Watching other teams run block today was depressing

RonnieT24 · Nov 28, 2021

Man it made sad as I watched multiple teams open up gaping holes for their backs down after down. It also made me realize that our line is nowhere near as good as its reputation. Well let me qualify that.. Our line cannot execute Kellen Moore's run plays as good as its reputation. What I notice about other teams is that they tend to double team at the point of attack. The Packers did it to Aaron Donald a dozen times when they needed to run the ball. Same with the Bucs when they were closing out the game against the Colts.. And the Broncos against the Chargers.. Admittedly I didn't study it as intently as I do our schemes, but I saw precious little of the slide step reach blocking we feature in our running attack. Maybe Moore thinks our guys are more athletic than they are.. but we repeatedly allow penetration when we run this scheme. Yes we can gash teams with sorry *** fronts with it but against even decent fronts our linemen get knocked into the backfield more often than not. Against good fronts we have no chance whatsoever to run the ball. I also noticed that teams stayed committed to the run even when it wasn't yielding big yards. Dillon and Jones were averaging just over 3 ypc against the Rams but they kept hammering at it all game long. They never surrendered the way we do. And they have Aaron Freaking Rodgers at QB.. Oh and that guy with the Bucs is an okay QB too.. yet they also kept pounding the run even when it was getting them under 4 ypc until late in the game. Yes WE have turned completely skittish about running the ball and shift into 5 wide empty backfield at the drop of a hat. I love Dak Prescott as much as anyone but it's absolutely brain dead that we keep asking him to do what even teams with Hall of Fame QBs don't ask of them.. win throwing it 75-80% of the time without even a hint of a rushing attack. What the hell is wrong with our offensive coordinator that he can't see this?

CowboyRoy · Nov 28, 2021

RonnieT24 said:
Man it made sad as I watched multiple teams open up gaping holes for their backs down after down. It also made me realize that our line is nowhere near as good as its reputation. Well let me qualify that.. Our line cannot execute Kellen Moore's run plays as good as its reputation. What I notice about other teams is that they tend to double team at the point of attack. The Packers did it to Aaron Donald a dozen times when they needed to run the ball. Same with the Bucs when they were closing out the game against the Colts.. And the Broncos against the Chargers.. Admittedly I didn't study it as intently as I do our schemes, but I saw precious little of the slide step reach blocking we feature in our running attack. Maybe Moore thinks our guys are more athletic than they are.. but we repeatedly allow penetration when we run this scheme. Yes we can gash teams with sorry *** fronts with it but against even decent fronts our linemen get knocked into the backfield more often than not. Against good fronts we have no chance whatsoever to run the ball. I also noticed that teams stayed committed to the run even when it wasn't yielding big yards. Dillon and Jones were averaging just over 3 ypc against the Rams but they kept hammering at it all game long. They never surrendered the way we do. And they have Aaron Freaking Rodgers at QB.. Oh and that guy with the Bucs is an okay QB too.. yet they also kept pounding the run even when it was getting them under 4 ypc until late in the game. Yes WE have turned completely skittish about running the ball and shift into 5 wide empty backfield at the drop of a hat. I love Dak Prescott as much as anyone but it's absolutely brain dead that we keep asking him to do what even teams with Hall of Fame QBs don't ask of them.. win throwing it 75-80% of the time without even a hint of a rushing attack. What the hell is wrong with our offensive coordinator that he can't see this?

Everything but blaming the horrid Zeke. You are predictable and small minded. Even our head coach admits that Zeke isn't himself.

Zeke is either injured or he sucks. And despite Oline issues, which there are, Pollard continues to average a yard more per carry in most cases.

There is nothing wrong with our OC other than the fact that he continues to waste carries on a guy that is either over the hill or injured.

No one is asking Dak to win throwing 80% of the time. Its just when Zeke sucks so bad we have to.

You continue to prove you know nothing about football and your fail miserably to analyze your hero Zeke.

