Not many bigger critics of Jerry than me but if we’re going to blame him for everything since Jimmy then he has to credit for everything he did with Jimmy.
 

gjkoeppen

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Some points:
  • I don’t have a strong dislike for Jerry Jones. I have a strong dislike for the results he gets. Hall of Fame businessman. Mediocre at best GM.
  • I’m thrilled with the 3 Super Bowl wins we had under Jerry. But my 36 year old son was 12 the last time Jerry’s Cowboys won a divisional playoff game, much less a Super Bowl. Tony Romo was a Sophomore in HS. Dak Prescott was not quite two. It’s been a while.
  • Those Clint Murchison years you poo-pooed make me think you may have missed some big accomplishments on the Clint Murchison watch
    • Under Murchison’s ownership, the Cowboys played in 10 NFC championship games in 13 seasons, winning 5. We have been to zero in the last 25 years.
    • Yes they lost 3 SBs. (I wouldn’t mind getting to a SB again someday) But they won 2.
    • In the Murchison years of 1960-84, 25 seasons, the Cowboys won 20 playoff games, played in 10 NFC championship games and 5 SBs. In the 31 seasons under Jerry, the Cowboys have won 15 playoff games, played in 4 NFC championships and 3 SBs. Not knocking those accomplishments but saying he’s accomplished more than Murchison did in his time is a little misleading if not inaccurate.
Hey at least we can agree on something- we both want the Cowboys to return to glory. If we win another one under Jerry, I will be absolutely thrilled. I’m just not shy about saying that 25 years of doing things “his way” has not been a great era for this storied franchise.

I didn't say that under the Murchison years the Cowboys didn't accomplish some really good things, but your big thing in your original comment was no Super Bowls in 25 years and what Jones has done or didn't do to not get more and I just pointed out if Super Bowls were the measuring stick, then Murchison only has 2 wins and 3 losses and Jones has 3 wins and zero losses. You can't whine about something and after proven wrong change the argument to include other things.

You're right we can continue to hope that the Cowboys once again start winning Super Bowls.
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gjkoeppen

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Hey man, if you’re happy with the results we’re getting with Jerry, my hats off to you. Enjoy. You wear a set of rosier glasses than I can, lol.

You're making assumptions. There have been things that Jones has done that I haven't liked but on the other hand there is more than enough blame to go around other than placing all the blame on Jones. It's just to easy to say that the play of players really is any fault for the things that have happened and that Jones is. It's to easy to still say Jones when coaching mistakes hold some fault. It's to easy to say Jones when the scouting department makes their recommendations on players that didn't pan out. Jones isn't blameless but he's not the total blame either.
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ArtClink

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I understand but what if Jerry doesn’t agree to trade Herschel for example ? Or doesn’t go after Haley?

Jerry should receive more credit for the moves as GM that supported what Jimmy wanted or needed.

Correction. Jimmy only gets 98% of the credit. :)
 

gjkoeppen

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Yep

Not many bigger critics of Jerry than me but if we’re going to blame him for everything since Jimmy then he has to credit for everything he did with Jimmy.

I don't think many would say that Johnson wasn't a really good coach here but being a really good coach is not running the organization. People still think Johnson was the suedo GM and he admitted that he wasn't. He said that those outside of the organization thought he had more power and authority than what he actually did. The two things that had really hampered the Cowboys progress and continued winning ways were the cap and free agency. In the years prior to the cap Jones paid backup players starting type money. Many of those backup players were starting quality. The Cowboys, by far, by miles, had the biggest payroll in the NFL when the cap started and they were forced to let many of those backup players go who ended up as starters on other teams. The Cowboys has such a huge payroll that Jones with a couple other owners tried to convince all of the owners to allow the Cowboys and 2 other teams a 2 year exemption from the cap to give them a little time to try to get things under control. It failed and when the cap started the Cowboys had to renegotiate many contracts which put dead money down the road and that vicious cycle started and lasted for over 20 years.

When those who want to blame Jones for the lack of Super Bowls the last 25 years don't know or remember what the start of the cap did to the Cowboys and just how long it has had a major affect on them.
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Brax

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Many fans should talk less and pay attention more.

