Twitter: Since 2016 feeding Zeke has 0 correlation to winning

McKDaddy · Jul 29, 2020

Whirlwin said:
If Elliot is the reason we went 13 and three in 2016. What happened after that.

teams figured out he was the biggest threat & committed to stopping him. 2017 & 2018 Dak clearly couldn't make them shift their priorities. 2019 depends on your perspective.

Whirlwin · Jul 29, 2020

McKDaddy said:
teams figured out he was the biggest threat & committed to stopping him. 2017 & 2018 Dak clearly couldn't make them shift their priorities. 2019 depends on your perspective.

Do you see the hypocrisy of that. So it’s not Elliotts fault he could’ve possibly dropped off. It Hass to be Prescott again. 2017 Elliot wasn’t even on the field half of the games. And 18. We Lauster starting center tight end and wide receiver. I think Prescott and company can definitely reproduce 2016

SteveTheCowboy · Jul 29, 2020

Aviano90 said:
That’s one aspect of why I get into debates about Zeke. I feel he can do better. His biggest fans don’t. They think he is the best he can be and don’t want to hear any criticism of his game.

Count me in as one of his biggest fans...going all the way back to his first play at Ohio State. Special teams tackle. You should check it.

Count me also in as not only believing he CAN do better (2016 better) but also being critical of his holdout and return to the field. I don't recall reading anyone who said "I feel he doesn't have to do better". Certainly no consensus or even GROUP of "his biggest fans".

It's still strange to see us talking like this. We should kinda ALL be not only his "biggest fans" but all of our players. I do include Dak. We should want the best success for him and them...until they are no longer Cowboys. Salary cap be dmaned (you can't do anything about that anyway. why make a dman big issue of it?) ....Some people think this to be "oh you're a player fan not a team fan". Bull. The players are the team.

McKDaddy · Jul 29, 2020

Whirlwin said:
Do you see the hypocrisy of that. So it’s not Elliotts fault he could’ve possibly dropped off. It Hass to be Prescott again. 2017 Elliot wasn’t even on the field half of the games. And 18. We Lauster starting center tight end and wide receiver. I think Prescott and company can definitely reproduce 2016

No I see an honest assessment. It doesn't preclude that Elliott could be less than he was in 2016. But he could also be exactly the same player but running behind a less dominant line, with defenses keying on him and with a QB that wasn't making defenses pay thru the air the resulting in less success per play.
Just to be clear, I think Elliott hurt a hip in 2017 (could have been 2018) & he has never looked quite the same. But I believe he has generally gotten more than has been blocked throughout his career including 2019. So he's one of the last players I'm going to blame for the teams results.

Dak on the other hand has clearly struggled against better teams & without Zeke, Amari, etc..

I'm not trying to pit the two against each other. Simply offering what I believe is the boiled down reason for why things haven't been as easy since 2016.

QuincyCarterEra · Jul 29, 2020

McKDaddy said:
teams figured out he was the biggest threat & committed to stopping him. 2017 & 2018 Dak clearly couldn't make them shift their priorities. 2019 depends on your perspective.

Right, that totally happened.

/sarcasm

McKDaddy · Jul 29, 2020

QuincyCarterEra said:
Right, that totally happened.

/sarcasm

You totally changed my mind ......... sarcasm.

AbeBeta · Jul 29, 2020

Wow. A big long thread spurred by a dumb analysis.

Game you win are most often ones where you come into the 2nd half with a lead. Games you lose are most often ones when you are playing from behind.

Gee, down 10 points with 6 minutes to go, we aren't feeding Zeke. Why? Not because Zeke isn't good, because you need to score quickly and preserve clock.

These statistics say the we didn't feed Zeke in situations where running the ball would be stupid.

Whirlwin · Jul 29, 2020

McKDaddy said:
No I see an honest assessment. It doesn't preclude that Elliott could be less than he was in 2016. But he could also be exactly the same player but running behind a less dominant line, with defenses keying on him and with a QB that wasn't making defenses pay thru the air the resulting in less success per play.
Just to be clear, I think Elliott hurt a hip in 2017 (could have been 2018) & he has never looked quite the same. But I believe he has generally gotten more than has been blocked throughout his career including 2019. So he's one of the last players I'm going to blame for the teams results.

Dak on the other hand has clearly struggled against better teams & without Zeke, Amari, etc..

I'm not trying to pit the two against each other. Simply offering what I believe is the boiled down reason for why things haven't been as easy since 2016.

But it’s not true. That Prescott struggles against better teams. He actually has better statistics when he plays better teams. It’s just that our team sucks. Don’t fall for the propaganda

Starforever · Jul 29, 2020

aria said:
Should read my posts? Lol, I’m quite sure I know what I wrote, I don’t need to write them. Maybe you should actually read my posts and try separating the ones I when I express my personal feelings of the person vs the ones where I express my feelings of the player, there’s a clear difference, I hope you can figure it out.