Streifenkarl · Nov 29, 2021

As usual, it's a bit of both. But the winning teams just find a way to make something out of nothinf. GB yesterday was a good example. The Rams got to Rogers alot yet he fired his rockets left right n center. Their backs ran against a wall alot of times, often even stopped before the LOS. Yet they kept using them until it worked.

Kellen has just kinda stopped using the run game after a few poor tries. Our game became one dimensional with Dak also using deep passes less and less.

Really weird, imo we just beat ourselves vs Denver and LV, could have been 9-2 now which would be a ok.

RaZon · Nov 29, 2021

Best offensive line I have seen in 2021

the-michigan-offensive-line-heads-onto-the-field-after-a-kickoff-a-picture-id1186307119

tunahelper · Nov 29, 2021

RaZon said:
Best offensive line I have seen in 2021

Watching that Michigan OL work was beautiful. They looked impressive in handling the Ohio St defensive front. I found myself focusing on them intently as they bulldozed.

odog422 · Nov 29, 2021

RonnieT24 said:
Man it made sad as I watched multiple teams open up gaping holes for their backs down after down. It also made me realize that our line is nowhere near as good as its reputation. Well let me qualify that.. Our line cannot execute Kellen Moore's run plays as good as its reputation. What I notice about other teams is that they tend to double team at the point of attack. The Packers did it to Aaron Donald a dozen times when they needed to run the ball. Same with the Bucs when they were closing out the game against the Colts.. And the Broncos against the Chargers.. Admittedly I didn't study it as intently as I do our schemes, but I saw precious little of the slide step reach blocking we feature in our running attack. Maybe Moore thinks our guys are more athletic than they are.. but we repeatedly allow penetration when we run this scheme. Yes we can gash teams with sorry *** fronts with it but against even decent fronts our linemen get knocked into the backfield more often than not. Against good fronts we have no chance whatsoever to run the ball. I also noticed that teams stayed committed to the run even when it wasn't yielding big yards. Dillon and Jones were averaging just over 3 ypc against the Rams but they kept hammering at it all game long. They never surrendered the way we do. And they have Aaron Freaking Rodgers at QB.. Oh and that guy with the Bucs is an okay QB too.. yet they also kept pounding the run even when it was getting them under 4 ypc until late in the game. Yes WE have turned completely skittish about running the ball and shift into 5 wide empty backfield at the drop of a hat. I love Dak Prescott as much as anyone but it's absolutely brain dead that we keep asking him to do what even teams with Hall of Fame QBs don't ask of them.. win throwing it 75-80% of the time without even a hint of a rushing attack. What the hell is wrong with our offensive coordinator that he can't see this?

I’m with you 100%. Even the part about envying other teams yesterday watching the commitment to the run.

It’s about winning football games right? I’m sure you’re familiar with the stat that since Dak has been quarterback, we are undefeated when we run more than we pass. Since 2016. Undefeated. Something like 29-0.

Why this isn’t drilled as part of the game plan or monitored in-game goes to the fact that offensively, the brain trust is pass first. I remember McCarthy receiving criticism in GB for not running enough with the talent he had in the backfield and I believe your post about Kellen lacking creativity etc with the run game was spot on because he sees it as an afterthought or, probably, more accurately, doesn’t believe it effective unless we are getting chunk plays, i.e., 5+ yds per carry so he abandons it. Of course, there is also when we are getting that yardage and then he abruptly goes to empty backfield. Head scratcher. Does he not see the way an offense unites and gets fired up when it bulldozes a team down the field running the ball? Chip chip chip away until the wall crumbles and falls in the end zone and the OL surround and maul the back who got it in?

Like you I also thought he “got it” earlier on our win streak but we were also gashing teams. It’s the continual pounding the commitment to the run game provides that leads to the wins in November, December and the playoffs against the better defenses.

I’ve seen us execute double teams with crazy success. But it doesn’t seem to be a staple of our run game. Our staple with our downhill I-back lead runner is shotgun draw - fake pass to run. No lead block, no aggression by OL. Hate it.

Unless it somehow changes, I see what was a promising season going straight down the toilet.

