Twitter: How Amari Cooper trade hurt the Raiders - 3 years

Creeper

Creeper

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Zman5 said:
If Lamb can have a big game without Cooper on the field, I'd believe you. Because I see the defenses doubling Cooper and not Lamb.
I'm not saying Lamb cant but I would want to see it few times before agreeing with your claim. We've already seen Cooper have monster games without Lamb in 2018.
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Are defenses really doubling Cooper? I watched the NE game 3 times and I saw 1 CB on Cooper most of the game. Does anyone have actual data on this? In 2019, when the Cowboys played NE, Gilmore covered Coop one on one.

I accept that teams will put their best CB on Cooper but I need to see data on whether they double team him more than anyone else. I have not seen it when I have watched the games but we don't see all 22 players on TV.
 
Macnalty

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Shane612 said:
Ok. Here it goes....
Cooper is ok as a receiver, but he isn't anything special. He'll get you 1,100 yards. Do you need to pay someone $18,000,000.00 per to do that?
How many times has he been MIA...when the team needed him the most?
Imagine what he could do if he actually wanted to play every game. Maybe he's just too cool for school.
Over a 16 game season, it's not that difficult to get 1,000 yards, for a #1 receiver. This year there are 17 regular season game, so, I'm expecting about 1,300 yards.
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Cee Dee Lamb has already past him as a #1 receiver.
Lamb is so much more dynamic than Cooper.
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Nothing to argue if you think he is better, opposing DC's seem to double Amari consistently, not so much Lamb. I am firmly in the boat that is happy as hell we have them both. IMO Amari single covered is playing Russian roulette for most defenses.
 
Creeper

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ConstantReboot said:
I agree with you that we need to keep the cap under control. Frankly, I do think Cooper is overpaid a little. But you can't blame the players for signing those contracts. I blame Jerry and Stephen for caving in. Especially, Zekes, Tanks and Jaylons contract.

If they had taken care of Prescott's contract earlier on and not have to cave in on Tank's contract, which I think he doesn't deserve, we would have been in a much better situation.
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100%. Cooper, Lawrence, Zeke and even LVE should go for every penny they get without regret or remorse. They owe it to themselves for all the hard work and pain they have suffered since they were kids and they owe it to their families. An NFL career is short and these guys are retired in their early 30s. Absolutely take the money.

Overpaying guys like Lawrence, Zeke, Coop and Dak is 100% Jerry's fault. He could refuse to sign them and maybe they comes down or maybe they walk. Then Jerry can sign other players who may produce more and cost less. I'll use the Smith's up in GB who signed for $16.5 million and arguably produce more than Lawrence ever has.

And again, I like all these players, even Lawrence. I think he will help the defense a lot when he gets back. But his CAP number, and Cooper's too, make them easy solution the the CAP problem Dallas has next year. I am sure the Eagles didn't want to let Nick Foles go either, but that one move got them under the CAP when they were in trouble.
 

AmericanCowboy

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Cooper literally saved our season that year. The only bad thing about it is that he also saved Jason Garrett's job for a year longer.

I hated the trade when it happened, and love it now!
 
Zman5

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Creeper said:
Are defenses really doubling Cooper? I watched the NE game 3 times and I saw 1 CB on Cooper most of the game. Does anyone have actual data on this? In 2019, when the Cowboys played NE, Gilmore covered Coop one on one.

I accept that teams will put their best CB on Cooper but I need to see data on whether they double team him more than anyone else. I have not seen it when I have watched the games but we don't see all 22 players on TV.
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Yes. If you watch the All-22 you can see the defenses doubling him and safeties cheating to his side more than any other WRs. He gets the most respect from the defenses still. In the NE game, they doubled him and Shultz mostly.
 
ConstantReboot

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Shane612 said:
Ok. Here it goes....
Cooper is ok as a receiver, but he isn't anything special. He'll get you 1,100 yards. Do you need to pay someone $18,000,000.00 per to do that?
How many times has he been MIA...when the team needed him the most?
Imagine what he could do if he actually wanted to play every game. Maybe he's just too cool for school.
Over a 16 game season, it's not that difficult to get 1,000 yards, for a #1 receiver. This year there are 17 regular season game, so, I'm expecting about 1,300 yards.
.
Cee Dee Lamb has already past him as a #1 receiver.
Lamb is so much more dynamic than Cooper.
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Lamb is not so much more dynamic than Cooper. He is quicker and more elusive. But Cooper is faster, and a much better route runner.

Cooper is also playing hurt. And he still makes plays. I guess people forgot what it was like before Cooper. Where we struggled to pass and basically depended on the run.

Gone are the days when you need a #1 receiver. Dallas spreads the ball around. We are more dangerous because of Cooper. You can bet your britches that other teams will try to emulate the Dallas offense.
 
ConstantReboot

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Zman5 said:
Yes. If you watch the All-22 you can see the defenses doubling him and safeties cheating to his side more than any other WRs. He gets the most respect from the defenses still. In the NE game, they doubled him and Shultz mostly.
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They weren't going to let the run and Cooper beat us. They played the run, doubled Schultz and rolled a safety to his side quite a bit. This allowed Lamb to be one on one most of the day. We made them pick their poison.
 
