Cowboys need to resign Dak before Baker and Josh Allen reset the market

ABQCOWBOY said:

And yet, if somebody were to come on here and say, "We should just pay Dalton 30 mil and move on from Dak", you would be at the head of the line to whine. I mean, gotta keep it real here.

Click to expand...

Sorry.. I don't whine.. if we sign Dalton, an inferior QB, and allow the superior QB to walk then I will be unhappy. But will have ZERO to do with their respective salaries.. It will be because one guy is better than the other by any objective measure. I will not mention Dalton's salary because I don't care what they pay him. Jerry has to care.. I don't.. I only care about what gives my team the best chance to win the next time they tee it up. If I look at those two QBs it's a ridiculously easy choice for me as to which one does.. If the team decides it's Dalton, they will be wrong, but there is nothing I can do about it.. so I will be sitting in my recliner on Sunday's with a cold beverage in the cupholder screaming my head off for Dalton to lead the team to a win. Period. It's not like they haven't been wrong about players before.. and will be again. And it will have ZERO impact on my fanhood.

RonnieT24 said:

Huh? I have been a Cowboys fan since I was 5 years old.. which coincidentally was when the Cowboys were also 5 years old. I don't whine about players on my current team and I sure as hell won't be whining about players on other teams.. that includes Dak. Yes I will root for Dak if he signs elsewhere.. until he plays against the Cowboys of course.. However my guess is that nobody here wants to see Dak face our current defense.. So let's hope that if he does sign elsewhere we don't play that team any time soon.. because NFL single game passing records might be in danger if he got to face off against our secondary in its current state.

Click to expand...

Ronnie get that suitcase ready to follow your Dak-Crush to his new team's bench eventually....

PAPPYDOG said:

Ronnie get that suitcase ready to follow your Dak-Crush to his new team's bench eventually....

Click to expand...

Troll somebody who cares about this junior high ish dude.

Swagger said:

Having potential Hall of Famers like Smith and Martin makes a big difference to any offensive line. Didn't Martin move over to tackle and greatly improve the line albeit for one game until he got injured again? Dalton played well in that game and then...yep back to the o line struggling.

I have never viewed Dalton as the long term solution. If we can keep him on a reasonable deal then draft a rookie to start off holding a clip board then taking over from Dalton after 8-10 games.

Click to expand...

Martin was a RG, and to further your point on the OL not being much better when Dak played, Martin got moved over to RT because the back up RT was injured, thus weakening two positions. if Martin was better at RT than the back up, he would have played RT, given tackle is a much more important OL position than RG....the fact he didn't move there, should tell you more.....Dalton sucked in almost all of his games. he was putrid against AZ, WFT and Ravens....horrifically bad. and he only won 3 games because the opponents sucked worse than us with their 4 wins and their back up QBs and even then Dalton needed 9 defensive turnovers and a defensive TD to get a win, given he had very very average outputs. if not for those turnovers we probably lose 2 out of 3 easily....and when it counted the most. against a 5 win team.....he choked as he always does...Dalton is what Dalton is... barely an adequate back up these days.

CATCH17 said:

The key is building the team.

It's not the QB.. There is about 20 QB's that get similar results in this league and go as the team go.

That is why a QB like Andy Dalton can come in and get Dak Prescott type of results for the team.

If you want to pay the QB.. Then fine.. Be like the Vikings, pay your Kirk Cousins type, and enjoy being mediocre.

I'd rather team build than be stuck in mediocrity.

I'm also not scared to draft a QB. Especially since the league is running more college concepts making it easier for guys to transition.

Click to expand...

you couldn't be more wrong....there aren't 20 QBs that could get similar results and Dalton didn't get similar results offensively as Dak did.....not even close. not even close to his past 4 years...so don't try to spin...

and Dalton barely beat 3 teams with 4 wins and back up QBs....if you think that our schedule is going to be full of 4 win teams and playing their back up QBs, then by all means, I am behind you supporting signing Dalton.....and btw, we got to play a 5 win team and their starting QB and we know how that ended up....

the easiest and cheapest way to build a competitive team is through a top 10 QB and Dak is a top 10 QB....even you have admited to that as much.....

btw, I am still waiting for you to tell me how you would build a defense through FA. who would you sign for how much and how much better will the team be......

CT Dal Fan said:

Andy Dalton played at the same level as Dak Prescott??

I must have been watching another team this season.

Click to expand...

he did play at the same level. playing college level teams pretty much....

PAPPYDOG said:

Ronnie get that suitcase ready to follow your Dak-Crush to his new team's bench eventually....

Click to expand...