PAPPYDOG · Nov 29, 2021

RonnieT24 said:
Man it made sad as I watched multiple teams open up gaping holes for their backs down after down. It also made me realize that our line is nowhere near as good as its reputation. Well let me qualify that.. Our line cannot execute Kellen Moore's run plays as good as its reputation. What I notice about other teams is that they tend to double team at the point of attack. The Packers did it to Aaron Donald a dozen times when they needed to run the ball. Same with the Bucs when they were closing out the game against the Colts.. And the Broncos against the Chargers.. Admittedly I didn't study it as intently as I do our schemes, but I saw precious little of the slide step reach blocking we feature in our running attack. Maybe Moore thinks our guys are more athletic than they are.. but we repeatedly allow penetration when we run this scheme. Yes we can gash teams with sorry *** fronts with it but against even decent fronts our linemen get knocked into the backfield more often than not. Against good fronts we have no chance whatsoever to run the ball. I also noticed that teams stayed committed to the run even when it wasn't yielding big yards. Dillon and Jones were averaging just over 3 ypc against the Rams but they kept hammering at it all game long. They never surrendered the way we do. And they have Aaron Freaking Rodgers at QB.. Oh and that guy with the Bucs is an okay QB too.. yet they also kept pounding the run even when it was getting them under 4 ypc until late in the game. Yes WE have turned completely skittish about running the ball and shift into 5 wide empty backfield at the drop of a hat. I love Dak Prescott as much as anyone but it's absolutely brain dead that we keep asking him to do what even teams with Hall of Fame QBs don't ask of them.. win throwing it 75-80% of the time without even a hint of a rushing attack. What the hell is wrong with our offensive coordinator that he can't see this?

Another post by Dak Lover RonnieT trying to focus the blame from Dak.
Hey Ronnie those other teams have Franchise QB with a bunch of Superbowls rings to boot.....
We got Deer in the headlights Prescott who needs 7 secs to throw the ball.....
ZEKE has carried him since 2016 he's tired now so is our offline.....
Start to worry when Micah gets mad....at losing cause we can't score points!

Jstopper · Nov 29, 2021

PAPPYDOG said:
Another post by Dak Lover RonnieT trying to focus the blame from Dak.
Hey Ronnie those other teams have Franchise QB with a bunch of Superbowls rings to boot.....
We got Deer in the headlights Prescott who needs 7 secs to throw the ball.....
ZEKE has carried him since 2016 he's tired now so is our offline.....
Start to worry when Micah gets mad....at losing cause we can't score points!

and again Pap smear the point goes over your head. He is talking about a running game so what does that have to do with needing 7 seconds to throw? You make no sense ever

buddieluver · Nov 29, 2021

Jstopper said:
and again Pap smear the point goes over your head. He is talking about a running game so what does that have to do with needing 7 seconds to throw? You make no sense ever[/QUOTE

Pap is Dak obsessed.

John813 · Nov 29, 2021

Imo sounds like your critique should be addressed to Philbin.

PAPPYDOG · Nov 29, 2021

Jstopper said:
and again Pap smear the point goes over your head. He is talking about a running game so what does that have to do with needing 7 seconds to throw? You make no sense ever

LOL....he's blaming the offline which is considered one of the best in the NFL.
It currently has at least 2 HOF on it.
If Zeke cant run it's because the defense is playing stop the run because they have no fear of our passing game!
See how both intertwine on offense?
RonnieT give it up let me say it one more time.,......at least 2 HOF.....

charron · Nov 29, 2021

Indy was Terrible vs the run yesterday.

America's Cowboy · Nov 29, 2021

PAPPYDOG said:
LOL....he's blaming the offline which is considered one of the best in the NFL.
It currently has at least 2 HOF on it.
If Zeke cant run it's because the defense is playing stop the run because they have no fear of our passing game!
See how both intertwine on offense?
RonnieT give it up let me say it one more time.,......at least 2 HOF.....

