Implications of McGovern playing well, this year and next

quickccc

quickccc

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Fla Cowpoke said:
Id keep Lael at RT and have Martin take LT. I think Lael would struggle on the left.
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I don't.
Lael is actually a left handed southpaw, and with his athleticism he would be more natural on the left than what he is on the right side.
I don't think he will ever be Tyron Smith dominant as Ty is just a HOF specimen. But I do believe Lael can be one of the top LTs in the NFL.
 
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- i think Williams has another year per contract, and i'm for keeping CWilliams around in the event Tyron does a Fredrick and suddenly retires,
and Collins type move to OT is a consideration.
. I have to wonder if all the neck-back injuries of the past has taken a toll on Tyron has to be thinking he doesn't these lingering injuries taking more of an effect
on his personal physical life. Who knows what occurring discomfort he could experiencing now.

- Dire emergency injury aside - I don't think we'll be able to see Williams working at LT this reg season, but its definitely something looking at this incoming offseason and camp,
given the pandemic is more at it's end -and we have the proper OL coach in Joe Philibin that will even look at that possibility.

- I'd like to have done everything if our powers and possibilities of getting the best out of Williams before deciding to move on from him per FA.
He's a former 2nd round pick and that's too high of a valuable pick knowing he could be a Packer type OL guy elsewhere at a different on the edge position and role.
 
quickccc

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Cowboyny said:
I believe the bigger issue is having a quality backup Tackle as we just don't know the long-term health of both our starters. We should be fine with our three interior lineman.
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- I'd really like to prepare ahead for a Tyron Smith eventual replacement in one capacity or another.

- That's either prepping Williams to be a utility swing OG/OT " when " Smith goes down with an injury in very near future, and trying him to see what he could be as a LT.
Or drafting a 3rd (just as we drafted McGovern early) or 4th rd type to gradually develop and start within next year or 2.

- My gut feeling tells me the Jones are gonna want to squeeze and drain every ounce of use outta Tyron until he suddenly retires or
he completely cannot compete at all on the field -even losing regularly battles to scrub journeymen like DEs.

- For whatever reason this team and management tends to prefer to hit the brick wall head on before finally deciding to address a certain position and need ahead of time.

Kudos to both McClay for acquiring serviceable Cam Erving and Brandon Knight and even sometimes questionable Joe Philibin for being able to have them prepared early injury setbacks.
Philbin has his pluses and minuses as to working with moving parts vs big hit injuries as the season has moved on.
 
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Cowboy4ever said:
I don’t believe this is true. They are banking in Tyron to be healthy. So when you look at the entire picture I think they are good with their ol. Smith Williams/ McGovern, the rookie center, Martin and Collins. They will have. Knight- who has played decent in relief, looney for all 3 interior positions, Williams/McGovern and Steele with more experience and time in the weight room. They may go for bpa in the 4th or later rounds and get an OL but I doubt they spend a premium pick on one.
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Neither do i.
i think the Jones will want to juice squeeze every ounce of usage outta Tyron before something makes him call it a career.
i'll betcha they'll prefer to handle and save his camp days
Have him ready for games and when he does occur those usual injury setbacks, have the likes of Cam Erving or Brandon Knight ready to step in.
 
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buybuydandavis said:
Despite a lack of snaps this year and last, McGovern is playing well. Currently in our healthy top 3, per PFF. That passes my eyeball test too. Looney and Knight round out my top 5.

Can't keep him on the field unless one of our top 2, Martin or Williams, plays T. Will Martin play T the rest of the year? And continue when Knight gets back?

Will Biadasz take over for Looney when he's back from IR? If Looney continues to play at his current level, and Jerry is determined to get that playoff berth to be crushed in round 1, I don't see Looney giving up the spot, though I hate to see Biadasz miss the chance for developmental snaps.

Then next year, with Collins and Tyron back at T, Martin goes back to G.
Then what?
McGovern fights Biadasz for C, and Williams for G.
At worst, he's first off the bench interior lineman. Maybe, finally, they cross train Williams for T?

Oline is looking pretty strong for next year, and McGovern is the focus of the decisions to be made.

Oline PFF Grades
90.8 Martin
71.0 Williams
67.8 Tyron - Out
67.8 McGovern
62.8 Looney
60.2 Knight
56.9 Erving
53.3 Biadasz
46.9 Steele
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Not me.
Biadasz should be inserted right back into that starting lineup once he is fully healthy,.
Biadasz is more of a natural pivot and has a better knack for the position and gets to the 2nd level of blocking than Looney does.
He's savvy beyond his rookie-ness, and meant for the future and there's no reason to place him right back on bench
for a decent vet backup.

what i sincerely hope does Not happen is if Biadasz returns as a starter, then Looney replaces McGovern.
If Biadasz does not get hurt …. Looney is not forced to sub in as a center,.. then McGovern does not get the start at RG.
if Looney does get the starting nod over McGovern, it's right back to the OL coach being sour on Conner McG and he'll
be right back to the bench, instead of having the chance to further develop.
 
