News: QB Tiers by Jason La Canfora CBS Sports

Aerolithe_Lion

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I never said his sexual assault cases has anything to do with throwing the football. What I SAID was he had to take a year off from football because of his sexual assault cases. I'm not going to sit here and assume that he's the same guy he was in 2020 when he went 4-12 but padded his stats. You know the thing y'all say Dak does?

Jesus.....there is NO ARGUMENT for Dak being better than Deshaun. I NEVER ONCE said that. What I said was they are the SAME CALIBER. You've yet to post nothing to suggest they aren't. You can go to your "padded stats" argument, you can go to your "W/L" argument, you can go to whatever you want....there is nothing here to suggest Deshaun Watson is a tier better than Dak Prescott other than your preference.



Because taking a year off from football hurts your play especially in the NFL. Dak's and Joe Burrow will be better quarterbacks this year than they were last season having a true offseason without worrying about injury. True or false?


Tier 3 is Pro Bowl Caliber: QB’s who will put up nice stats if the Oline is healthy and the skill positions are well-invested. QB’s who can reliably finish the season with winning records when everything is going right, will make an occasional pro bowl if a guy higher on the list is injured, Though will rarely if ever be considered for All-Pro. Also Not impossible to make a super bowl run of the team is loaded.

You literally described Deshaun Watson lol. Deshaun Watson is never going on a SB run unless his team is loaded lol. Same argument can be made for Russell Wilson,. Herbert and Stafford.

Truthfully, none of these quarterbacks are making a SB run without a team that's loaded lol.

This whole tier thing is just fodder created by the media and armchair GM's.

At the end of the day the best teams win. Eli Manning won 2 SB's. Never had the best team around him but they peaked at the right time and with the proper coaching. But for some strange reason, you guys are trying to convince me there's some imaginary "tier" of quarterback that's not defined by "wins" but defined by how far you can throw the football and how hard you can throw it. ITs ridiculous. We judge quarterbacks based on team result. Let's just call it what it is. Nobody gave Romo or Phillip Rivers the passes for their teams not being good enough.

If you don’t rate Dak by his ability to win football games as you say it’s not a QB stat, and you don’t rate Dak on how he plays on the field in which Watson has shown to be superior in nearly every aspect, how do you even value the QB at all? Is Dak the same as Dalton to you? They’ve both done nothing. That’s such a narrow-viewed opinion of the position. Watson is better because he performs better. Everything he does is better. He’s better with worse talent around him. It is not my preference because one is an accused exist predator and one is a good dude. It’s just reality.

How many teams do you think right now are trading 3 1’s for Dak Prescott. Now let’s say he goes out and molests someone and get away with it, but it’s a huge black eye to his reputation. Now how many teams are trading 3 1’s for him. Some of the most reputable teams in the NFL were willing to bend over backwards to get their hands on him. New Orleans has been a cultural NFL institution for over a decade. They are one of the best judges of talent of any team in the league. The way they keep drafting pro bowlers is astonishing, had both offensive and defensive RotY in 2017. Yet you think you know better than them because… it’s their preference to pay more for Deshaun Watson than anyone has ever paid for any QB? No, they know he’s better, it’s not even close.

Your true false question makes no sense because Watson has no injury, yet you bring up the point those QB’s will be better because they’ll be further separated from the injuries that exclude them from the Watson comparison. But sure, I’ll play. Will Burrow be better in 2022? It’s plausible due to him being a 2 year player, that has little to do with his injury. Will Dak be better? Do you believe Dak had a down year last year? Did it have anything to do with the time lost, or was it tentativeness due to recovering from injury? One of those thing does not apply to Watson. His Oline just became less experienced and he lost his primary target, I don’t think it’s expected he improves next year, no. So false. The excuses are already in place.

Peyton Manning missed all of 2011 and then had a season in 2012 that was better than any of his 2007-2010 seasons. And that’s with a weaker arm, imagine if he was at 2013 strength. Watson doesn’t have an injury issues to play what-if with. Is there some rule that says Peyton is not allowed to have that good of a season coming off injury? I don’t understand where you’re going with that point. Michael Vick was the same. He missed 2003 with injury and came back in 2004 and had his best pre-Philadelphia season.

Watson is not a tier 3 QB because his play is head and shoulders above any of the QBs in that tier. Take away his talent and his team will be worse, but he won’t. Take away Zeke in 2017 and Dak suffers noticeably. I’ve had conversations with you where you won’t even entertain pre-Cooper 2017 as an indication of Dak’s abilities because he changed afterward. Deshaun doesn’t do that. Take away Deandre Hopkins and he has the best season of his life. I’m not here arguing that Dak is pasding anything. ONCE AGAIN you’re trying to take some other random poster’s comments and edge them in here because… you don’t have anything else for it?