How old are you? seriously dude. grow up

CowboysFaninHouston said:

but isn't that what you expect? your stats, any QBs stats over time against better defenses is always lower than them playing against weaker defenses. you just stated the obvious, but in someway, wanted Dak to have similar stats against Rams the #1 defense in the league...yet, we forget the fact that the cowboys defense was on an all time historic pace, giving up yards, passing and rushing, and all time historic pace in giving up points.

and people project, all the time. Dalton fans have been projecting all along. are you going to criticize their projections? are you a Dalton Fan?

fact is he would probably not break all time record, unless the defense would cease their all time historic suckiness, which would have forced the offense to continuously have to play catch up since defense could never hold and they pretty much never able to hold in the first 4 or 5 weeks. plus, 3 of those first 5 teams were playoff teams, with two of them having won their playoff games this past weekend. is that hindsight? perhaps, given at the time we didn't know how good those teams were and now we know in fact they were good.

Click to expand...

What has our defense got to do with Dak's stats . The only way I can see is that we'd conceded so many points that the opponents eased up.

CowboysFaninHouston said:

the easiest and cheapest way to build a competitive team is through a top 10 QB and Dak is a top 10 QB....even you have admited to that as much.....
.

Click to expand...

We need a top 10 QB in terms of talent and ability. Top 10 in fantasy football stats or madden doesnt count.

CowboyoWales said:

What has our defense got to do with Dak's stats . The only way I can see is that we'd conceded so many points that the opponents eased up.

Click to expand...

so being within a score with three minutes is opponents letting up? and my question was, isn't it true that all QBs will have lower stats against better defenses? I let you do your research, but I already know the answer......

and I think you are mixing up two separate topics...one was the QB stats against better defenses vs. bad or average defenses.

the second part in regards to our defense being so bad, and my comment earlier that we couldn't project what Dak did to an entire season based on his first 5 games, given the defense was so historically bad earlier in the season that put all the pressure on offense to keep the team competitive, vs. later on in the year, we seemingly got better defensively and thus the pressure wouldn't be on the offense as much.....

earlier in the year, the defense being historically bad, forced the offense to have different game plan, much more aggressive. much more risky. given they were almost always in catch up mode...why? because if the offense didn't score in a possession (every possession), the team would fall behind and thus we were in catch up mode....to expect an offense to score on every possession is unrealistic. to expect a defense not to give up a score on every possession is realistic.

and your last statement makes no sense. "The only way I can see is that we'd conceded so many points that the opponents eased up"....so we conceded so many points because the opponents eased up?

csirl said:

We need a top 10 QB in terms of talent and ability. Top 10 in fantasy football stats or madden doesnt count.

Click to expand...

I agree. that's why 50 front office personnel ranked Dak in the top 10....I kind of lean more towards their opinion, as opposed to a no face message board memeber's opinion. no offense meant.

so is Mahomes a top 10 talent or a fantasy football stats or Madden type player? Rodgers? Brees? Brady? Josh Allen? Wilson? Watson? just want to have that opinion in the books too.

kskboys said:

There was a time when it was common knowledge in the NFL that the losing QB often threw for high yardage, and it did not indicate him as being good/bad.

Just for poops and laughs I picked up an old magazine of mine to look at the passing yardage leaders. 03 is the year. In the NFC, the passing yardage leaders were: Mark Bulger, Matt Hasselback, Brad Johnson, Aaron Brooks, and Dante Culpepper. There's a who's who list.

So, according to what some are screaming, these 5 should've all been paid huge contracts, like 20% of the cap.

Click to expand...

in 2003, Rams won their division (bulger), Minn was second in their division (culpepper), seattle (hasselback) was second in the division behind Rams at 10-6,

Brad Johnson played for Tampa, they were 7-9, aaron brooks led an 8-8 saints team.

so the stats aren't too far away from how well the teams did.

CowboysFaninHouston said:

in 2003, Rams won their division (bulger), Minn was second in their division (culpepper), seattle (hasselback) was second in the division behind Rams at 10-6,

Brad Johnson played for Tampa, they were 7-9, aaron brooks led an 8-8 saints team.

so the stats aren't too far away from how well the teams did.

Click to expand...

hes correct think deeper last year we were 8-8 and dak started 1-3 this year yardage isnt always a way to determine whos plying great and who's not..its team game and you tried using that to TRY to support dak and really its dead on in similarity's..

blueblood70 said:

hes correct think deeper last year we were 8-8 and dak started 1-3 this year yardage isnt always a way to determine whos plying great and who's not..its team game and you tried using that to TRY to support dak and really its dead on in similarity's..

Click to expand...

Exactly..

Is Dak better than Dalton? Of course..

In the grand scheme of things you’re splitting hairs because neither guy is the difference between winning and losing.

We’re on a Cowboys message board so you have to forgive them for not being able to separate themselves as fans of a player at times.

blueblood70 said:

hes correct think deeper last year we were 8-8 and dak started 1-3 this year yardage isnt always a way to determine whos plying great and who's not..its team game and you tried using that to TRY to support dak and really its dead on in similarity's..

Click to expand...

