Has Dak Peaked?

Motorola

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oh, yeah, its been this way now for over 4 years......and bound to get really bad in July, the slowest football month. so I assume another 1400 Dak threads and another 73292 comments before training camp
I least there will be a break from that in three weeks - the NFL Draft Thursday through Saturday (Apr. 28-30),
followed by UDFA signings - Saturday evening through Sunday (April 30th thru May 1st).
Plenty of fodder to discuss, cheer, bemoan , or get angry about (that will push the QB debate aside for awhile).
 

MountaineerCowboy

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Always moving the goalposts....

Is it important to win as a QB or not? Or is it important to put up the emptiest of stats while "leading" your team to 4 wins? looking at you Deshaun....

How would you propose we measure these seasons then? I didn't stutter when i said the most successful and efficient rookie season a qb has ever had. That implies wins and high efficiency.

You can choose to say that career LOSERS like RG3 and Cam had better seasons, doesn't make it true.
I'm sorry I cannot go forward with this until you admit that:

Based on your criteria for what makes a good QB you outlined above in your post, I need you to both admit that Dak is the reason we have won nothing meaningful in 6 years and that Deshaun Watson is the 2nd best QB ever before we can move forward.

So, if you want to discuss this you must admit, that based on what you outlined in your above post, you believe these two things to be true.
 

Ken

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I would include Philly last year as well....Good thing Dak plays 6 games against these "trainwreck" teams. Good for stats.
They won a super bowl not too long ago and made the playoffs last year.

I wouldn't include them in that category, but if it helps you scratch your Dak bashing itch, by all means- go ahead!
 

Ken

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I'm sorry I cannot go forward with this until you admit that:

Based on your criteria for what makes a good QB you outlined above in your post, I need you to both admit that Dak is the reason we have won nothing meaningful in 6 years and that Deshaun Watson is the 2nd best QB ever before we can move forward.

So, if you want to discuss this you must admit, that based on what you outlined in your above post, you believe these two things to be true.
I didn't think you actually had an argument. I will take this as you posting an 'L' on this convo.

Also, my criteria I outlined clearly had "13 wins" in it....Watson doesn't have that when he posts his best season with 4. Try again bud.
 

ondaedg

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this is pretty much the read on dak he is a good but not great qb i just dont think he will ever win a superbowl in his total time in the nfl i simply believe he is not good enough

Jeff Hostetler, Jim McMahon, Joe Flacco, Mark Rypien, Brad Johnson, Eli Manning, Dilfer, Williams, Etc etc have all won Super Bowls. Dak is clearly good enough to win a super bowl.
 

MountaineerCowboy

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I didn't think you actually had an argument. I will take this as you posting an 'L' on this convo.

Also, my criteria I outlined clearly had "13 wins" in it....Watson doesn't have that when he posts his best season with 4. Try again bud.
You used "wins" as one of the criteria on what makes Dak's rookie season better than other QBs rookie season, therefore all the Cowboys lack of post season success must also be contributed solely to the QB if your criteria is being used.

Watson is brought up because you threw passer rating in there to try and make your point about Dak's rookie season being better than other QBs rookie season, and Watson is 2nd best all time in that category, so Watson must be the 2nd best QB of all time, right?

So, again:

Based on your criteria for what makes a good QB you outlined above in your post, I need you to both admit that Dak is the reason we have won nothing meaningful in 6 years and that Deshaun Watson is the 2nd best QB ever before we can move forward.
 

TexasHillbilly

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It’s a fine line. Dak was paid because our FO shared your concerns. Finding a good QB is difficult. But I prefer the Denver/Philly approach where you load up the roster and wait for the right QB to become available.
I get that mentality but because of FA, caps and the like, you can't hold a team together for very long. It's all about the money no matter what side your on....ownership or player.
 

Flamma

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Again, there is always this "eyeball test" that the haters use to measure "elite qb play".

Then when said "elite qb" flames out in big games, it doesn't matter anymore. They are still elite....Dak....no such leeway.

That's usually because proven QBs are given the benefit of the doubt. What is the eyeball test? Believing in what you see over a spreadsheet? I see you stat guys in here. It's the only thing you have. Try to fool people with numbers, but make no mention how they came to be. Typical statistics. Nobody watching believes it, but throw up some numbers as a last resort. You do realize you don't need stats to see who is good and who isn't, right? If not for stats, no one would know Tyreek Hill is a good WR? Once you start using stats to elevate a player beyond what they are, you're just fooling yourself.
 

morat1959

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You come here and constantly rip on Dak, Myself I talk of many different aspect of this team. I get it you don't like Dak, you have the right but it gets old when this is an obsession with you. Dak 24/7 ripping on him. Give it rest.

Lastly don't worry about fans like me, I'm doing just fine, and do not need your crap
Dak sux!
 

Doomsday101

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That's usually because proven QBs are given the benefit of the doubt. What is the eyeball test? Believing in what you see over a spreadsheet? I see you stat guys in here. It's the only thing you have. Try to fool people with numbers, but make no mention how they came to be. Typical statistics. Nobody watching believes it, but throw up some numbers as a last resort. You do realize you don't need stats to see who is good and who isn't, right? If not for stats, no one would know Tyreek Hill is a good WR? Once you start using stats to elevate a player beyond what they are, you're just fooling yourself.

You have stats and you have record 12-5 it is what it is. Is there things he must work on and improve on yes. What gets me is stats are a true gauge if the stats are good so you go to win and loses and he helped this team to 12-5 record. Again more is needed and no he is not elite but he is good enough that he can help a team win games.
 

MyFairLady

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I hope he doesn't get much better. Tad will make him hold out for more money.
 

MountaineerCowboy

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That's usually because proven QBs are given the benefit of the doubt. What is the eyeball test? Believing in what you see over a spreadsheet? I see you stat guys in here. It's the only thing you have. Try to fool people with numbers, but make no mention how they came to be. Typical statistics. Nobody watching believes it, but throw up some numbers as a last resort. You do realize you don't need stats to see who is good and who isn't, right? If not for stats, no one would know Tyreek Hill is a good WR? Once you start using stats to elevate a player beyond what they are, you're just fooling yourself.
If people went purely off stats then the winner of the Heisman trophy would be the #1 pick every year in the draft.
 

Flamma

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You have stats and you have record 12-5 it is what it is. Is there things he must work on and improve on yes. What gets me is stats are a true gauge if the stats are good so you go to win and loses and he helped this team to 12-5 record. Again more is needed and no he is not elite but he is good enough that he can help a team win games.

Agreed. But we can't pretend he's Patrick Mahomes and use him like that. Go more towards the 2016 team.
 
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