Since you clearly haven’t read all of my posts but like to act like you have, lets start with why you think anyone who doesn’t think a player deserves as much as he can get, regardless of skill, position, etc, means that person is jealous and envious of that player?

That’s the lamest accusation I’ve ever heard but not a completely uncommon one. You’re the second or third person I’ve heard say this.

And what’s really funny is that I can produce stat after stat after stat proving you wrong but you are the one who won’t budge off your opinion which you will have little to no factual support to back it up. In other words, I could say the sky is blue and you’ll tell me I’m wrong but have nothing to back it up. That is about as simple minded as it gets.

Mr. Simpleton, if the sky is gray, and you say it's blue. I will definitely disagree. You have no facts to back up anything you've stated. Move on to another subject, because when it comes down to Zeke, you are never objective.

aria · Jul 29, 2020

Starforever said:
Mr. Simpleton, if the sky is gray, and you say it's blue. I will definitely disagree. You have no facts to back up anything you've stated. Move on to another subject, because when it comes down to Zeke, you are never objective.

I’m glad you posted this but it shows even the people who disagree with me how full of crap you are, when I’ve posted about zeke the player I almost always support it with links and facts which is much more than the people who I’m arguing with do. All you can point to is total yards which is almost always a result of most carries which is a direct result of play calling. That has little to do with the actual player and everything to do with the coaching and a good deal to do with the O line.

So what specifically have I said that you disagree with that relates specifically to zeke as a player, not the person? Since your mentally handicapped or illiterate or both, I’ll be more than happy to provide you with the facts you claim I don’t support even though I already have which is proof you don’t know near as much about my posting as you claim to.

The balls in your court big daddy, put up or shut up.

Aviano90 · Jul 29, 2020

aria said:
I’m glad you posted this but it shows even the people who disagree with me how full of crap you are, when I’ve posted about zeke the player I almost always support it with links and facts which is much more than the people who I’m arguing with do. All you can point to is total yards which is almost always a result of most carries which is a direct result of play calling. That has little to do with the actual player and everything to do with the coaching and a good deal to do with the O line.

So what specifically have I said that you disagree with that relates specifically to zeke as a player, not the person? Since your mentally handicapped or illiterate or both, I’ll be more than happy to provide you with the facts you claim I don’t support even though I already have which is proof you don’t know near as much about my posting as you claim to.

The balls in your court big daddy, put up or shut up.

They don’t like the advanced analytics that show he isn’t as good as they think he is. You need to post that link again with the in depth analysis and ask what they disagree with and ask them to back it up with facts and not perceptions.

aria · Jul 30, 2020

Aviano90 said:
They don’t like the advanced analytics that show he isn’t as good as they think he is. You need to post that link again with the in depth analysis and ask what they disagree with and ask them to back it up with facts and not perceptions.

Most of them don’t even read the links or stats I post that counter their argument yet they continue to claim they’re right

They also think because I don’t like zeke personally or don’t have him ranked as high as they do, that somehow the numbers that zeke put up himself, along with every other running back in the league, and the statistics themselves are all biased. It’s pathetic, they continue to support an argument that facts contradict. It would be like if they told me he had the most rushing yards in 2016 and I said “no he didn’t”. They come back, post a link to the stats showing he had the most yards and I say “I don’t care what those numbers say, you’re a homer so they can’t be right, he didn’t have the most yards”. Unbelievable, worse than arguing with a child.

QuincyCarterEra · Jul 30, 2020

Aviano90 said:
They don’t like the advanced analytics that show he isn’t as good as they think he is. You need to post that link again with the in depth analysis and ask what they disagree with and ask them to back it up with facts and not perceptions.

100%

McKDaddy · Jul 30, 2020

Whirlwin said:
But it’s not true. That Prescott struggles against better teams. He actually has better statistics when he plays better teams. It’s just that our team sucks. Don’t fall for the propaganda

Whirl, I just don't know how anyone could believe that. The higher the competition its only natural for all QB's to struggle to be as efficient. But he is generally down significantly with a putrid rating before his stat line starts improving. I don't really care what your final stat line is when its salvaged as the other team is just protecting their lead. It's been 4 years. Even if you ignore his first two years as learning curve, you've still got 2 years to grade. Last year alone you could argue that we lost every game against above average competition. Saints, GB, Minn, NE & Buffalo. That's not even counting the losses against hapless Bears, Eagles & Jets. Its a team game no doubt but an above average QB has to be able to make a few more plays that pull out some victories in those games. The defense held the other teams to reasonable score in at least 4 of those. If any QB gets all that was there, fine. Its not their fault. But when I watch the games, too often i see missed opportunities. Against better competition those generally mean defeat.