Pappypoo, you don't even know what you are talking about. It's clearly obvious you didn't play on the Oline, much less excelled at it, because if you had, you would notice what is wrong with this Oline. You can have all the talent in the world (HOF talent), but if you are not coached and trained correctly, you will not succeed winning your battles in the trenches on the field.

This Oline is being coached and trained wrong. They stand straight up. Hardly ever fired out and stay low in order to win the battle of leverages. All size and strength but fat, slow and wrong techniques. That's why they lose and fail to even open up a 5 foot hole for Zeke to run through. Everyone wonders why they consistently fail to convert those 3rd or 4th and 1s into 1st downs, including at the goal line? It's because they are badly coached and are getting beat with better leverage from opposing Dlines at the line of scrimmage. You wouldn't know that because you never played Oline, much less excelled at it, so obviously, you don't know what you're watching. All you've got is, "But we've got 2 HOFers in our Oline!!!" And??? Yet, they are getting beat!
:facepalm:

You should be asking, "Why are they getting beat?"

Jarv · Nov 29, 2021

Challenge the single high safety or man to man by throwing deep, maybe even get some calls by not overthrowing the WR and coverage. That can help to soften the 8-9 in the box run stuffing.

DuncanIso · Nov 29, 2021

RonnieT24 said:
Man it made sad as I watched multiple teams open up gaping holes for their backs down after down. It also made me realize that our line is nowhere near as good as its reputation. Well let me qualify that.. Our line cannot execute Kellen Moore's run plays as good as its reputation. What I notice about other teams is that they tend to double team at the point of attack. The Packers did it to Aaron Donald a dozen times when they needed to run the ball. Same with the Bucs when they were closing out the game against the Colts.. And the Broncos against the Chargers.. Admittedly I didn't study it as intently as I do our schemes, but I saw precious little of the slide step reach blocking we feature in our running attack. Maybe Moore thinks our guys are more athletic than they are.. but we repeatedly allow penetration when we run this scheme. Yes we can gash teams with sorry *** fronts with it but against even decent fronts our linemen get knocked into the backfield more often than not. Against good fronts we have no chance whatsoever to run the ball. I also noticed that teams stayed committed to the run even when it wasn't yielding big yards. Dillon and Jones were averaging just over 3 ypc against the Rams but they kept hammering at it all game long. They never surrendered the way we do. And they have Aaron Freaking Rodgers at QB.. Oh and that guy with the Bucs is an okay QB too.. yet they also kept pounding the run even when it was getting them under 4 ypc until late in the game. Yes WE have turned completely skittish about running the ball and shift into 5 wide empty backfield at the drop of a hat. I love Dak Prescott as much as anyone but it's absolutely brain dead that we keep asking him to do what even teams with Hall of Fame QBs don't ask of them.. win throwing it 75-80% of the time without even a hint of a rushing attack. What the hell is wrong with our offensive coordinator that he can't see this?

we need an elite OL coach.

Big Mike hired his buddy from Green Bay.

DuncanIso · Nov 29, 2021

Jarv said:
Challenge the single high safety or man to man by throwing deep, maybe even get some calls by not overthrowing the WR and coverage. That can help to soften the 8-9 in the box run stuffing.

teams are playing 2 man on us.

they get away with it because we aren’t running the football.

DuncanIso · Nov 29, 2021

John813 said:
Imo sounds like your critique should be addressed to Philbin.

big Mikes buddy….

acr731 · Nov 29, 2021

America's Cowboy said:
Pappypoo, you don't even know what you are talking about. It's clearly obvious you didn't play on the Oline, much less excelled at it, because if you had, you would notice what is wrong with this Oline. You can have all the talent in the world (HOF talent), but if you are not coached and trained correctly, you will not succeed winning your battles in the trenches on the field.

This Oline is being coached and trained wrong. They stand straight up. Hardly ever fired out and stay low in order to win the battle of leverages. All size and strength but fat, slow and wrong techniques. That's why they lose and fail to even open up a 5 foot hole for Zeke to run through. Everyone wonders why they consistently fail to convert those 3rd or 4th and 1s into 1st downs, including at the goal line? It's because they are badly coached and are getting beat with better leverage from opposing Dlines at the line of scrimmage. You wouldn't know that because you never played Oline, much less excelled at it, so obviously, you don't know what you're watching. All you've got is, "But we've got 2 HOFers in our Oline!!!" And??? Yet, they are getting beat!

