Underrated Qualities of finding a good NFL QB

KB1122

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To me, when I watch a college quarterback video, the biggest thing I look at is how long it takes the qb to get rid of the ball. Basically I count to three and get a feel for how often the ball gets released by then.

The other thing I look for is how open are the receivers when they catch the ball.

My sense is that at a football powerhouse like Ohio State you get trained to hold the ball longer, because if you do, your receiver is going to get wide open. Justin Fields holds the ball longer than 3 second a lot, and his receivers are always wide open.

By contrast, despite having a strong team around him, Trevor Lawrence gets rid of it quick and consequently his receivers are better covered, so he has to throw accurately.

Zack Wilson does pretty well on the three-second rule and he doesn't have a lot of talent around him so his receivers aren't super-wide-open.
 
Bobhaze

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MarcusRock said:
I was going to chime in and say that your point in the OP about the pressure they see in the pros by comparison to college makes reading a defense/going through progressions a tough thing to determine. We all react differently to the pressures of life and pressure on the QB is no different when they think they see something and then a monkey wrench gets thrown in that they didn't account for. Unfortunately, one of the things that makes a good pro QB is a thing you won't see until he's actually there: how he will adapt to a vastly changed landscape for executing plays. Ask DiNucci about that. You can ask questions about his game preparation, maybe get intel from the schools, etc. but when the bullets start flying, his prep will be put to the test like never before and he'll either be daunted or accept the challenge of trying to figure it out.

Maybe someone can create a virtual reality program or something to simulate plays breaking down and noting the choices made in the face of the unexpected. Instead of the Wonderlic test they can call it the Wonderdick test because someone named Richard will invent it. Sorry, I know you're a mod now so do your thing if you have to, lol.
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I like the idea of a virtual reality experience for QBs. It could be part of scouting as well as development. So many of these guys coming out of college with big reputations are vastly overrated. And as someone said earlier in this thread, measuring strength and speed is pretty good for many positions. But QB has so much of the mental and character side of things that are much harder to measure.
 
bewp7

bewp7

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accuracy without just clean pocket + processing + poise

that what i care about more over anything else and what people maybe underrate comparted to arm talent, winning being clutch, stuffs like that. also maybe some thing u either have or not vs stuff that can be coached,
 

buybuydandavis

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GimmeTheBall! said:
Not bad. He just thinks it's Matt Jones instead of Mac.
Click to expand...

Matt Jones. A name I couldn't dig up the other day. Thought of him as a comparison to the new fancy pants TE Pitts "mismatch nightmare" people want us to draft.

Jones was 6-6 242 and ran a 4.37 at the combine. To be fair with my comparison, Jones was trying to convert from QB in college to WR in the NFL. JAX spent the 21st pick on him. He had a few decent seasons at WR, but retired after his rookie contract.

Jones was the size of Pitts, but *much* faster. Pitts has an estimated 40 in the 4.6s. Jones was a decent WR in the NFL, so probably would have looked like hot stuff at TE in college too. But the "mismatch nightmare" never panned out even with the blazing speed at that size.

Pitts doesn't have that blazing speed. He has more like Gavin Escobar speed, at 12 pounds less. (Despite his 4.84 at the combine, Escobar was reported in the 4.6s at some pro day event.)

Escobar's length, catch radius, weight, and route running never panned out to a "mismatch nightmare" because he couldn't block. There was no personnel mismatch. Escobar wasn't a threat to be picking off LBs in the run game. He was just a tall, slow, heavy WR, with a good catch radius, and NFL DBs don't have a big problem with that.

I'm sure Pitts is better than Escobar. Maybe a nice possession WR. But unless he's a great blocker, I'm voting "No" on the "mismatch nightmare generational talent".
 
Oz-of-Cowboy-Country

Oz-of-Cowboy-Country

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1) Good throwing motion?
2) Good foot movement?
3) Can he feel pressure from the backside?
4) Good decision maker?
5) Pocket presents?
6) Can he throw floaters?
7) Field position awareness?
8) Take care of the ball?
9) How many comebacks and game winning drives?
10) What does his teammates say about him?

Then look at his stats.
1) 2 to 1 TD's vs Int's
2) Over 60% completions
3) Winning record

Dak's pocket presents get him in trouble sometimes. Dak's field position managment let's him down sometimes. And Dak is not good at throwing floaters. So Dak is 10 of 13 on my list. In other words he a very serviceable franchise QB. And just like all QB's he needs a good defense to win in the playoffs.
 
GimmeTheBall!

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buybuydandavis said:
Matt Jones. A name I couldn't dig up the other day. Thought of him as a comparison to the new fancy pants TE Pitts "mismatch nightmare" people want us to draft.

Jones was 6-6 242 and ran a 4.37 at the combine. To be fair with my comparison, Jones was trying to convert from QB in college to WR in the NFL. JAX spent the 21st pick on him. He had a few decent seasons at WR, but retired after his rookie contract.

Jones was the size of Pitts, but *much* faster. Pitts has an estimated 40 in the 4.6s. Jones was a decent WR in the NFL, so probably would have looked like hot stuff at TE in college too. But the "mismatch nightmare" never panned out even with the blazing speed at that size.

