Micah Parsons feels under appreciated?

HungryLion · Nov 28, 2020

Cowboyny said:
You think back over the last several drafts, not many non-pass rushing linebackers have gone off the board within the top 10. Kuechley had to retire due to concussions. Not saying to pass on Parsons, but it's very risky due to the position he plays.

Keuchly did retire “early”

But let’s throw out this hypothetical. If somebody told you Micah Parsons will play as long as, and as well as Keuchly did. Would you draft him top 5?

I would.

you’re talking elite level LB play that completely changesthe entire defense for the next 7+ years. It’s a keystone piece.

Besides there are plenty of LB’s that play longer than Keuchly did.

To throw out another recent example. What if somebody told you Parsons will be the next Brian Urlacher?

or look at the impact Darius Leonard is having on the colts defense right now. He is the main reason they are one of the best defenses in the league.

How about Patrick Willis. He retired early too. But led one of the best defenses in the league for 7 years.

There’s no guarantee with any pick. But if he is the next All Pro elite Linebacker. It has a major major impact on a defense.

Even if he only played as long as Willis or Keuchly. If he can be on their level. We are talking about a complete game changer who elevates the entire defense for 7+ seasons.

I would take it in a heartbeat.

DasSchnitzel · Nov 28, 2020

DakPresgoat said:
Keuchly did retire “early”

But let’s throw out this hypothetical. If somebody told you Micah Parsons will play as long as, and as well as Keuchly did. Would you draft him top 5?

I would.

you’re talking elite level LB play that completely changesthe entire defense for the next 7+ years. It’s a keystone piece.

Besides there are plenty of LB’s that play longer than Keuchly did.

To throw out another recent example. What if somebody told you Parsons will be the next Brian Urlacher?

or look at the impact Darius Leonard is having on the colts defense right now. He is the main reason they are one of the best defenses in the league.

How about Patrick Willis. He retired early too. But led one of the best defenses in the league for 7 years.

There’s no guarantee with any pick. But if he is the next All Pro elite Linebacker. It has a major major impact on a defense.

Even if he only played as long as Willis or Keuchly. If he can be on their level. We are talking about a complete game changer who elevates the entire defense for 7+ seasons.

I would take it in a heartbeat.

You and I are on the same page

HungryLion · Nov 28, 2020

CowboyWay said:
Why? Jaylon was the LB of the decade when he was coming out. Top 5 pick (pre injury). Go back and look at micahs highlights. He’s never touched.

Even in his highlights he isn’t “never touched”

However the reason he doesn’t get touched often is because he has elite instincts and athleticism.

he reads plays and shoots gaps so
Quickly that he beats the OL to
The spot he needs to get to.

Plus if you watch Parsons play a lot. He can take on blockers when he needs to. He isn’t undersized and he is a powerful player.

Hoofbite · Nov 28, 2020

The team has so many holes, it's hard to say that any single position player is a better choice than all the rest.

I've ruled out QB because I can't see Dak leaving. Only way it happens is with a 2nd tag and a trade for the moon. In that case, we're probably looking at being able to take a couple of players in the first and one of them has to be a top QB.

Excluding WR, I guess I just go board. OT, DE, LB, CB. I know nothing about college football but a couple of ranking sites would look to have that be Parsons or Sewell. I would take either.

waving monkey · Nov 28, 2020

Cowboyny said:
After the QB's are gone, nobody is trading up. Say Sewell is off the board too, Parsons would be in serious discussions as best player available. When you pick in the top 5, teams who don't need a QB usually take the best player available.

this

beware_d-ware · Nov 28, 2020

There's going to be some jaws on the floor after his Combine. Penn State for whatever reason just cranks out Combine freaks every season, and Parsons isn't going to disappoint.

He is a special, special athlete who shows some major game on tape. While I watch him, I can't help but start making all-decade type comparisons. I can't even payHow does he stack up to Devin White in college, Myles Jack, Jaylon Smith, Kuechly.... Seriously, if you haven't watched him, do it. It's so evident that he is going to be a stud. He's an uber-dominant athlete with no apparent holes in his game, it's just a question of positional value and off the field reliability at this point IMO.

Parsons's closest comparison IMO, no bull, is Zeke. We asked and still ask if #4 was too high to take a running back, and if his frat boy life would spill over off the field, but his game on tape at Ohio State was absolutely bulletproof.

Cowboyny · Nov 28, 2020

DakPresgoat said:
Keuchly did retire “early”

But let’s throw out this hypothetical. If somebody told you Micah Parsons will play as long as, and as well as Keuchly did. Would you draft him top 5?

