MM explains his thought process of going for 2

Runwildboys · Sep 21, 2020

Future said:
The reason he gave is stupid. Knowing whether it is a one- or two-score game doesn't have to change anything in how you approach the remainder.

Yes it does. For one thing, you know you have to allow more time for an onside kick and ensuing drive. Had they only gone for the extra point, then they would've been playing for the tie at the end, and would've been chewing up the clock. Had they done that and missed the 2 point conversion, game over. Add to that, the fact that even if they make the 2, now it goes into OT, which is still a gamble, considering our defense.

droopdog7 · Sep 21, 2020

Cowboy4ever said:
Basically for your logic to really be sound, you have to assume they miss the 2 pt conversion later. You are drawing that conclusion because they missed it earlier. I don't draw the same conclusion because it has no correlation, just because they missed it then doesn't automatically mean they miss it later. Lots of things could have happened to change the outcome. I didn't like the call then and I don't like it now, even with the explanation. Nothing is going to change that. I am super happy it worked out but nothing is going to ever convince me it was the right call. We got lucky, period.

Hell friggin' yeah you have to assume you miss the try on the second. Otherwise, what in the world are you arguing?

I guess you're saying that you think we had a better chance of making the 2-point conversion after the second versus the first td. Okay, but that's not what the actual argument is about. Not even close.

CowboyRoy · Sep 21, 2020

Uncle_Hank said:
If you make the conversion, you're only down 7. Would you rather be down by 8 or by 7?

If you make the two and your down 7, next time around do you kick the 1 and tie or go for 2? Again...………...simple. You go for the 1.

droopdog7 · Sep 21, 2020

Keithfansince5 said:
Yep, start with your inability to comprehend what you read.

People have zero reasoning skills is the issue. Unfortunately those people don't understand what they don't understand.

CowboyRoy · Sep 21, 2020

Jay said:
You can argue this until you’re red in the face but your logic is severely, severely flawed.

Sure, so tell me why everyone goes for the 1? Waiting...………………………………..

CowboyRoy · Sep 21, 2020

droopdog7 said:
Just because you say everyone does it doesn't make it true now does it.

No, its the fact that they actually all do it. Not one of you have been able to answer that question.

Keithfansince5 · Sep 21, 2020

Uncle_Hank said:
If you make the conversion, you're only down 7. Would you rather be down by 8 or by 7?

Notice the tiny little word IF. Kinda a big deal. But to answer your question given the 4 minutes left in the game scenario, I would take being down by 8. Why? Because it is easy to kick PAT's compared to scoring 2 pointers. Not a 100% gimme but fairly close. Perhaps 98% chance? Scoring a 2 point conversion? Maybe a 25% chance? Just ask the Patriots how easy it is.

Either way, your scenario or mine still calls for making a 2 pointer. I just prefer doing it when I absolutely have to do it or lose rather than doing it just because. My biggest reason is IF (there is that word again) you DON'T make it, you are down by 9 points. Now that is a HUGE difference. 9 requires you to have 2 scoring drives. 8 doesn't. 9 requires you to have to recover an onside kick which is the hardest thing to do in football. No way am I banking on that. The risk is GIGANTIC vs the reward. It is very clear to those who can see.

mkindred · Sep 21, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
LOL...…...yah, but if we make it we don't lose. Whats easier, scoring once and making a 2 or scoring twice with little time left? Easy stuff. Its why everyone goes for the 1 and not the 2.

Huh? Yeah, making the 2 obviously helps. But it seems like you are assuming if you went for 2 later it was automatic. We needed 15 points - I’d rather fail early and come up with a plan rather than fail later where we would have chewed up as much clock as possible to prevent them from trying to get into FG range at the end to seal a victory.

droopdog7 · Sep 21, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
If you make the two and your down 7, next time around do you kick the 1 and tie or go for 2? Again...………...simple. You go for the 1.

Yes, and having made the conversion the first time you also know that you want to leave as little clock as possible to avoid giving the other team more time. That is a clear advantage, versus having to weigh the possibility that you might miss the conversion.