I never said it was or wasn't. you have to look at the whole picture. but he named names for a specific year, 3 of those names played on playoff teams and teams with winning records...
the point is its not totally irrelevant.....unless you examine and look through everything.....measuring in a silo is a mistake. looking through a key hole for the entire clue is not valid.

RonnieT24 said:

Sorry.. I don't whine.. if we sign Dalton, an inferior QB, and allow the superior QB to walk then I will be unhappy. But will have ZERO to do with their respective salaries.. It will be because one guy is better than the other by any objective measure. I will not mention Dalton's salary because I don't care what they pay him. Jerry has to care.. I don't.. I only care about what gives my team the best chance to win the next time they tee it up. If I look at those two QBs it's a ridiculously easy choice for me as to which one does.. If the team decides it's Dalton, they will be wrong, but there is nothing I can do about it.. so I will be sitting in my recliner on Sunday's with a cold beverage in the cupholder screaming my head off for Dalton to lead the team to a win. Period. It's not like they haven't been wrong about players before.. and will be again. And it will have ZERO impact on my fanhood.

Click to expand...

You are whining now. I mean, if you weren't, all that would be necessary as a response is, "I won't do that."

CowboysFaninHouston said:

I never said it was or wasn't. you have to look at the whole picture. but he named names for a specific year, 3 of those names played on playoff teams and teams with winning records...
the point is its not totally irrelevant.....unless you examine and look through everything.....measuring in a silo is a mistake. looking through a key hole for the entire clue is not valid.

Click to expand...

the argument is if a team can build a decent defense, st, have good supporting cast on offense you can win in similar fashion around here as we have meaning be relevant but no SB etc with a qb like alex smith, Foles, Case keenum, colt mccoy , or retreads like aging vets in rivers etc for Half what a player like dak or romo want with similar results..

not saying this is what we should do with dak ie trade him etc however entertaining the idea given recent results with him can be attained for half price..

W-Ls but i as fake hypothetical gm would max dak at 35 anything more and im NEFT him and let him seek offers and trades, if we didnt get a good offer then he lays one more year..

blueblood70 said:

the argument is if a team can build a decent defense, st, have good supporting cast on offense you can win in similar fashion around here as we have meaning be relevant but no SB etc with a qb like alex smith, Foles, Case keenum, colt mccoy , or retreads like aging vets in rivers etc for Half what a player like dak or romo want with similar results..

not saying this is what we should do with dak ie trade him etc however entertaining the idea given recent results with him can be attained for half price..

W-Ls but i as fake hypothetical gm would max dak at 35 anything more and im NEFT him and let him seek offers and trades, if we didnt get a good offer then he lays one more year..

Click to expand...

or if you build a good offense, with a good QB, then a good defense (right metrics) could also help accomplish success much easier. as to the point you make, its not a single formula, its which is easier to do. in order to win with guys like Smith, Keenum, McCoy, etc. you need to have a very strong defensive support and lots of strong offensive supporting cast. Denver did it when Manning wasn't at his best, but they had a heck of a defense, with the likes of Ware, Malik Jackson, Talib, Ward, Von Miller (at least two HOFers)....only a couple of them were FAs and the rest were drafted.. Ravens did it and they had at least three HOFers on the team, all of whom were drafted. in one season, they had an all time best defense.....it will take a lot of great players to build a defense to over come short comings of an offense being led by players like Mccoy, Smith or Keenum (btw, none of whom have won) or an Older Manning or Flacco who won with extrmely strong defensive support).....

on the other hand, lots of teams win on a hot QB (foles catching lightning in a bottle) or good QB play and a decent defense.....you need that one player, not 4....a QB makes a lot of difference on the offensive performance as for defense, one single player can't lift a whole defense and have as much impact.

and we saw a retread like rivers....had a really good team around him, great coaching and he flamed out. couldn't get over the top....aging veterans are available for a reason....specially QBs.

we have seen more teams fail, flame out with average QB play than the other way around...

so which odds do you prefer?

CATCH17 said:

Exactly..

Is Dak better than Dalton? Of course..

In the grand scheme of things you’re splitting hairs because neither guy is the difference between winning and losing.

We’re on a Cowboys message board so you have to forgive them for not being able to separate themselves as fans of a player at times.

Click to expand...

...Dak vs. Dalton is not splitting hairs....perhaps splitting Dragon hairs (lol)... there is a world of difference between Dak and Dalton as evident this year....

kskboys said:

There was a time when it was common knowledge in the NFL that the losing QB often threw for high yardage, and it did not indicate him as being good/bad.

J.

Click to expand...

The more yards Dak throws for, the greater the points the team loses by.....Don't believe it? Do a simple plot using data from ESPN, there's a slight negative correlation between yards thrown and net points (I only checked for last 2 years). The correlation is weak, but clearly throwing yards is a pretty meaningless stat.