I would.

you’re talking elite level LB play that completely changesthe entire defense for the next 7+ years. It’s a keystone piece.

Besides there are plenty of LB’s that play longer than Keuchly did.

To throw out another recent example. What if somebody told you Parsons will be the next Brian Urlacher?

or look at the impact Darius Leonard is having on the colts defense right now. He is the main reason they are one of the best defenses in the league.

How about Patrick Willis. He retired early too. But led one of the best defenses in the league for 7 years.

There’s no guarantee with any pick. But if he is the next All Pro elite Linebacker. It has a major major impact on a defense.

Even if he only played as long as Willis or Keuchly. If he can be on their level. We are talking about a complete game changer who elevates the entire defense for 7+ seasons.

I would take it in a heartbeat.

I fully understand your point of view. Even if his career is somewhat shortened due to his position, he still can make a major impact with the franchise. The same could be said about Zeke as well at the time he was drafted. I liked the pick then and he has made an major impact with the team, even though he had his worst season as a Cowboy this year.

It's a different situation now, then it was when drafting Zeke. Cowboys didn't have much resources at the position, where they have Jaylon who just signed a big extension. Drafting Parsons would mean Jerry would have to admit a mistake and release Jaylon Smith. Many thought they did the same with Tyrone Crawford, but they never released him even though he was grossly overpaid. Can Jerry shallow his ego?

HungryLion · Nov 28, 2020

Cowboyny said:
I fully understand your point of view. Even if his career is somewhat shortened due to his position, he still can make a major impact with the franchise. The same could be said about Zeke as well at the time he was drafted. I liked the pick then and he has made an major impact with the team, even though he had his worst season as a Cowboy this year.

It's a different situation now, then it was when drafting Zeke. Cowboys didn't have much resources at the position, where they have Jaylon who just signed a big extension. Drafting Parsons would mean Jerry would have to admit a mistake and release Jaylon Smith. Many thought they did the same with Tyrone Crawford, but they never released him even though he was grossly overpaid. Can Jerry shallow his ego?

Jerry swallowing his ego is certainly another discussion all together lol. I don’t have much confidence in that one.

Hawkeye0202 · Nov 28, 2020

Cowboyny said:
You think back over the last several drafts, not many non-pass rushing linebackers have gone off the board within the top 10. Kuechley had to retire due to concussions. Not saying to pass on Parsons, but it's very risky due to the position he plays.

Stephen has specifically mentioned this as one his main concern about the position.......as he put it, the LBers have more injuries than any other defensive position.

Hawkeye0202 · Nov 28, 2020

Cowboyny said:
I understand your thought process, but many are scared to take a similar prospect to Jaylon Smith, whom he will be replacing.

What if MM was planning to go to a 3-4...... ( would Gregory, Parson, Smith, and LVE work? )

DoctorChicken · Nov 28, 2020

Parsons is one of those prospects that is so good people wanna nitpick his flaws. He's not a perfect prospect but he's definitely a baller. He's likely the best defensive prospect in the draft.

People did the same with Myles Garrett. He was so good that people nitpicked the few things he wasn't good at.

Cowboyny · Nov 28, 2020

Hawkeye0202 said:
What if MM was planning to go to a 3-4...... ( would Gregory, Parson, Smith, and LVE work? )

I believe Nolan will remain the DC. Both he and MM want to run a multiple, defensive scheme, where there will be 3-4 alignments. Could Parsons/Lve work in the 3-4? Sure. However, I think he and Lve offer a similar skill set. Both are not considered great at taking on blocks, team would have to be able to keep them clean to be effective. Kind of what we are seeing now with Jaylon.

Perhaps the need is more of a physical, stack/shedder type in the middle to allow Lve to play more clean would be the better way to go. If they are able to fortify up front, Parsons/Lve tandem could be special. Got to fix the DL, no matter who is playing linebacker behind them!

Cowboyny · Nov 28, 2020

Hawkeye0202 said:
Stephen has specifically mentioned this as one his main concern about the position.......as he put it, the LBers have more injuries than any other defensive position.

It is the similar issue with taking a RB that high. I remember Stephen state in that draft, we don't normally pick this high, it won't be a need selection, but rather the best player will can get. Parsons may fit that crtitera.

xwalker · Nov 28, 2020

DasSchnitzel said:
I'm no expert on draft prospects but Parsons gets very high praise and PFF even called him the best prospect since Kuechly.