Wins and loses aren’t a QB stat to you, right? So to you Watson didn’t go 4-12, the team did. He just had a season that is superior to anything Dak has ever done.
 

Aerolithe_Lion

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Jackson is a RB mascarading as a QB, he gets neutralized in post season because he can't run any more as defenses get tougher and he has to rely on his passing from the pocket.

and its funny you throwing accoldates at him, and then trash Dak for similar results.....

Ive don’t trash Dak. I have him as one of the top 12 QBs on planet Earth. But Jackson has been able to run in the playoffs. Not sure what you mean by neutralizing his running ability… he’s got nearly 400 yards in 4 games, including a 130 and a 140 yard performance, 2 of the best ever from a QB position.
 

TheMarathonContinues

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If you don’t rate Dak by his ability to win football games as you say it’s not a QB stat, and you don’t rate Dak on how he plays on the field in which Watson has shown to be superior in nearly every aspect, how do you even value the QB at all? Is Dak the same as Dalton to you? They’ve both done nothing. That’s such a narrow-viewed opinion of the position. Watson is better because he performs better. Everything he does is better. He’s better with worse talent around him. It is not my preference because one is an accused exist predator and one is a good dude. It’s just reality.

What "superior" play are you referencing? How has he shown to be superior?

Dak and Dalton aren't of the same caliber. Like I said earlier, you like Watson because of preference. There is nothing factual out there that says he's a tier better than Dak.

How many teams do you think right now are trading 3 1’s for Dak Prescott. Now let’s say he goes out and molests someone and get away with it, but it’s a huge black eye to his reputation. Now how many teams are trading 3 1’s for him. Some of the most reputable teams in the NFL were willing to bend over backwards to get their hands on him. New Orleans has been a cultural NFL institution for over a decade. They are one of the best judges of talent of any team in the league. The way they keep drafting pro bowlers is astonishing, had both offensive and defensive RotY in 2017. Yet you think you know better than them because… it’s their preference to pay more for Deshaun Watson than anyone has ever paid for any QB? No, they know he’s better, it’s not even close.

That's a silly standard for how good a guy is...just because the Browns were STUPID enough to trade 3 1's isn't really relevant to the discussion. Jerry Jones traded a 1st rounder for Amari Cooper and the Cardinals traded a 2nd and 4th for Deandre Hopkins. Does that mean Amari Cooper is better?

Bronco's didn't even trade 3 1st rounders for Russell Wilson. But to answer your question...I don't know too many teams dumb enough to trade 3 1st rounders for a quarterback. Especially one who had the offseason Watson had.

How about let's stand on our own two feet in this discussion. Using the Saints evaluation of a player seems a little desperate. The same team that's going into next season with TAysom Hill and Jameis Winston as their quarterbacks.....

Your true false question makes no sense because Watson has no injury, yet you bring up the point those QB’s will be better because they’ll be further separated from the injuries that exclude them from the Watson comparison. But sure, I’ll play. Will Burrow be better in 2022? It’s plausible due to him being a 2 year player, that has little to do with his injury. Will Dak be better? Do you believe Dak had a down year last year? Did it have anything to do with the time lost, or was it tentativeness due to recovering from injury? One of those thing does not apply to Watson. His Oline just became less experienced and he lost his primary target, I don’t think it’s expected he improves next year, no. So false. The excuses are already in place.

My point was Watson took a year of from football. I'm not going to assume he won't have any rust. People panicked when Dak missed preseason because of "rust". But those same people will say Watson will be fine missing a whole season? Alright lol.

In regards to Dak's year....he started off well and then got worse after the calf injury. He could've had a better season even though statistically it may have been his best season.

You are a funny guy. I debated you about Amari Cooper one time and you told me he didn't show up in big games. But now Dak will miss him because he's his primary target lol. You're funny man lol.

Watson is not a tier 3 QB because his play is head and shoulders above any of the QBs in that tier. Take away his talent and his team will be worse, but he won’t. Take away Zeke in 2017 and Dak suffers noticeably. I’ve had conversations with you where you won’t even entertain pre-Cooper 2017 as an indication of Dak’s abilities because he changed afterward. Deshaun doesn’t do that. Take away Deandre Hopkins and he has the best season of his life. I’m not here arguing that Dak is pasding anything. ONCE AGAIN you’re trying to take some other random poster’s comments and edge them in here because… you don’t have anything else for it?

Wins and loses aren’t a QB stat to you, right? So to you Watson didn’t go 4-12, the team did. He just had a season that is superior to anything Dak has ever done.

This doesn't make sense. Zeke hasn't been Zeke since....maybe 2016. He surely wasn't Zeke last year or the season before. So technically DAk hasn't had Zeke for a few seasons now. Not the one that lead the league in rushing. Dak missed Gallup and Cooper games last season. You are giving credit to Deshaun for what? Because he padded his stats against bad teams? He hasn't been in the playoffs since he had Hopkins and a supporting cast. Its odd you're making him out to be this guy who's had all this success with no talent around him.
 

buddahjoe445

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Dak had 1 year where he wasnt surrounded by extremely skilled players and he sucked so bad that Jerry had to trade for Cooper.