CowboyRoy · Sep 21, 2020

mkindred said:
Huh? Yeah, making the 2 obviously helps. But it seems like you are assuming if you went for 2 later it was automatic. We needed 15 points - I’d rather fail early and come up with a plan rather than fail later where we would have chewed up as much clock as possible to prevent them from trying to get into FG range at the end to seal a victory.

I would rather have to score 8 points, which I can get in one drive, then have to score 9 points, which takes two drives.

Not tough stuff.

droopdog7 · Sep 21, 2020

Keithfansince5 said:
Notice the tiny little word IF. Kinda a big deal. But to answer your question given the 4 minutes left in the game scenario, I would take being down by 8. Why? Because it is easy to kick PAT's compared to scoring 2 pointers. Not a 100% gimme but fairly close. Perhaps 98% chance? Scoring a 2 point conversion? Maybe a 25% chance? Just ask the Patriots how easy it is.

Either way, your scenario or mine still calls for making a 2 pointer. I just prefer doing it when I absolutely have to do it or lose rather than doing it just because. My biggest reason is IF (there is that word again) you DON'T make it, you are down by 9 points. Now that is a HUGE difference. 9 requires you to have 2 scoring drives. 8 doesn't. 9 requires you to have to recover an onside kick which is the hardest thing to do in football. No way am I banking on that. The risk is GIGANTIC vs the reward. It is very clear to those who can see.

Fantastical fail all around. My goodness gracious.

HungryLion · Sep 21, 2020

JD_KaPow said:
They DID miss the 2 point conversion. And they WON.
I'll keep asking: what's your plan if they kick the XP and then miss the 2-pointer late? What is your plan then if it isn't to attempt an onside kick?

You only need the onside kick if you FAIL at the 2-point conversion. Conversely, if you fail at the 2-point conversion, NO MATTER WHEN YOU FAIL, you will always need the onside kick.

Bless your heart. The other poster is too dense to understand it.

Runwildboys · Sep 21, 2020

TheSkaven said:
It was me. And yes, this is exactly it.

You brought it up during the game, and got treated like an idiot by several posters. @JD_KaPow started a thread about it too, so I don't know which of you the OP is referring to.

droopdog7 · Sep 21, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
No, its the fact that they actually all do it. Not one of you have been able to answer that question.

show me then

Uncle_Hank · Sep 21, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
If you make the two and your down 7, next time around do you kick the 1 and tie or go for 2? Again...………...simple. You go for the 1.

Yes, that's why you get the two-point conversion out of the way while you still have time on the clock. If you miss it at the end, you're in worse shape than if you miss it sooner, because now you're out of time.

CowboyRoy · Sep 21, 2020

droopdog7 said:
Yes, and having made the conversion the first time you also know that you want to leave as little clock as possible to avoid giving the other team more time. That is a clear advantage, versus having to weigh the possibility that you might miss the conversion.

Sorry, having to score 9 and needing two drives is NOT an advantage. Having to only score 8 and once is an advantage.

Keithfansince5 · Sep 21, 2020

DOUBLE WING said:
If you kick an XP after the first TD, and fail the 2 point conversion after the second one you still have to attempt an onside kick, so what difference does it make? What part of this are you not understanding?

Because likely there is no time left on the clock. A big part of this discussion is that Dallas had 4 minutes left in the game. If we had 8 minutes OK it is not critical yet. Scoring, then stopping ATL then scoring again all in under 4 minutes is a very tall order. Catching this lightning in a bottle is the odd anomaly that will always be the exception not the rule.

Keithfansince5 · Sep 21, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
Sorry, having to score 9 and needing two drives is NOT an advantage. Having to only score 8 and once is an advantage.

I think they live in an alternate universe where what they are describing makes sense. SMH

droopdog7 · Sep 21, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
Sorry, having to score 9 and needing two drives is NOT an advantage. Having to only score 8 and once is an advantage.

We tried to score 8 and ended up scoring 6. What part of that can't you understand? You don't get a do over on the 2-point conversion.

droopdog7 · Sep 21, 2020

Keithfansince5 said:
I think they live in an alternate universe where what they are describing makes sense. SMH

Finally something we can agree on. One of us is crazy.

MM explains his thought process of going for 2

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