Ren

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After Galloway and Roy Williams it was nice to come out on top for once
 
DanA

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Creeper said:
Some people don't seem to get the idea that a team cannot have high paid players at every position. In 2022 the Cowboys are going to have to make some tough decisions. Sure, I would love to keep Cooper and Gallup and CeeDee and Wilson but 2 of those guys are free agents and there are a bunch of other free agents as well. Every time Dallas overpays a guy it makes retaining someone else that much harder. Cooper throughout his career has disappeared in half his games. That's a fact anyone can look up. This year he has 1 100 yard game and 5 games under 70 yards. In 2 games he is under 30 yards. I will not dispute his route running ability but for $20 million he is not producing as much as we should expect. Maybe if Zeke didn't cost $15 million, Lawrence $21 million, and Dak $40 million it would not be so bad to keep Cooper, but we will see in the next 2 years a few of these guys will have to go and one is not going to be Dak.

Maybe trading Cooper hurts the offense a little, assuming they don't draft another guy who can play, but maybe dumping his salary helps them retain other talent to make the team better.
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I think it's about timing and who we have developing behind the high-paid players. We don't have anyone behind Cooper/Lamb that looks promising so if we cut Cooper we're looking at signing someone else, or throwing a 1st/2nd round pick at the position to start immediately. Compare that to LDE where we have Golston developing nicely, and Basham looking okay cover....it's much easier to cut/trade Lawrence with a couple of guys already on the roster looking capable to cover his position. The other position is OT given Steele looks a starter but I'm not sure I'd go in that direction either because Tyron has his neck/back issues and it's so damn hard to find a good OT outside the 1st round.
 
DanA

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buybuydandavis said:
We gave up a 1st for the right to make Cooper one of the highest priced WRs in the league. I'm a fan of Cooper, but not of the trade.
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I'm not saying the trade was amazing but we did get some money savings before paying him. He was paid 400k his 1st year by the Cowboys and then played on his 5th-year option his second. That's probably about 15-20m of contract savings as from the moment he arrived he was pretty good.
 
Shane612

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Zman5 said:
If Lamb can have a big game without Cooper on the field, I'd believe you. Because I see the defenses doubling Cooper and not Lamb.
I'm not saying Lamb cant but I would want to see it few times before agreeing with your claim. We've already seen Cooper have monster games without Lamb in 2018.
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We've seen plenty of times when they isolated a camera on Cooper. He had hard time creating space going one on one. To me, sometimes he gives up on the pattern.
When your QB is in trouble, get to an open spot. Help your QB out.
Maybe he was injured. Maybe he wasn't feeling well. I don't know.
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I say this, when he want to play, and be engaged, he can be very good.
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You can't keep making double-covered as an excuse. Michael Irvin never did. Nope. He just kept making big plays. That's why he was THE PLAYMAKER.
 
Shane612

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ConstantReboot said:
Lamb is not so much more dynamic than Cooper. He is quicker and more elusive. But Cooper is faster, and a much better route runner.

Cooper is also playing hurt. And he still makes plays. I guess people forgot what it was like before Cooper. Where we struggled to pass and basically depended on the run.

Gone are the days when you need a #1 receiver. Dallas spreads the ball around. We are more dangerous because of Cooper. You can bet your britches that other teams will try to emulate the Dallas offense.
Click to expand...
How long has been playing hurt?
Forever it seems....
 
Shane612

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Macnalty said:
Nothing to argue if you think he is better, opposing DC's seem to double Amari consistently, not so much Lamb. I am firmly in the boat that is happy as hell we have them both. IMO Amari single covered is playing Russian roulette for most defenses.
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If you single cover most starting wide receivers in the NFL, you are playing a "dangerous" game. That's not a secret.
Rules favor receivers by a wide margin.
 
Zman5

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Shane612 said:
We've seen plenty of times when they isolated a camera on Cooper. He had hard time creating space going one on one. To me, sometimes he gives up on the pattern.
When your QB is in trouble, get to an open spot. Help your QB out.
Maybe he was injured. Maybe he wasn't feeling well. I don't know.
.
I say this, when he want to play, and be engaged, he can be very good.
.
You can't keep making double-covered as an excuse. Michael Irvin never did. Nope. He just kept making big plays. That's why he was THE PLAYMAKER.
Click to expand...

Unless you watch the all-22 view, it's almost impossible to see what's going on with the coverage by just watching the TV broadcast. There is no way you can tell what the safeties are doing from the TV broadcast on most of the plays. As I said, he gets the most respect from the defenses we play against.
 
Shane612

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Zman5 said:
Unless you watch the all-22 view, it's almost impossible to see what's going on with the coverage by just watching the TV broadcast. There is no way you can tell what the safeties are doing from the TV broadcast on most of the plays. As I said, he gets the most respect from the defenses we play against.
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I'll take consistency over "respect" any day, and twice on Sundays.
 
Macnalty

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Shane612 said:
If you single cover most starting wide receivers in the NFL, you are playing a "dangerous" game. That's not a secret.
Rules favor receivers by a wide margin.
Click to expand...
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You are so correct on most number 1 receivers having their way with defenses that provide single coverage. IMO Amari is a physical weapon with his blocking and ability to read defenders, along with his ability to hit a home run with a single defensive misstep. I agree that when he is injured it is frustrating knowing what he is capable of doing against even the best defender.
 
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