Stephen Jones is running the football operations. It's more than obvious to anyone that pays attention.
  • Jerry's only requirement at this point is that he maintains 1st dibs on camera and microphone time.
  • Jerry gets daily reports during training camp and during the season specifically for the purpose of being able to talk about players/coaches/etc. to the media.
  • They came up with the concept of making videos for the intro portion of the interviews with draft prospects.
    • That was done to give Jerry more camera time during the Covid Lockout.

  • Stephen Jones was already running the draft (Martin over Manziel).
  • Stephen Jones was already negotiating all contracts (DLaw's agent only talked to Jerry once and that was at a photo shoot).
  • Stephen Jones finally got complete control when he pushed his red-headed step brother out the door.
In other words made up because you think it is so. Jerry calls the shots good or bad and some fans should listen to Jerry more.
 

buybuydandavis

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So here’s hoping the business genius that owns the Cowboys wakes up and realizes that he’s got the most financially valuable sports franchise in the world because he’s a great businessman. But he must also realize he hasn’t been to a Super Bowl in a quarter of a century because he micromanages and meddles way too much.

If at 78, Jerry can learn how to let his very qualified HC run the locker room, we actually have a much better chance of getting back to the playoff glory we all want.

Most valuable sports franchise doing it Jerry's way.
No more SBs doing it Jerry's way.

Jerry likely prioritizes the former over the latter, I don't blame an *owner* for prioritizing return on investment over trophies, and I don't expect he would care if we do.

I expect Jerry to continue to "meddle" as the face of the franchise, but I expect McCarthy to run a less dysfunctional coaching org, and be a much better game manager.

Jerry foisted coaching dysfunction onto Wade in the form of Head Coach In Waiting, the Red Menace. I think the dysfunction since was likely Garrett produced, but I'm unaware of evidence either way.
 

StarBoyz83

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For me it was the coaching changes easily.

Had a great draft better than usual

Fa was basically like always to me nothing to be excited about.
 

TexasBoys2288

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Since our Cowboys last won a SB, there have been 24 other SB winners. Here’s a not so surprising fact about the owners of the last 24 SB winning teams:
  • Those owners all hired someone besides themselves to be the general manager.
The good news is, we certainly have had some good things to celebrate this offseason. Just look at the highlights of the last several months:
  • We finally got rid of an incapable HC.
  • We hired a bonafide NFL HC with skins on the wall.
  • We had an outstanding draft.
And that’s just to name a few good offseason outcomes.

But the best thing that could come out of this offseason is a fundamental truth about why we haven’t been able to return to the glory days of yesteryear. That truth is our owner has meddled and micromanaged his head coaches too much, while making himself the face of the franchise.

So here’s hoping the business genius that owns the Cowboys wakes up and realizes that he’s got the most financially valuable sports franchise in the world because he’s a great businessman. But he must also realize he hasn’t been to a Super Bowl in a quarter of a century because he micromanages and meddles way too much.

If at 78, Jerry can learn how to let his very qualified HC run the locker room, we actually have a much better chance of getting back to the playoff glory we all want.

That would be the best offseason move we have had in a very long time.
The meddling Jones has done in the last 10 years was keeping that Bozo Garrett as head coach. I think JJ really likes MM and will hopefully stay out of the way in hopes of getting another trophy for the case. It's been a long time coming.
 

America's Cowboy

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Since our Cowboys last won a SB, there have been 24 other SB winners. Here’s a not so surprising fact about the owners of the last 24 SB winning teams:
  • Those owners all hired someone besides themselves to be the general manager.
The good news is, we certainly have had some good things to celebrate this offseason. Just look at the highlights of the last several months:
  • We finally got rid of an incapable HC.
  • We hired a bonafide NFL HC with skins on the wall.
  • We had an outstanding draft.
And that’s just to name a few good offseason outcomes.

But the best thing that could come out of this offseason is a fundamental truth about why we haven’t been able to return to the glory days of yesteryear. That truth is our owner has meddled and micromanaged his head coaches too much, while making himself the face of the franchise.

So here’s hoping the business genius that owns the Cowboys wakes up and realizes that he’s got the most financially valuable sports franchise in the world because he’s a great businessman. But he must also realize he hasn’t been to a Super Bowl in a quarter of a century because he micromanages and meddles way too much.

If at 78, Jerry can learn how to let his very qualified HC run the locker room, we actually have a much better chance of getting back to the playoff glory we all want.

That would be the best offseason move we have had in a very long time.
BH, I believe Jerry is already doing what you wish.
 
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