Give me a top 10 pick and an offseason to properly install a defense

Jake

Jake

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TheSkaven said:
Good post, agree 100%. And let’s be honest, one thing that this team really has been good at over the past decade is the NFL DRAFT. Based on their hit rate, I do trust them to make those picks count.
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This hit rate? (stolen from @Bobhaze)

Drafting defensive players with premium picks since 2015 has not been good:
  • 2015- 1st round- Byron Jones- CB- good player but let go in FA.
  • 2015- 2nd round- Randy Gregory- DE- Been a complete waste of a premium draft spot
  • 2016- 2nd round Jaylon Smith- LB- has been an overpaid- average at best LB
  • 2016- 3rd round Malik Collins- DT- a solid not spectacular player, let go in FA
  • 2017- 1st round- Taco Charlton- DE- a complete bust
  • 2017- 2nd round- Chidobe Awuzie- CB- been avg at best. Hurt at the moment.
  • 2017- 3rd round- Jourdan Lewis- CB- All I can say is meh.
  • 2018- 1st round- LVE- LB- Injuries have made him irrelevant
  • 2019- (gave up a 1st pick for Amari Cooper)
  • 2019- 2nd round- Trysten Hill- DT- Avoiding the bust label by a thread
  • I'll add:
  • 2020 - Gallimore, Anae, and Robinson can't get on the field. Diggs looks like he'll be good.
The excuses here never end. Cleveland went through a total coaching change just like Dallas - they're 3-1. Carolina did as well, they've won their last 2 games with McCaffrey on IR and they have the youngest defense in the NFL.

Jerry and Stephen screwed the pooch again. I'm not getting my hopes up that they're going to fix it. That would be foolish.
 

stilltheguru

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Jake said:
This hit rate? (stolen from @Bobhaze)

Drafting defensive players with premium picks since 2015 has not been good:
  • 2015- 1st round- Byron Jones- CB- good player but let go in FA.
  • 2015- 2nd round- Randy Gregory- DE- Been a complete waste of a premium draft spot
  • 2016- 2nd round Jaylon Smith- LB- has been an overpaid- average at best LB
  • 2016- 3rd round Malik Collins- DT- a solid not spectacular player, let go in FA
  • 2017- 1st round- Taco Charlton- DE- a complete bust
  • 2017- 2nd round- Chidobe Awuzie- CB- been avg at best. Hurt at the moment.
  • 2017- 3rd round- Jourdan Lewis- CB- All I can say is meh.
  • 2018- 1st round- LVE- LB- Injuries have made him irrelevant
  • 2019- (gave up a 1st pick for Amari Cooper)
  • 2019- 2nd round- Trysten Hill- DT- Avoiding the bust label by a thread
  • I'll add:
  • 2020 - Gallimore, Anae, and Robinson can't get on the field. Diggs looks like he'll be good.
The excuses here never end. Cleveland went through a total coaching change just like Dallas - they're 3-1. Carolina did as well, they've won their last 2 games with McCaffrey on IR and they have the youngest defense in the NFL.

Jerry and Stephen screwed the pooch again. I'm not getting my hopes up that they're going to fix it. That would be foolish.
Click to expand...
People think things will change when Jerry dies :lmao:
Like Stephen isnt even worse with an ego just as big.
 
TheSkaven

TheSkaven

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Jake said:
This hit rate? (stolen from @Bobhaze)

Drafting defensive players with premium picks since 2015 has not been good:
  • 2015- 1st round- Byron Jones- CB- good player but let go in FA.
  • 2015- 2nd round- Randy Gregory- DE- Been a complete waste of a premium draft spot
  • 2016- 2nd round Jaylon Smith- LB- has been an overpaid- average at best LB
  • 2016- 3rd round Malik Collins- DT- a solid not spectacular player, let go in FA
  • 2017- 1st round- Taco Charlton- DE- a complete bust
  • 2017- 2nd round- Chidobe Awuzie- CB- been avg at best. Hurt at the moment.
  • 2017- 3rd round- Jourdan Lewis- CB- All I can say is meh.
  • 2018- 1st round- LVE- LB- Injuries have made him irrelevant
  • 2019- (gave up a 1st pick for Amari Cooper)
  • 2019- 2nd round- Trysten Hill- DT- Avoiding the bust label by a thread
  • I'll add:
  • 2020 - Gallimore, Anae, and Robinson can't get on the field. Diggs looks like he'll be good.
The excuses here never end. Cleveland went through a total coaching change just like Dallas - they're 3-1. Carolina did as well, they've won their last 2 games with McCaffrey on IR and they have the youngest defense in the NFL.

