Conner McGovern: Starting LG battle

Ranched

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He showed himself to be a capable starter in 2020. But those starts came after injuries decimated the OL. All things being equal, Connor is not going to supplant a perennial All-Pro like Zack Martin in the lineup. Not today, not tomorrow, not ever!
 

buybuydandavis

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Hawkeye19 said:
He has a better chance to start a C than he does at LG
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And it makes more sense for McGovern to compete at C.

As much as many hate Williams, he had a good year, and that was coming off a knee injury where he was still wearing a brace in August. PFF had him ranked 16th out of 80 guards on an oline with little help around him. Tough row to hoe.

This year, entirely healthy, after a year that he stayed healthy, with Tyron to his left, and Biadasz/McGovern to his right with a real offseason to prepare for C. Easier row to hoe, for a player who is still only 24. That ranking should only go up.

Meanwhile, McGovern was 47/80 guards, while Biadasz was 32/36 centers. That's where the competition should be. If McGovern can't take it, he's now ready to back up *all* interior oline positions, and we don't have to carry a backup just for C.

Meanwhile, I hope they train Williams at LT at least. He's probably significantly better than Knight or Steele.

Between McGovern, Biadasz, and Williams, I think we've got 3 legitimate starters for 2 starting positions who are just better than our backups. We should plan for the contingency of McGovern or Williams getting used as a backup to get our best players on the field in case of injury at other positions.
 

buybuydandavis

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Jbone100 said:
For an interior offensive lineman drafted in the 2nd, I would expect the player to be an above average starter and would hope for a pro bowler. I felt okay with the C. Williams pick at the time but wasn't penciling him in as a pro-bowler by any means. I would say that by last year, he exactly met my expectations.... nothing more... nothing less.
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Per PFF, Williams was a well above average LG, ranking 16th of 80 guards.
 
Corso

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buybuydandavis said:
And it makes more sense for McGovern to compete at C.

As much as many hate Williams, he had a good year, and that was coming off a knee injury where he was still wearing a brace in August. PFF had him ranked 16th out of 80 guards on an oline with little help around him. Tough row to hoe.

This year, entirely healthy, after a year that he stayed healthy, with Tyron to his left, and Biadasz/McGovern to his right with a real offseason to prepare for C. Easier row to hoe, for a player who is still only 24. That ranking should only go up.

Meanwhile, McGovern was 47/80 guards, while Biadasz was 32/36 centers. That's where the competition should be. If McGovern can't take it, he's now ready to back up *all* interior oline positions, and we don't have to carry a backup just for C.

Meanwhile, I hope they train Williams at LT at least. He's probably significantly better than Knight or Steele.

Between McGovern, Biadasz, and Williams, I think we've got 3 legitimate starters for 2 starting positions who are just better than our backups. We should plan for the contingency of McGovern or Williams getting used as a backup to get our best players on the field in case of injury at other positions.
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Strong post.
 
tunahelper

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Considering CM redshirted his rookie year due to injury. Then had zero preseason games the next year. CM appeared to approve as the season moved on.CW has taken several seasons to develop and he may hit his ceiling.

I think CM will make a move to start at LG. His development with another training camp and preseason games may be what he needs.
 

buybuydandavis

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tunahelper said:
Considering CM redshirted his rookie year due to injury. Then had zero preseason games the next year. CM appeared to approve as the season moved on.CW has taken several seasons to develop and he may hit his ceiling.

I think CM will make a move to start at LG. His development with another training camp and preseason games may be what he needs.
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Williams and McGovern are both 24.
Williams came into the league very young, and was moved to a new position at LG, where power is at a premium. Olinemen develop power with age. Hard for a young player to compete. He made a huge jump last season. No reason to think he's done improving.
 
Rockport

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quickccc said:
Among the talk of backups at OT, center, .. another one watch on my list will be the battle of
the Conner wars. - If it’s much of one.

- McGovern was a 3rd round picked guy in 2019 who was thought of so highly that McClay group thought they had to have him despite that they already had former 2nd rd pick OG Conner Williams already in placed.

- Needless to say, many here seemed to have already given up on Williams, who many assumed he had pro bowl expectations.
Williams has proved (imo) to decent to serviceable but there remains the grumblings that the Cowboys Nation needed him to be more dominant, more of a difference maker in the trenches.