You should be asking, "Why are they getting beat?"

I won't disagree with the coaching aspect of their issues, but I'm curious about something. How can these guys still need to be coached on their jobs? These are professional athletes who have been playing these positions at 3 different levels, maybe even longer, with their best 'coaching' coming at the college level. Why would they still need to be told how to do their job? Maybe I'm wrong, but I would think that a seasoned o'line player who has been playing the position since middle school would have seen every technique a defensive player might use by the time they get to the professional level.

Lets use Tyron's boneheaded play for example, the play when he went right and left a guy to his left with a free path to the QB. Is that poor coaching or just a brain fart moment on Tyron's part? Tyron KNOWS how to play the position, so was that poor coaching or simply poor execution?

I don't know, man, it just seems to me that they are just playing stupid and not using their heads. It could be one of the reasons why NE was so successful for as long as they were. Billy B doesn't tolerate stupid players.

John813 · Nov 29, 2021

DuncanIso said:
big Mikes buddy….

Yup. Now I think overall he's done well with development, but any type of blocking technique that the OP was noticing would be from the OL coach.

Now of course the playcalling/formations fall on Moore and I do think at times he can be too predictable when he calls run plays. And, while our front 5 has some power, they aren't the 2014/2016 line of you know what's coming but you can't stop it level of talent.

Point-of-the-Star · Nov 29, 2021

RonnieT24 said:
Man it made sad as I watched multiple teams open up gaping holes for their backs down after down. It also made me realize that our line is nowhere near as good as its reputation. Well let me qualify that.. Our line cannot execute Kellen Moore's run plays as good as its reputation. What I notice about other teams is that they tend to double team at the point of attack. The Packers did it to Aaron Donald a dozen times when they needed to run the ball. Same with the Bucs when they were closing out the game against the Colts.. And the Broncos against the Chargers.. Admittedly I didn't study it as intently as I do our schemes, but I saw precious little of the slide step reach blocking we feature in our running attack. Maybe Moore thinks our guys are more athletic than they are.. but we repeatedly allow penetration when we run this scheme. Yes we can gash teams with sorry *** fronts with it but against even decent fronts our linemen get knocked into the backfield more often than not. Against good fronts we have no chance whatsoever to run the ball. I also noticed that teams stayed committed to the run even when it wasn't yielding big yards. Dillon and Jones were averaging just over 3 ypc against the Rams but they kept hammering at it all game long. They never surrendered the way we do. And they have Aaron Freaking Rodgers at QB.. Oh and that guy with the Bucs is an okay QB too.. yet they also kept pounding the run even when it was getting them under 4 ypc until late in the game. Yes WE have turned completely skittish about running the ball and shift into 5 wide empty backfield at the drop of a hat. I love Dak Prescott as much as anyone but it's absolutely brain dead that we keep asking him to do what even teams with Hall of Fame QBs don't ask of them.. win throwing it 75-80% of the time without even a hint of a rushing attack. What the hell is wrong with our offensive coordinator that he can't see this?

IMO the biggest flaw is I see other teams at the goal line run off tackle (GB and Indy yesterday for example) and their RB get into the EZ relatively clean. This and there's been multiple examples of us having multiple tries from the 1 yard line and can't cleanly punch it in. It cost us a clear score twice this year. We should be able to make it clear to the point that the referees can't make a judgement call as to whether the the ball crossed the plane of the goal. Also several 4th down short yardage runs. Too often our guys can't move their guys.

I'm with you Ronnie, I'm a bit envious.

Watching other teams run block today was depressing

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There are no Dak haters just Cowboy lovers!!!

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There are no Dak haters just Cowboy lovers!!!

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Loud pipes saves lives.

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Jerry learned to GM from Pee Wee Herman

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