If the 2020 season fails to launch, I propose that each week the CZ watch game from 2019 & break down Dak's performance on a grading scale. Maybe that way we could come to some consensus that eliminates statistical interpretation & emotional attachment.

aria · Jul 30, 2020

Aviano90 said:
They don’t like the advanced analytics that show he isn’t as good as they think he is. You need to post that link again with the in depth analysis and ask what they disagree with and ask them to back it up with facts and not perceptions.

I’m still waiting on his reply to see what he calls me out on that I haven’t backed up with facts. Looking forward to it but I’m sure like the rest them he will stop responding or come up with some lame excuse like he already has.

“You can’t post facts because your biased...they can’t be real because your biased” is essentially what he and a few others have said.

Portnoy1 · Jul 30, 2020

aria said:
Zeke faced stacked boxes less than he ever has in his career last year and less than ~23 other RB’s. Zeke demands respect from the public when even defenses don’t respect him anymore.

We can also run on the Skins, Giants and Dolphins which is why over half the games zeke ran for 100 yards last season were against those 3 teams who also happened to all be in the bottom 5 defensively.

People want to bash Dak for racking up yards against garbage teams but zeke gets a free pass and is actually applauded for it “he had more yards than any other RB”....just not against good teams mostly.

*funny you brought up the Broncos, the same game the huffy diva quit on his team. Real winner! That guy can’t handle the slightest bit of adversity, he’s been feeding alright, off a silver spoon his entire collegiate and NFL career. I would love to see him play behind the Giants O line, he would be tapping out or sitting out after the first quarter.

PREACH!!!!!!!!

QuincyCarterEra · Jul 30, 2020

Starforever said:
Mr. Simpleton, if the sky is gray, and you say it's blue. I will definitely disagree. You have no facts to back up anything you've stated. Move on to another subject, because when it comes down to Zeke, you are never objective.

Lol it stinks you can't delete this at this point after getting taken to school by "mr simpleton"

Whirlwin · Jul 31, 2020

McKDaddy said:
Whirl, I just don't know how anyone could believe that. The higher the competition its only natural for all QB's to struggle to be as efficient. But he is generally down significantly with a putrid rating before his stat line starts improving. I don't really care what your final stat line is when its salvaged as the other team is just protecting their lead. It's been 4 years. Even if you ignore his first two years as learning curve, you've still got 2 years to grade. Last year alone you could argue that we lost every game against above average competition. Saints, GB, Minn, NE & Buffalo. That's not even counting the losses against hapless Bears, Eagles & Jets. Its a team game no doubt but an above average QB has to be able to make a few more plays that pull out some victories in those games. The defense held the other teams to reasonable score in at least 4 of those. If any QB gets all that was there, fine. Its not their fault. But when I watch the games, too often i see missed opportunities. Against better competition those generally mean defeat.

If the 2020 season fails to launch, I propose that each week the CZ watch game from 2019 & break down Dak's performance on a grading scale. Maybe that way we could come to some consensus that eliminates statistical interpretation & emotional attachment.

Prescott has been the only consistently positive thing about this offense. How can you not understand that. Elliot turmoil Lost are starting center wide receiver tight end in one season. And last year Garrett was a disaster. Nope I totally disagree with you

Whirlwin · Jul 31, 2020

McKDaddy said:
No I see an honest assessment. It doesn't preclude that Elliott could be less than he was in 2016. But he could also be exactly the same player but running behind a less dominant line, with defenses keying on him and with a QB that wasn't making defenses pay thru the air the resulting in less success per play.
Just to be clear, I think Elliott hurt a hip in 2017 (could have been 2018) & he has never looked quite the same. But I believe he has generally gotten more than has been blocked throughout his career including 2019. So he's one of the last players I'm going to blame for the teams results.

Dak on the other hand has clearly struggled against better teams & without Zeke, Amari, etc..

I'm not trying to pit the two against each other. Simply offering what I believe is the boiled down reason for why things haven't been as easy since 2016.

Prescott has not struggled against better teams is actually played Better. His statistics will show that. It’s the team that hasn’t played very well against better teams. That’s the fact not opinion

McKDaddy · Jul 31, 2020

Whirlwin said:
Prescott has not struggled against better teams is actually played Better. His statistics will show that. It’s the team that hasn’t played very well against better teams. That’s the fact not opinion

Facts? Don't know how you can say that. Statistics are simply a summary of measurements without context. True analysis of individual play within a team sport is much different than statistics but inevitably to some degree opinion.
I have stated my reasons as clearly as i know how. If you disagree, that's fine.

Twitter: Since 2016 feeding Zeke has 0 correlation to winning

Well-Known Member

Cowboy , It’s a way of life.

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Cowboy , It’s a way of life.

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Go Seahawks!!!

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Cowboy , It’s a way of life.

Cowboy , It’s a way of life.

Well-Known Member