How bad was Quinn vs run

dsturgeon · Jun 25, 2020

ondaedg said:
I enjoy Voch’s film sessions but it was obvious to even an amateur like me that a smallish guy like Quinn who is usually trying to beat the LT around the edge is going to kill us in the run game. And that is exactly what happened.

Gregory was alright in the run game.

Typhus · Jun 26, 2020

ultron said:
I’ve said it time and time and time again, Robert Quinn leaving was the best thing that happened this offseason. This guy was absolute dog shiiiiit vs the run last year and cost us at least 2 games and a playoff birth. He was horrendous and left this defense out to dry 90% of the time.

Quinn was a hired gun, a one dimensional pass rusher, that came in with that understanding from both sides, we knew what we were getting with Quinn.
He was highly motivated to do one thing and that was get to the QB, he knew the value of making highlight reels when he would be making his final contract bids.

Beaker42 · Jun 26, 2020

Rayman70 said:
he was a pass rush specialist, PERIOD. As long as you understand that and how to use him, he's great. But if you ask him to be something he isn't, you will be disappointed. He's just not a run stuffer. He gets washed out fairly easy. We now have heavy handed bigger DE'S to take over..except for Randy Gregory. Aldon Smith gives us some power off the edge. SOME GIRTH. Plus the interior looks stout.

Gregory was 3X better vs run than Quinn was.

America's Cowboy · Jun 26, 2020

quickccc said:
video per Voch Lombardi:

How bad was DE Robert Quinn vs run

But...but...but it was Dak's fault for that 8-8 record and missing the playoffs! Don't try to deflect by exposing Quinn and the Defense.

:muttley:

jterrell · Jun 26, 2020

Johnny23 said:
I think it's the obsession with Voch's videos @PAPPYDOG and confirming certain biases they have for others against certain players.

confirmation bias is real and probably happens to all or most of us.
if you go into games looking for something you'll most certainly find it.

all that said, pff isn't biased against quinn and much of the fan base was biased IN his favor.
they felt he was a must sign. --he wasn't.

quinn was really good with the pass rush and that is important.
but he had no business playing short yardage.

xwalker · Jun 26, 2020

Dreski said:
It might be a long shot, but I’m really hoping Trysten Hill takes that next step this coming season. If Tomsula is the d line coach everyone says he is, and gets the best out of his players, and the idea(don’t think it’s confirmed) of Nolan running a multiple front Defense,I think Trysten can do well. He already kinda played in a 3-4 and 4-3, and he’s got potential. Just gotta put it together

Hill played 2 college seasons in a 3-4 then 1 in a 4-3.

He played NT in the 3-4.

xwalker · Jun 26, 2020

Rayman70 said:
he was a pass rush specialist, PERIOD. As long as you understand that and how to use him, he's great. But if you ask him to be something he isn't, you will be disappointed. He's just not a run stuffer. He gets washed out fairly easy. We now have heavy handed bigger DE'S to take over..except for Randy Gregory. Aldon Smith gives us some power off the edge. SOME GIRTH. Plus the interior looks stout.

Randy Gregory is a quality run defender. He was the best run defender in his draft of the good pass rushers.

Johnny23 · Jun 27, 2020

jterrell said:
confirmation bias is real and probably happens to all or most of us.
if you go into games looking for something you'll most certainly find it.

all that said, pff isn't biased against quinn and much of the fan base was biased IN his favor.
they felt he was a must sign. --he wasn't.

quinn was really good with the pass rush and that is important.
but he had no business playing short yardage.

Agreed. That's why we had a coaching change honestly.

xwalker · Jun 28, 2020

jterrell said:
confirmation bias is real and probably happens to all or most of us.
if you go into games looking for something you'll most certainly find it.

all that said, pff isn't biased against quinn and much of the fan base was biased IN his favor.
they felt he was a must sign. --he wasn't.

quinn was really good with the pass rush and that is important.
but he had no business playing short yardage.

Quinn was not great vs the run but the video was mostly plays where Quinn did his job vs the run.

It was the worst analysis that I've seen.

Video guy picks a narrative that fans already believe and in this case is basically true. Then fans will believe anything he says because they agree with his conclusions. The fact that the actual analysis of each play is completely wrong gets overlooked.

jterrell · Jun 28, 2020

xwalker said:
Quinn was not great vs the run but the video was mostly plays where Quinn did his job vs the run.

It was the worst analysis that I've seen.

Video guy picks a narrative that fans already believe and in this case is basically true. Then fans will believe anything he says because they agree with his conclusions. The fact that the actual analysis of each play is completely wrong gets overlooked.

You don't have to sell me on that, lol.
There is a well respected guy named Brett Kollman who does draft analysis that drives me crazy.
He broke down a video about why Jabrill Peppers would bge a stud but the video was actually Jabrill doing things he'd never be asked to do as a pro given his size and near zero of the thing she would be asked to do.
.
Had the same issue with his breakdown of Myles Jack. Jack was always near the ball but never making initial contact.
Lots of scouts disagreed with me but if you can't tackle I downgrade your other skills.

What I saw all year from Quinn was a rush up field too deep into the backfield to help on run plays and a lack of effort once the play was beyond him.
PFF's awful run grade was warranted imho. To me he was simply making a business decision to go rack up sacks. It worked.
But it also worked well for Dallas. We'll be better without him imho and get a nice comp pick.

xwalker · Jun 28, 2020

jterrell said:
You don't have to sell me on that, lol.
There is a well respected guy named Brett Kollman who does draft analysis that drives me crazy.
He broke down a video about why Jabrill Peppers would bge a stud but the video was actually Jabrill doing things he'd never be asked to do as a pro given his size and near zero of the thing she would be asked to do.
.
Had the same issue with his breakdown of Myles Jack. Jack was always near the ball but never making initial contact.
Lots of scouts disagreed with me but if you can't tackle I downgrade your other skills.

What I saw all year from Quinn was a rush up field too deep into the backfield to help on run plays and a lack of effort once the play was beyond him.
PFF's awful run grade was warranted imho. To me he was simply making a business decision to go rack up sacks. It worked.
But it also worked well for Dallas. We'll be better without him imho and get a nice comp pick.

My problem with video guy is that he gets a lot of Cowboys fans to believe that he "knows stuff" by playing to the existing narratives like Quinn was not good against the run.
- Correct conclusion but nothing in his video actually supported the conclusion for anybody that really analyzed his analysis.

The problem then becomes that when video guy's conclusion is completely wrong, the majority of fans still jump on his narrative and start repeating it ad nauseum.

How bad was Quinn vs run

dsturgeon

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Typhus

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America's Cowboy

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jterrell

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jterrell

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