Dak doesnt make players around him better. Thats the problem. That makes him very average and very replaceable. I didnt see a big difference between Dak and Dalton. Give Dalton or Cooper Rush a full off season as QB1 with Dallas and his stats would look similar to Daks.
 

Aerolithe_Lion

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What "superior" play are you referencing? How has he shown to be superior?

Dak and Dalton aren't of the same caliber. Like I said earlier, you like Watson because of preference.

He hasn't been in the playoffs since he had Hopkins and a supporting cast. Its odd you're making him out to be this guy who's had all this success with no talent around him.

How do you have success without winning games? How do you make the playoffs without winning games? You keep saying winning isn’t a QB stat, then blame a QB for not winning. Do you not see how this is a complete double standard? Every time you shoot it down, you then go against your word. Is winning an important QB stat now? At least let me know where you stand on the subject this week before you flip flop again.

Your very own argument about why Dak and Watson are in the same tier is because both have accomplished zilch. Why is Dak above Dalton’s tier then in your classification? Because Dak’s on field performance exceeds what we’ve seen from Dalton, despite them having similar career accomplishments.

Just as Watson’s exceeds Dak.
 
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PAPPYDOG

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Dak had 1 year where he wasnt surrounded by extremely skilled players and he sucked so bad that Jerry had to trade for Cooper.

Dak doesnt make players around him better. Thats the problem. That makes him very average and very replaceable. I didnt see a big difference between Dak and Dalton. Give Dalton or Cooper Rush a full off season as QB1 with Dallas and his stats would look similar to Daks.
horrible-crying.gif
 

TheMarathonContinues

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How do you have success without winning games? How do you make the playoffs without winning games? You keep saying winning isn’t a QB stat, then blame a QB for not winning. Do you not see how this is a complete double standard? Every time you shoot it down, you then go against your word. Is winning an important QB stat now? At least let me know where you stand on the subject this week before you flip flop again.

Your very own argument about why Dak and Watson are in the same tier is because both have accomplished zilch. Why is Dak above Dalton’s tier then in your classification? Because Dak’s on field performance exceeds what we’ve seen from Dalton, despite them having similar career accomplishments.

Just as Watson’s exceeds Dak.
So let me get this straight. You say Watson performs without a supporting cast. So how has Dak not performed without his? What’s your definition of performing?

Dak’s on field performance is better then Daltons…Watson and Dak’s performance is of the same caliber.
 

DogFace

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I think It’s time to rethink the “everyone’s entitled to their opinion” thing.
 

Aerolithe_Lion

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So let me get this straight. You say Watson performs without a supporting cast. So how has Dak not performed without his? What’s your definition of performing?

Dak’s on field performance is better then Daltons…Watson and Dak’s performance is of the same caliber.

Dak’s And Watson’s are not the same caliber. My definition of performing is how they play on the field. Watson has been historically prolific in the first 4 seasons of his career. Anything you can say about the Cowboys front office, supporting cast, divisional competition; everything is in Dak’s favor when comparing to Houston. Terrible offensive lines, a front office that is seemingly sabotaging the team, downright negligent coaching, and trading away good players for little to nothing. Yet his accuracy, TD %, QBR, NY/A continually rise to be amongst historically great players. He really is on another level above anything we’ve seen from Dak.
 

G2

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Dak had 1 year where he wasnt surrounded by extremely skilled players and he sucked so bad that Jerry had to trade for Cooper.

Dak doesnt make players around him better. Thats the problem. That makes him very average and very replaceable. I didnt see a big difference between Dak and Dalton. Give Dalton or Cooper Rush a full off season as QB1 with Dallas and his stats would look similar to Daks.
Isn't it refreshing that it's not 1 on 53?
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Ive don’t trash Dak. I have him as one of the top 12 QBs on planet Earth. But Jackson has been able to run in the playoffs. Not sure what you mean by neutralizing his running ability… he’s got nearly 400 yards in 4 games, including a 130 and a 140 yard performance, 2 of the best ever from a QB position.
well, perhaps a bit more explanation...he is 1-3 in the playoffs, with offense averaging about 13 pts a game. essentially the offense becomes ineffective. NFL is not about QBs that can run. your primary job as a passer is to be able to stand in the pocket and deliver the ball and push the ball down field as much as you can. running is secondary. scrambling is secondary. I am not saying those things are bad, but not necessarily to succeed as NFL QB. I think Jackson is a regular season champion, that his team may struggle to find success in post season until he becomes a better pocket passer. everyone rags on Dak and his post season record and performance, jacksons is somewhat worse.
 
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