I'm reminded of the mid-2010s, when the defense was night and day different depending on Lee's health and availability. That seems like the type of prospect Parsons is, and linebackers can have that kind of influence. High value corners are great and all but I think you can build a defense around a good linebacker, and I think you're more likely to keep them at the end of their first contract.

All things together he seems like an argument for BPA in the 5 to 10 range and hopefully he would be a top linebacker for the next decade. But for some reason I seem to hear much more about other prospects, notably the corners. I can certainly see the argument for a DB in the 5 to 10 range but I prefer a LB to build around.

Am I missing something? I don't know the prospects very well.

Thanks!

The issue is his position. It's a similar debate to drafting a RB in the top 10.

Off-Ball LBs (on average):
- Have more injury issues than other defensive positions.
- Shorter careers.
- Easier to find later in the draft than elite DL or elite CBs.

Just looking at top 10 NFL contracts at each position reinforces the concept.
- There might be a couple of Off-Ball LBs with extreme contracts but overall the pay is much higher for pass rushers (outside or inside) and CBs.

HungryLion · Nov 28, 2020

xwalker said:
The issue is his position. It's a similar debate to drafting a RB in the top 10.

Off-Ball LBs (on average):
- Have more injury issues than other defensive positions.
- Shorter careers.
- Easier to find later in the draft than elite DL or elite CBs.

Just looking at top 10 NFL contracts at each position reinforces the concept.
- There might be a couple of Off-Ball LBs with extreme contracts but overall the pay is much higher for pass rushers (outside or inside) and CBs.

sure. Some of those things are true. But there’s also high bust rates on high end DE’s and CB’s.

you can’t eliminate a player from possible selection based solely on position.

And Lb isn’t as risky as RB.

DasSchnitzel · Nov 28, 2020

xwalker said:
The issue is his position. It's a similar debate to drafting a RB in the top 10.

Off-Ball LBs (on average):
- Have more injury issues than other defensive positions.
- Shorter careers.
- Easier to find later in the draft than elite DL or elite CBs.

Just looking at top 10 NFL contracts at each position reinforces the concept.
- There might be a couple of Off-Ball LBs with extreme contracts but overall the pay is much higher for pass rushers (outside or inside) and CBs.

You build a defense around Bobby Wagner, not Richard Sherman. There's a reason Wagner is still a Seahawk and no one from the Legion of Boom is.

I think the odds of a LB being healthy and signing a second deal with the same team are at least as high as a top 10 CB playing like a top 10 CB and then being affordable enough to retain at end of year 5. So, I dont agree with your belief that CB has more lasting impact for Dallas than LB.

CB is the ultimate "test the market" position and I believe that if you draft a CB at 4 overall then we're all gonna call him a bust next year when our run defense is still garbage and our only fully healthy LB is Jaylon, and then in 5 years we'll watch him get an ungodly contract with some team like Jacksonville or Cleveland.

CBs bust all the time, often return to normal as they age and lose athleticism, often get their second deal elsewhere, often have soft tissue injuries. Im just not buying that CB is fundamentally a better position to draft early.

DasSchnitzel · Nov 28, 2020

We can't keep yelling to fix the defense and then slap a shiny new CB or edge rusher onto the roster.

Build this thing proper, middle out. No DT available, get the freak run defender athletic linebacker and put him in the center.

Or draft a CB and give up 150+ yards rushing per game again, while teams beat us with under 200 yards passing. Every OC is going to laugh at Dallas and then underline "just run the ball more" in their notebooks the moment we hand in a card with a corner's name on it for pick 4.

We can't get gunshy just because Jaylon bust and LVE will never be healthy enough to live up to his potential.

817Gill · Nov 30, 2020

Cowboyny said:
-The off linebacker in today's game isn't high valued as he once was when teams were run first to step up the pass. Better be able to cover or come off the filed.

-It is a position just like RB, involves the most injury risk due to all of the collisions.

-Just like RB, outside of the select few, you can find a quality off the ball linebacker later in the draft.

I do like Parsons, but it's awfully risky to draft him within the top 10.

Bingo!

Aven8 · Dec 1, 2020

Parsons is a game wrecker. We need more of these types of guys

Future · Dec 1, 2020

DasSchnitzel said:
You build a defense around Bobby Wagner, not Richard Sherman. There's a reason Wagner is still a Seahawk and no one from the Legion of Boom is.

That's not true. The defense was entirely built around that secondary. Bobby Wagner is still there b/c he's 2-3 years younger than the LOB.

I wouldn't take a CB in the top 5, but let's not overstate what a LB can be in today's game.

Micah Parsons feels under appreciated?

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