Defense still matters if you want playoff success

CouchCoach · Sep 22, 2020

gimmesix said:
I'm kind of hoping for a 2007 Giants-type thing with the defense. They weren't that good for the first half of the season then peaked for the second half and the playoffs. I don't think we have the same talent as that defense, but we've got some good players if we use them right and some young ones who could come on to elevate the play of the unit.

They got players back on that defense and the Cowboys made the mistake of thinking that was the same team they swept in the regular season.

MyFairLady · Sep 22, 2020

gimmesix said:
I'm kind of hoping for a 2007 Giants-type thing with the defense. They weren't that good for the first half of the season then peaked for the second half and the playoffs. I don't think we have the same talent as that defense, but we've got some good players if we use them right and some young ones who could come on to elevate the play of the unit.

Is this the defense that won the super bowl beating the Pats holding them to 14 points. The defense that had the awesome pass rush using only 4 rushers. I gotta say this is very optimistic. Personally I am OK with how the defense has played. There are a few promising young guys that we can hope will improve as the season goes. As long as we cling to players like Crawford, Lawrence, Jaylon, LVE, Lee and Gregory we are not going to get a whole lot better. Just gradually worse.

Rayman70 · Sep 22, 2020

I do not mean this to be rude, but I have to question Jaylons love of the game. Does he love what the game does FOR HIM, or does he love what he can do FOR the game and his team? There is a big difference.Or maybe he isn't the guy the front office thought he was. Its not his fault if thats the case. Could it be as simple as he just isn't good enough? I do like him as a rotational guy, a edge blitzer, or a guy that shoots the gap and rushes the middle. But NEVER do we need to have him out on an island in coverage. He is a liability. He needs a pay reduction and a role reduction. Lets bring up Francis BERNARD and get him ready.He is the future.

gimmesix · Sep 22, 2020

MyFairLady said:
Is this the defense that won the super bowl beating the Pats holding them to 14 points. The defense that had the awesome pass rush using only 4 rushers. I gotta say this is very optimistic. Personally I am OK with how the defense has played. There are a few promising young guys that we can hope will improve as the season goes. As long as we cling to players like Crawford, Lawrence, Jaylon, LVE, Lee and Gregory we are not going to get a whole lot better. Just gradually worse.

I don't think it is on that level, but neither did fans of the Giants early that season. Players like Aldon Smith, Griffen and Lawrence will have to find their stride in this defense and Nolan might have to show the ability to adjust in order to let them do it. Will that happen? I doubt it, but I'm not counting anything out after two games.

kskboys · Sep 22, 2020

Bobhaze said:
I don’t need to spend time describing how bad our defense has looked. We know. Yes, there have been injuries, but it didn’t look that great on paper when everyone was healthy.

Much of the offseason Koolaide being drunk by some of our fans centered on the idea that our offense is so good, we can out score teams in most games, and hope the defense just keeps it close enough for the offense to win 11 or 12 and win some playoff shoot outs. After all, the NFL has certainly become an offense heavy league where the rules completely favor offense.

But despite all that, the teams winning in the playoffs mostly still have some of the league’s better defenses. You have to have a respectable defense to win. Looking at last years playoff teams, that bears out:

10 of last year’s 12 playoff teams had top 15 defenses.

Even the chiefs had an underrated defense, ranking 9th last year.

The two teams in last year’s SB both had top ten defenses.

The chiefs were 5th in the league in sacks and INTs.

Turnovers and sacks are very predictive of playoff success. Teams with a combined sack/turnover amount of 50+ are historically good bets to win big in the playoffs.

I’m glad we have a good offense. But that is never enough. Apparently, Jerry loves his jersey sales more than playoff contention. Because until this organization starts really investing in some top notch young defensive talent in the draft, coupled with an occasional top FA on defense, we’re probably going to continue what we’ve been getting for a long time- a lot of 8-8 seasons.

Chiefs had the best D in the NFL for the last 6 games. Held 3 of their last 6 opponents to single digits. They changed D's last year, and it took a bit to jell.

kskboys · Sep 22, 2020

ultron said:
That’s not true, Jaylon is statistically Luke Kuechley (go look at their stats last year - they’re identical), but he can’t be ultra aggressive like he really is because he gets penalized every time he blows someone the F up (ie: the Julio play on Sunday). The league wants soft linebackers and safeties - that’s not who Jaylon is but he’s forced to play soft.

I know this is in jest.

plasticman · Sep 22, 2020

I'm thinking it's going to take longer for the defense to start improving. New defensive coaches and system, shortened training camp, injuries......

However, I do believe they will get better as the season progresses. Hopefully, they can get a few guys back healthy just in time for the momentum building Thanksgiving game. Would be great to get back LVE, Gregory, perhaps Lee as well. If they were to rejoin the team at just the right time they would be fresh and really provide a boost. For now, they just have to keep fighting.

For now, it looks like the best defense is going to be offense. Keep scoring and eat up that clock.

PAPPYDOG · Sep 22, 2020

Bobhaze said:
I don’t need to spend time describing how bad our defense has looked. We know. Yes, there have been injuries, but it didn’t look that great on paper when everyone was healthy.

Much of the offseason Koolaide being drunk by some of our fans centered on the idea that our offense is so good, we can out score teams in most games, and hope the defense just keeps it close enough for the offense to win 11 or 12 and win some playoff shoot outs. After all, the NFL has certainly become an offense heavy league where the rules completely favor offense.

But despite all that, the teams winning in the playoffs mostly still have some of the league’s better defenses. You have to have a respectable defense to win. Looking at last years playoff teams, that bears out:

10 of last year’s 12 playoff teams had top 15 defenses.