Plankton

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Twisted Dawg said:
I'm not sure we can count on Biadasz long term. He had two different injuries in college, and now gets a hamstring injury while merely stretching during warm ups. He may be another glass body Sean Lee----good guy, hard worker, good player when healthy, but chronically injured.
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Biadasz never missed a game at Wisconsin, so I don't think he can be labeled as chronically injured. He played through a shoulder issue last year that he got surgery on in the offseason, and had a hamstring injury this year. I don't think that this is anything to raise a flag over.
 
Cowboyny

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quickccc said:
- I'd really like to prepare ahead for a Tyron Smith eventual replacement in one capacity or another.

- That's either prepping Williams to be a utility swing OG/OT " when " Smith goes down with an injury in very near future, and trying him to see what he could be as a LT.
Or drafting a 3rd (just as we drafted McGovern early) or 4th rd type to gradually develop and start within next year or 2.

- My gut feeling tells me the Jones are gonna want to squeeze and drain every ounce of use outta Tyron until he suddenly retires or
he completely cannot compete at all on the field -even losing regularly battles to scrub journeymen like DEs.

- For whatever reason this team and management tends to prefer to hit the brick wall head on before finally deciding to address a certain position and need ahead of time.

Kudos to both McClay for acquiring serviceable Cam Erving and Brandon Knight and even sometimes questionable Joe Philibin for being able to have them prepared early injury setbacks.
Philbin has his pluses and minuses as to working with moving parts vs big hit injuries as the season has moved on.
Click to expand...

-Well the bright side was they took McGovern as they didn't know the long-term status of Frederick. It was a pick for the future.

-I agree, need to start a developmental future starting Tackle. Giants took Peart towards the end of rd 3, he's the type we need to draft and start to develop.

-Tell you the truth, I'm more worried about Collins then I am about Tyron. Tyron has back issues that forces him to miss a few games every year, he usually misses 3 games per season, which is manageable, especially if he still is productive. Collins has had a few major injuries. There were also reports about him showing up at camp way overweight and out of shape, this could of lead to his hip injury, which needed surgery.

-Front Office has to be proactive and plan ahead as we don't know the long-term both of both our starting tackles.
 
Tussinman

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quickccc said:
I have to wonder if all the neck-back injuries of the past has taken a toll on Tyron has to be thinking he doesn't these lingering injuries taking more of an effect
on his personal physical life. Who knows what occurring discomfort he could experiencing now.
Click to expand...
Yeah Tyron purposely didn't have surgery because he didn't want to ruin what the team believe was there window to win (17, 18, and 19).

I can't imaging playing almost 4 years with borderline severe neck pain and then going under the knife during the lowest cowboys season since 2015.

If he comes back next season and makes the pro bowl then he might be legimately be the toughest dude i've ever seen (Frank Gores another one that's a iron workhorse)
 

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Running to the new & improved right side of the line proved successful. This is what happens when giving the new coaching staff time. Remember, this is the coaching staff's preseason!
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buybuydandavis

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quickccc said:
Not me.
Biadasz should be inserted right back into that starting lineup once he is fully healthy,.
Biadasz is more of a natural pivot and has a better knack for the position and gets to the 2nd level of blocking than Looney does.
He's savvy beyond his rookie-ness, and meant for the future and there's no reason to place him right back on bench
for a decent vet backup.

what i sincerely hope does Not happen is if Biadasz returns as a starter, then Looney replaces McGovern.
If Biadasz does not get hurt …. Looney is not forced to sub in as a center,.. then McGovern does not get the start at RG.
if Looney does get the starting nod over McGovern, it's right back to the OL coach being sour on Conner McG and he'll
be right back to the bench, instead of having the chance to further develop.
Click to expand...

It was weird to me how McGovern didn't seem to really get a chance to compete at LG against Williams, or Biadasz at C, especially with Williams coming to camp in a knee brace as he continued to ramp up from his surgery.

Like how Knight got simply bypassed by Steele, it just seemed like they didn't like McGovern much. But having got him on the field, he's played very well.

And on the flip side, the team has similarly disfavored Looney at G, not letting *him* compete for a starting spot at LG last year, or in 2017 either.

And with McGovern's youth, I really don't see Looney jumping him.

In the same vein, I generally believe in giving the push to the younger Biadasz if he's close to the older Looney, but I still think Looney is just a further beyond Biadasz for that push to win it for Biadasz. Looney has pleasantly surprised me this year.

I'd rather develop for next year with Biadasz, but if they want to *win* this year, and it seems they do, I see them giving it to Looney.
 

buybuydandavis

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Cowboyny said:
I believe the bigger issue is having a quality backup Tackle as we just don't know the long-term health of both our starters. We should be fine with our three interior lineman.
Click to expand...

Knight is quality enough at backup T for years to come. He should only improve. And there's Steele, and Hyatt, and some other guy to develop too. They obviously like Steele, and won't be giving up on him.

But if Martin is similarly a stud at T, I could see them thinking about moving on from Tyron if he still seems to have nagging issues in 2021. Martin and Collins at T.