Jerry and Stephen screwed the pooch again. I'm not getting my hopes up that they're going to fix it. That would be foolish.
Click to expand...

Very interesting. I didn't look at the data, was just projecting based on my gut. Seeing this, it looks like they are done well with offense but failed miserably with defense. On offense of course almost their entire offense was home grown; Dak Prescott, Ezekiel Elliott, Michael Gallup, CeeDee Lamb, Tyron Smith, La'El Collins, Zack Martin, heck throw in Connor Williams.

But do you think that this defense is without talent? Let's take the defensive line. We know Everson Griffen can play because we've seen him play in Minnesota. Aldon Smith was a crazy talent and should still have something left in the tank. DeMarcus Lawrence did play well at one point in his career to get that big contract. Likewise Tyrone Crawford has played well in the past.

This defense might not be the 85 Bears but they're not this bad. And it's not all that different a team than 2019 and 2018. Bottom line, this isn't all about the players - it has to do with scheme I think.
 
MikeB80

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The frigging browns seemed to be fine and they made more changes than Dallas did.

Bottom line this is a horrendous organization. Stephen Jones running this organization will never produce a winner.
 
cowboysfan99

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You know if Jerry has a top ten pick then he'll go with a QB, RB, or WR. It's all he knows. I feel like this team was improving because they were overriding Jerry's draft choices (he wanted to draft Manziel instead of Zack Martin), but once they got a decent core going he took over drafting again in 2016.
 
ConstantReboot

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Parcells4Life said:
This whole situation which I said from july was a season just being done to keep continuity of the league afloat, has actually positioned Dallas well with the Eagles win tonight. They’d currently have the No. 9 pick

If you’re not a true contender and right now Dallas is not, the best is to get the best draft pick possible and let McCarthy actually have an offseason to assess this team.

Aside from Diggs, there’s no sure answer of who will still be on the team in 2 years on defense. He may be the only member of the secondary here even next year. The DL is all a mismatch of past their prime vets and underachieving draft picks and the LBs have all had injuries rob them of their potential.

Dak is playing great but with LC out for the season, this team is not getting in a shootout with KC or Seattle and winning.

The worst thing that could happen is go 8-8 and win the East. Better to miss the playoffs and have a real offseason to assess the damage. I have confidence McCarthy can get it done. Most DCs should beg to come here. This offense can take 95% of teams deep into the playoffs.

I can’t totally blame Nolan because going from the most basic scheme in the last 25 years to one of the most exotic was always going to be a disaster without practice. But now they’re stuck in between. They don’t blitz but they don’t play soft to keep everything in front either.

I’m at least encouraged they’re trying a new scheme/personnel every week hoping something sticks and not just saying this is what we are.

Most likely just the 1st and 2nd round picks will be the ones to make a difference next year. So given that my top two wishes are a CB opposite Diggs and a LB that can tackle and stay healthy.
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I want nothing to do with Nolan. I can tell he just doesn't know what his doing. Dallas needs to get rid of him right now.

Go back to what Marinelli does well. Yes Marinelli had his flaws. But he is a good Dline coach. Why Nolan ever tried to change this defense with no talent, very little or no training at all is beyond me.

This defense is severely under-talented with injuries and players leaving for free agency.

Then Nolan comes in with his elaborate, 3-4 hybrid which confuses the hell out of everyone. Having Poe dropping back in pass defense is beyond dumb. That's why I want nothing from Nolan today and in the future.
 
ConstantReboot

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MikeB80 said:
The frigging browns seemed to be fine and they made more changes than Dallas did.

Bottom line this is a horrendous organization. Stephen Jones running this organization will never produce a winner.
Click to expand...


Browns did one thing right. They hired Bill Callahan and implemented their run offense. But Garrett chased him out because he wasn't a "YES" man like he is to Jerry.
 
Parcells4Life

Parcells4Life

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ConstantReboot said:
I want nothing to do with Nolan. I can tell he just doesn't know what his doing. Dallas needs to get rid of him right now.

Go back to what Marinelli does well. Yes Marinelli had his flaws. But he is a good Dline coach. Why Nolan ever tried to change this defense with no talent, very little or no training at all is beyond me.