- McGovern missed his entire rookie year with a tricep tear.
and in his return yerar, was vaguely phased out of the rotation very early on in his 2nd year by new OL coach Joe Philibin, .. until injuries piled up and makeshift OL change had to be forced.

McGovern started some games at RG, especially with Zack Martin fighting some injuries himself as well as Zack being forced to move and start at RT over an struggling rookie Terrance Steele.

- While McGovern wasn’t dominant, but I did think he was at least adequate, considering he had zero previous live game experience and a lack of strengthening program.

- I just dunno if Philibin is really a fan of McGovern to really open up true hard fought competition to the two Conners.
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Drafting McGovern had nothing to do with what they thought of Williams. It was just good drafting. The offensive line is extremely important to the success of the offense. You need as many good players as you can get.
 

buybuydandavis

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kskboys said:
It is so odd how people take what a player did one year and then think he's the same the next 3 years.

CW has become a good player. We're lucky to him.
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It's like their girlfriend cheated on them. They take it as a personal betrayal, never to be forgiven, not simply the failure of a guy to develop as fast as you wanted him to.

In CW's case, he came into the league young and not powerful, and switched to a position he hadn't played that puts a premium on power. Why should anyone expect that to look pretty?

The almighty Tyron came into the league a half year older than CW, and didn't make a pro bowl til his 3rd year, and all pro until his 4th.
Last year was CW's 3rd year, a 3rd year a half year younger than Tyron's 3rd year. People need to contextualize his development.
 
AsthmaField

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buybuydandavis said:
It's like their girlfriend cheated on them. They take it as a personal betrayal, never to be forgiven, not simply the failure of a guy to develop as fast as you wanted him to.

In CW's case, he came into the league young and not powerful, and switched to a position he hadn't played that puts a premium on power. Why should anyone expect that to look pretty?

The almighty Tyron came into the league a half year older than CW, and didn't make a pro bowl til his 3rd year, and all pro until his 4th.
Last year was CW's 3rd year, a 3rd year a half year younger than Tyron's 3rd year. People need to contextualize his development.
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And Williams fits the zone blocking scheme that Philbin runs to a tee. He has terrific mobility and better balance than most guards. When he is asked to get to the second level , he can easily do that, and he’ll keep his feet and sustain those blocks.

McGovern is a little stouter and stronger at the point of attack than Williams, I believe… but he lacks Williams’ quick, nimble feet and his terrific movement…which are skills that Philbin likes for his OL. And it showed up last season. CW played much better in the new zone scheme than fans are giving him credit for. He was pretty dang good, and he did it coming off of an ACL tear the previous season. He should be even better this year.

I fully expect CW to be the team’s starting LG in Tampa this year. I’m not saying that McGovern for sure won’t win the starters job… but if he does, he’s going to have to be very good to do it.

Personally, I think it’ll be Williams.
 
Dak_Attack_09

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quickccc said:
Among the talk of backups at OT, center, .. another one watch on my list will be the battle of
the Conner wars. - If it’s much of one.

- McGovern was a 3rd round picked guy in 2019 who was thought of so highly that McClay group thought they had to have him despite that they already had former 2nd rd pick OG Conner Williams already in placed.

- Needless to say, many here seemed to have already given up on Williams, who many assumed he had pro bowl expectations.
Williams has proved (imo) to decent to serviceable but there remains the grumblings that the Cowboys Nation needed him to be more dominant, more of a difference maker in the trenches.

- McGovern missed his entire rookie year with a tricep tear.
and in his return yerar, was vaguely phased out of the rotation very early on in his 2nd year by new OL coach Joe Philibin, .. until injuries piled up and makeshift OL change had to be forced.

McGovern started some games at RG, especially with Zack Martin fighting some injuries himself as well as Zack being forced to move and start at RT over an struggling rookie Terrance Steele.

- While McGovern wasn’t dominant, but I did think he was at least adequate, considering he had zero previous live game experience and a lack of strengthening program.

- I just dunno if Philibin is really a fan of McGovern to really open up true hard fought competition to the two Conners.
Click to expand...


Issac Alcorn can be a better guard than both.
 

kskboys

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Rockport said:
Drafting McGovern had nothing to do with what they thought of Williams. It was just good drafting. The offensive line is extremely important to the success of the offense. You need as many good players as you can get.
Click to expand...
Yup.