I'm not as concerned about Collins' health going forward. He's not over the hill, though at 28 next year, he's nearing the crest.

Really too bad about the oline. More players whose primes were wasted by Jerry, while Frederick's was just cut short in his prime by a weird disease.

Going into this year, the oline looked like a true monster for the ages, with Tyron, Williams/McGovern, Frederick, Martin, Collins. 3 guys vying for more All Pro years, one for his first Pro Bowl, and two quality draft picks fighting for the final slot. An oline that could compete with the olines of the 90s. And Williams play this year would have been as a respectable starter on that oline. McGovern too. But instead of being a respectable 5th best on a historic oline, they're 2 and 3 on this year's oline.
 
TwoDeep3

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Hardline said:
Tank for Sewell.
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If Dak is the man, this is the pick if he's reachable.

Consider this. A left tackle in college ball that was in the running for the Heisman Trophy last year.

Reread that.
 
Cowboyny

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buybuydandavis said:
Knight is quality enough at backup T for years to come. He should only improve. And there's Steele, and Hyatt, and some other guy to develop too. They obviously like Steele, and won't be giving up on him.

But if Martin is similarly a stud at T, I could see them thinking about moving on from Tyron if he still seems to have nagging issues in 2021. Martin and Collins at T.

I'm not as concerned about Collins' health going forward. He's not over the hill, though at 28 next year, he's nearing the crest.

Really too bad about the oline. More players whose primes were wasted by Jerry, while Frederick's was just cut short in his prime by a weird disease.

Going into this year, the oline looked like a true monster for the ages, with Tyron, Williams/McGovern, Frederick, Martin, Collins. 3 guys vying for more All Pro years, one for his first Pro Bowl, and two quality draft picks fighting for the final slot. An oline that could compete with the olines of the 90s. And Williams play this year would have been as a respectable starter on that oline. McGovern too. But instead of being a respectable 5th best on a historic oline, they're 2 and 3 on this year's oline.
Click to expand...

Just a year in which this team just couldn't stay healthy, it happens every year. Look at the 49ers, probably the only other team hit worse then the Cowboys.

I'm not sure Martin is a stud Tackle, but we know he is an elite Guard. He is expected to move back there next season and moving forward.

We need a capable backup who can start if needed. Usually teams who lose their LT's for the season, don't succeed. We can manage Tyron if he misses a few games for not for the entire year. This year we lost our top 4 tackles at some point.
 
3rdEyewarrior

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buybuydandavis said:
Despite a lack of snaps this year and last, McGovern is playing well. Currently in our healthy top 3, per PFF. That passes my eyeball test too. Looney and Knight round out my top 5.

Can't keep him on the field unless one of our top 2, Martin or Williams, plays T. Will Martin play T the rest of the year? And continue when Knight gets back?

Will Biadasz take over for Looney when he's back from IR? If Looney continues to play at his current level, and Jerry is determined to get that playoff berth to be crushed in round 1, I don't see Looney giving up the spot, though I hate to see Biadasz miss the chance for developmental snaps.

Then next year, with Collins and Tyron back at T, Martin goes back to G.
Then what?
McGovern fights Biadasz for C, and Williams for G.
At worst, he's first off the bench interior lineman. Maybe, finally, they cross train Williams for T?

Oline is looking pretty strong for next year, and McGovern is the focus of the decisions to be made.

Oline PFF Grades
90.8 Martin
71.0 Williams
67.8 Tyron - Out
67.8 McGovern
62.8 Looney
60.2 Knight
56.9 Erving
53.3 Biadasz
46.9 Steele
Click to expand...
He needs to play right guard next year and Martin can play l g. I dream of him and Tyron playing in the left side.
 
Jarntt

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Manwiththeplan said:
LT- Smith, Williams
LG- Collins, McGovern
C- Biadasz, Looney
RG- Martin
RT- Sewell, Steele

Dak would sleep a lot better
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I don't get why people still think Williams would be better as a RT than an OG. I get where he played in College and what a lot of the pre-draft talk was and the constant talk of moving him since he has been here, but has anyone seen the skill-set from him to move to RT in the NFL? I don't think he has the feet for it.

Now on your larger idea of moving Collins to Guard if we drafted Sewell I totally agree...well...at least until Smith goes down with an injury...

In your scenario above, I think Knight is a better RT than Williams would be and definitely a better LT if needed. Leave Williams as interior depth and put Knight behind the big two. Once Smith goes down you start Sewell and Collins at Tackle with Knight as the swing tackle and let everyone else fight it out for the other spots.
 
Tussinman

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Plankton said:
Biadasz never missed a game at Wisconsin, so I don't think he can be labeled as chronically injured. He played through a shoulder issue last year that he got surgery on in the offseason, and had a hamstring injury this year. I don't think that this is anything to raise a flag over.
Click to expand...
Agreed. Injuries are strange in the NFL. Look at Connor Williams, he had 4 knee surgeries in a 3 year span and here is now in 2020 as our mostly healthy offensive lineman (lol)
 
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