This defense is severely under-talented with injuries and players leaving for free agency.

Then Nolan comes in with his elaborate, 3-4 hybrid which confuses the hell out of everyone. Having Poe dropping back in pass defense is beyond dumb. That's why I want nothing from Nolan today and in the future.
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Literally no one said this 9 months ago. Taco and Trysten were both labeled incompetent picks pushed by Marinelli. And his scheme was labeled worst in 25 years. Now 4 games in people want the old regime back.
 
Chuck 54

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If the defense doesn’t show significant improvement throughout the season, Nolan is absolutely gone, and if MM fights it, he will be gone too. Jerry won’t allow having a historically bad defense.
 
Majic

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Chuck 54 said:
If the defense doesn’t show significant improvement throughout the season, Nolan is absolutely gone, and if MM fights it, he will be gone too. Jerry won’t allow having a historically bad defense.
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As Bill Parcells once said 'if you want me to make the dinner, let me buy the groceries' We need the DEF to settle down and by competent and then the staff must be allowed to rebuild via the draft and free agency in 2021
 
ConstantReboot

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Parcells4Life said:
Literally no one said this 9 months ago. Taco and Trysten were both labeled incompetent picks pushed by Marinelli. And his scheme was labeled worst in 25 years. Now 4 games in people want the old regime back.
Click to expand...

I don't want the old regime back. No ways in hell.

But I don't like the Nolan pick. I had my doubts. But now I'm certain they made a mistake with Nolan.

I still don't like Taco and Trysten pick. The reason why we drafted Taco in the first place was because Randy Gregory was a bust.

Frank Clark was there for us to pick rather than Gregory.
 

Vintage

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Jake said:
This hit rate? (stolen from @Bobhaze)

Drafting defensive players with premium picks since 2015 has not been good:
  • 2015- 1st round- Byron Jones- CB- good player but let go in FA.
  • 2015- 2nd round- Randy Gregory- DE- Been a complete waste of a premium draft spot
  • 2016- 2nd round Jaylon Smith- LB- has been an overpaid- average at best LB
  • 2016- 3rd round Malik Collins- DT- a solid not spectacular player, let go in FA
  • 2017- 1st round- Taco Charlton- DE- a complete bust
  • 2017- 2nd round- Chidobe Awuzie- CB- been avg at best. Hurt at the moment.
  • 2017- 3rd round- Jourdan Lewis- CB- All I can say is meh.
  • 2018- 1st round- LVE- LB- Injuries have made him irrelevant
  • 2019- (gave up a 1st pick for Amari Cooper)
  • 2019- 2nd round- Trysten Hill- DT- Avoiding the bust label by a thread
  • I'll add:
  • 2020 - Gallimore, Anae, and Robinson can't get on the field. Diggs looks like he'll be good.
The excuses here never end. Cleveland went through a total coaching change just like Dallas - they're 3-1. Carolina did as well, they've won their last 2 games with McCaffrey on IR and they have the youngest defense in the NFL.

Jerry and Stephen screwed the pooch again. I'm not getting my hopes up that they're going to fix it. That would be foolish.
Click to expand...


Lol. How is Hill “avoiding bust label by a thread” and Diggs “looks like he’ll be good”?
 
CooterBrown

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Parcells4Life said:
We honestly don’t know what he is. He had no time to change the scheme and the players he does have are missing 5 starters. So it’s hard to know if it’s the scheme or just terrible players like Thompson letting OBJ go by them.

Worley is not an NFL starting CB. Jaylon has been a disaster. DLaw prior to this week was only showing up vs the run. Poe has been a terrible signing (I thought he’d be great). Joe Thomas has played well but he was cut on cutdown day in August and resigned. Lewis isn’t even making plays on the ball like he did last year.

Awuzie, Brown, LVE and Lee won’t make this a top 10 D, but I have to think it will at least be tougher for the offense to score 50
Click to expand...

Look at Nolan's career. His entire body of work, but mostly his recent years in Atlanta. "you are what your record says you are."
 
Parcells4Life

Parcells4Life

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CooterBrown said:
Look at Nolan's career. His entire body of work, but mostly his recent years in Atlanta. "you are what your record says you are."
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His record is also a lot of turnovers and sacks. You can live with a lot of yards if you’re making big plays yourself. That’s what’s been lacking this year.
 
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