Pitts doesn't have that blazing speed. He has more like Gavin Escobar speed, at 12 pounds less. (Despite his 4.84 at the combine, Escobar was reported in the 4.6s at some pro day event.)

Escobar's length, catch radius, weight, and route running never panned out to a "mismatch nightmare" because he couldn't block. There was no personnel mismatch. Escobar wasn't a threat to be picking off LBs in the run game. He was just a tall, slow, heavy WR, with a good catch radius, and NFL DBs don't have a big problem with that.

I'm sure Pitts is better than Escobar. Maybe a nice possession WR. But unless he's a great blocker, I'm voting "No" on the "mismatch nightmare generational talent".
Click to expand...

Great post!
Two Questions: Can he play defence?
Is he related to LaFleur?
 

kskboys

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KB1122 said:
To me, when I watch a college quarterback video, the biggest thing I look at is how long it takes the qb to get rid of the ball. Basically I count to three and get a feel for how often the ball gets released by then.

The other thing I look for is how open are the receivers when they catch the ball.

My sense is that at a football powerhouse like Ohio State you get trained to hold the ball longer, because if you do, your receiver is going to get wide open. Justin Fields holds the ball longer than 3 second a lot, and his receivers are always wide open.

By contrast, despite having a strong team around him, Trevor Lawrence gets rid of it quick and consequently his receivers are better covered, so he has to throw accurately.

Zack Wilson does pretty well on the three-second rule and he doesn't have a lot of talent around him so his receivers aren't super-wide-open.
Click to expand...
Very interesting test. I think it has some merit.
 

buybuydandavis

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Oz-of-Cowboy-Country said:
1) Good throwing motion?
2) Good foot movement?
3) Can he feel pressure from the backside?
4) Good decision maker?
5) Pocket presents?
6) Can he throw floaters?
7) Field position awareness?
8) Take care of the ball?
9) How many comebacks and game winning drives?
10) What does his teammates say about him?

Then look at his stats.
1) 2 to 1 TD's vs Int's
2) Over 60% completions
3) Winning record

Dak's pocket presents get him in trouble sometimes. Dak's field position managment let's him down sometimes. And Dak is not good at throwing floaters. So Dak is 10 of 13 on my list. In other words he a very serviceable franchise QB. And just like all QB's he needs a good defense to win in the playoffs.
Click to expand...

Most encouraging thing about Dak is how much he's improved. 1,2,3, 5. Also improved 0, his accuracy. Downfield accuracy much better. And 0.1, Decisiveness. He's making faster reads, and more decisively getting the ball out of his hands.

If he's improved on those things, he can improve on others.
1) Short passes have poor placement. Even just swing passes behind the LOS. That should be easy to fix.
6) Floaters. Most QBs improve their touch and placement as the years go by.

Dak improved *alot* in 2019. He doesn't have much farther to go to be an elite QB.
 
Oz-of-Cowboy-Country

Oz-of-Cowboy-Country

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buybuydandavis said:
Most encouraging thing about Dak is how much he's improved. 1,2,3, 5. Also improved 0, his accuracy. Downfield accuracy much better. And 0.1, Decisiveness. He's making faster reads, and more decisively getting the ball out of his hands.

If he's improved on those things, he can improve on others.
1) Short passes have poor placement. Even just swing passes behind the LOS. That should be easy to fix.
6) Floaters. Most QBs improve their touch and placement as the years go by.

Dak improved *alot* in 2019. He doesn't have much farther to go to be an elite QB.
Click to expand...
I agree. He doesn't have far to go to be elite. Just minor things.
 

Bluechillychild

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Find a good companion. Don’t worry too much about looks or money. Trust is everything. A good heart is worth more than money or success.

Wait? This isn’t the relationship forum? Oops...:omg:
 
landroverking

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cowboyec said:
☆leadership.
☆toughness in the pocket.
☆game preperation...film study...repetitive drills on their own time when no one is watching.

most qb's who make it to this level have good arms...some stronger than others.
some more accurate than others.
but only the good ones....have leadership,toughness and grind.
thats what i want in my QB.
Meredith had it....tho he loved to party to..
but he was prepared as hell on game day.
Roger had it.
Danny had it.
Troy had it.
Romo had it.
Dak has it.

doesnt mean they win titles.
marino had it and didnt.
but in the end....its a short list of who you would take over him.
in the end...
i want my team to take their chances with a QB who is a great leader tough and loves to grind.
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I use to think Dak had “it” now I’m not so sure.
 
Shane612

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Things we DON'T want in a QB.
Obnoxious - Ryan Leaf.
Lazy - DeMarcus Russell.
Clueless - Quincy Carter.
Arrogance - Jay Cutler.
Weak Arm - Steve Walsh.
 
Bobhaze

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Shane612 said:
Things we DON'T want in a QB.
Obnoxious - Ryan Leaf.
Lazy - DeMarcus Russell.
Clueless - Quincy Carter.
Arrogance - Jay Cutler.
Weak Arm - Steve Walsh.
Click to expand...
Things we don’t want Addition: No ball security- Jameis Winston
 
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