Even the chiefs had an underrated defense, ranking 9th last year.

The two teams in last year’s SB both had top ten defenses.

The chiefs were 5th in the league in sacks and INTs.

Turnovers and sacks are very predictive of playoff success. Teams with a combined sack/turnover amount of 50+ are historically good bets to win big in the playoffs.

I’m glad we have a good offense. But that is never enough. Apparently, Jerry loves his jersey sales more than playoff contention. Because until this organization starts really investing in some top notch young defensive talent in the draft, coupled with an occasional top FA on defense, we’re probably going to continue what we’ve been getting for a long time- a lot of 8-8 seasons.

Our defense has been top 10 the last years the primary reasons for our failures is the ineptness of our offense to score points early and in total against teams with winning records.
You can only ask soooooo much from any defense but at some point they will over-run if the offense isn't keeping up point wise.

CowboysFaninHouston · Sep 22, 2020

Bobhaze said:
I don’t need to spend time describing how bad our defense has looked. We know. Yes, there have been injuries, but it didn’t look that great on paper when everyone was healthy.

Much of the offseason Koolaide being drunk by some of our fans centered on the idea that our offense is so good, we can out score teams in most games, and hope the defense just keeps it close enough for the offense to win 11 or 12 and win some playoff shoot outs. After all, the NFL has certainly become an offense heavy league where the rules completely favor offense.

But despite all that, the teams winning in the playoffs mostly still have some of the league’s better defenses. You have to have a respectable defense to win. Looking at last years playoff teams, that bears out:

10 of last year’s 12 playoff teams had top 15 defenses.

Even the chiefs had an underrated defense, ranking 9th last year.

The two teams in last year’s SB both had top ten defenses.

The chiefs were 5th in the league in sacks and INTs.

Turnovers and sacks are very predictive of playoff success. Teams with a combined sack/turnover amount of 50+ are historically good bets to win big in the playoffs.

I’m glad we have a good offense. But that is never enough. Apparently, Jerry loves his jersey sales more than playoff contention. Because until this organization starts really investing in some top notch young defensive talent in the draft, coupled with an occasional top FA on defense, we’re probably going to continue what we’ve been getting for a long time- a lot of 8-8 seasons.

I totally agree. a good offense will get you to the playoffs with an average even below average defense, but to get to championship you need to have a decent defense, if you have average defense, you better have exceptional offense.

Bobhaze · Sep 22, 2020

CowboysFaninHouston said:
I totally agree. a good offense will get you to the playoffs with an average even below average defense, but to get to championship you need to have a decent defense, if you have average defense, you better have exceptional offense.

Or if you don’t have a great D, have one that gets TOs. That saints team in 09 that won it all didn’t have a super talented defense but they got a ton of turnovers, including a pick 6 in the SB.

Bobhaze · Sep 22, 2020

PAPPYDOG said:
Our defense has been top 10 the last years the primary reasons for our failures is the ineptness of our offense to score points early and in total against teams with winning records.
You can only ask soooooo much from any defense but at some point they will over-run if the offense isn't keeping up point wise.

Here are our defense’s NFL Total defense rankings as well as the offense’s rankings the last six seasons:

2014- Defense ranked 19th, offense ranked 5th
2015- D- 16th, O- 31st
2016- D 5th, O 5th
2017- D 13th, O 14th
2018- D 6th, O 22nd
2019- D 11th, O 6th

Pap, that’s only two times in the last six seasons we’ve had top ten D’s. I’m not disagreeing that our offense has had problems scoring at times, but you can’t say the defense has been consistently good either. The offense has had a top ten offense 3 of the last 6 years. Bottom line, this team has been mediocre too often, and its record shows.

PAPPYDOG · Sep 23, 2020

It averages out to 11th the past 6 years not bad overall.
Now when you hold teams to 20 points and under and still lose the burden falls on the offense to score points!!!!!

TWOK11 · Sep 23, 2020

The defense has been above average for 5/8 quarters so far this year. It really hasn’t been that bad.

plasticman · Sep 23, 2020

You would have to have an historically prolific offense in order to win a championship without a really good defense.

You have to go back 8 Super Bowls to find a team that wasn't ranked a top 7 in scoring defense and many of them were #1, a few in both categories. But that team 8 years ago was the Ravens ranked #12 and we all know that defense was just screwing around until the playoffs.

Of course there are exceptions to the rule and Eli and the Giants were an exception to every rule ever written.

DuncanIso · Sep 23, 2020

TWOK11 said:
The defense has been above average for 5/8 quarters so far this year. It really hasn’t been that bad.

ranked 25th.

DuncanIso · Sep 23, 2020

plasticman said:
I'm thinking it's going to take longer for the defense to start improving. New defensive coaches and system, shortened training camp, injuries......

However, I do believe they will get better as the season progresses. Hopefully, they can get a few guys back healthy just in time for the momentum building Thanksgiving game. Would be great to get back LVE, Gregory, perhaps Lee as well. If they were to rejoin the team at just the right time they would be fresh and really provide a boost. For now, they just have to keep fighting.

For now, it looks like the best defense is going to be offense. Keep scoring and eat up that clock.

ranked 11th last season.

ranked 25th now.

not a Marinelli fan, but ....

Defense still matters if you want playoff success

CouchCoach

MyFairLady

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Rayman70

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gimmesix

Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life

kskboys

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kskboys

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plasticman

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PAPPYDOG

There are no Dak haters just Cowboy lovers!!!

CowboysFaninHouston

CowboysFaninDC

Bobhaze

Bobhaze

PAPPYDOG

There are no Dak haters just Cowboy lovers!!!

TWOK11

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plasticman

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DuncanIso

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DuncanIso

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