Basically, a team should take some mid round OL's pretty much every year. Not only does it provide depth, but it also provides future starters in case of injury or high salary demands.
 
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kskboys

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Dak_Attack_09 said:
Issac Alcorn can be a better guard than both.
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Coulda woulda shoulda.

Not sure what that means, the importance of it, or why you think that. He doesn't come up when I google him, who is he? A UFDA I presume? What's he got that impresses you so?
 

buybuydandavis

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kskboys said:
Yup.

Basically, a team should take some mid round OL's pretty much every year. Not only does it provide depth, but it also provides future starters in case of injury or high salary demands.
Click to expand...

Could have taken another this year to backfill the interior oline when Williams leaves in free agency next year.

We've been taking guys who fall. Maybe one didn't fall this year, maybe they were just focused on defense.

Biadasz was a crazy good deal last year. Interior oline aren't sexy picks. Often good value to be had.
 

buybuydandavis

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AsthmaField said:
And Williams fits the zone blocking scheme that Philbin runs to a tee. He has terrific mobility and better balance than most guards. When he is asked to get to the second level , he can easily do that, and he’ll keep his feet and sustain those blocks.

McGovern is a little stouter and stronger at the point of attack than Williams, I believe… but he lacks Williams’ quick, nimble feet and his terrific movement…which are skills that Philbin likes for his OL. And it showed up last season. CW played much better in the new zone scheme than fans are giving him credit for. He was pretty dang good, and he did it coming off of an ACL tear the previous season. He should be even better this year.

I fully expect CW to be the team’s starting LG in Tampa this year. I’m not saying that McGovern for sure won’t win the starters job… but if he does, he’s going to have to be very good to do it.

Personally, I think it’ll be Williams.
Click to expand...

I have the same analysis as you on Williams this year.

I was pulling for McGovern over Williams *last* year, but Williams clearly distanced himself over McGovern.

I like McGovern too. He's a starter who is gonna sit this year unless he can take C from Biadasz.
 
quickccc

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Cowboyny said:
I believe McGovern was brought along slowly cause he had zero experience and was coming off of a major injury. He was able to get his feet wet last yr, has a normal off-season to add from strength and should legitimately be able to compete to become a starter. Heard that Knight also is moving to Guard due to the numbers at the Tackle position.
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two things to that: Phillibin had no problem starting a non- experience player in the lineup with Steele,..so apparently Joe P, had no problems as far as game experience is concern.

and it's s not as challenging at interior OG as it is on an outside island like OT, ... but if it was injury recovery that could be something if Phillibin confided with the local trainers but i wouldn't buy it as it came a point where Phillibin did not seem ample to trust
McGovern on a couple of single plays when a Looney was banged up,, seemingly wanting to go with rookie Biadasz at OG
instead of 2nd year McGovern. ...and again, had not been for the massive injuries and struggles at RT ,..would McGovern even have
sniffed the playing field ?
 

buybuydandavis

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quickccc said:
two things to that: Phillibin had no problem starting a non- experience player in the lineup with Steele,..so apparently Joe P, had no problems as far as game experience is concern.

and it's s not as challenging at interior OG as it is on an outside island like OT, ... but if it was injury recovery that could be something if Phillibin confided with the local trainers but i wouldn't buy it as it came a point where Phillibin did not seem ample to trust
McGovern on a couple of single plays when a Looney was banged up,, seemingly wanting to go with rookie Biadasz at OG
instead of 2nd year McGovern. ...and again, had not been for the massive injuries and struggles at RT ,..would McGovern even have
sniffed the playing field ?
Click to expand...

The pattern from Philbin seemed to be "play *my* guys". I thought his choices pretty much sucked personnelwise all last year.

Didn't crosstrain Williams at T.
Didn't give McGovern a chance at C - and he really just looked like a better player than Biadasz this year.
Didn't start Knight over Steele.

Playing Martin at T is probably what did in his calf. Been a long time since he had to kickslide like a T, and hadn't practiced it for years. Train Williams for T, which he played in college, backfill Williams with McGovern at LG. Easy Peasy.
 
Bullflop

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I wouldn't be surprised if Connor McGovern gives Connor Williams a good run for his money at LG in camp. I think he's stronger and maybe a bit more solid in pass protection. In any case, both should benefit by a spirited competition. May the better man emerge proudly as the starter at LG.
 
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