PFT implies Watson punishment should be no more than Jerry, Kraft or Sydner

Reid1boys

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I didn’t read all of that . Has there been one of the violations that wasn’t punished ? I can’t even imagine that scenario.

The league and Commish would never tolerate an arbitrator who didn’t punish players for violating Personal Conduct Policy.
No, there hs never been as you describe, because Goodell was always the one dishing out punishment. This arbitrator was NUTUALLY AGREED TO by the nflpa and the league. Now that she's in place, she doesn't answer to Roger.
 

Diehardblues

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No, there hs never been as you describe, because Goodell was always the one dishing out punishment. This arbitrator was NUTUALLY AGREED TO by the nflpa and the league. Now that she's in place, she doesn't answer to Roger.
But she answers to the league which in turn means Goodell . They put the arbitrator in place , they can take her away.

If you believe this arbitrator is going to begin dismissing these Personal Conduct Policy violations , I think you have a poor perception of why they chose one . Which was to take the heat off of Goodell.
 

Reid1boys

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I don’t believe the Arbitrator is in place to decide if they violated the Personal Conduct Policy but more of deciding the punishment .

If the Arbitrator begins letting players off of violating the Personal Conduct Policy with no punishment I suspect the league will re-evaluate the arbitrator and or entire process.

Well seeing how the arbitration process is in the CBA, the league can't do anything until the next contract.
 

Reid1boys

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But she answers to the league which in turn means Goodell . They put the arbitrator in place , they can take her away.

If you believe this arbitrator is going to begin dismissing these Personal Conduct Policy violations , I think you have a poor perception of why they chose one .
Holy cow.. can you read what I wrote. Don't interpret it in some way to fit your narrative. You might want to look up how arbitrators work.

I never once said or implied that this arbitrator is not going to punishment players for violating the Personal conduct part of the CBA. I implied, that unlike Roger, this arbitrator will actually use the facts in front of her to decide these cases.
 

Diehardblues

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Holy cow.. can you read what I wrote. Don't interpret it in some way to fit your narrative. You might want to look up how arbitrators work.

I never once said or implied that this arbitrator is not going to punishment players for violating the Personal conduct part of the CBA. I implied, that unlike Roger, this arbitrator will actually use the facts in front of her to decide these cases.
But facts of the case pertaining to criminally negligent don’t necessarily directly correlate on violation of Personal Conduct Policy. I’m not sure you fully grasp the intent of such policy . It’s not a legal proceeding. It’s a company policy disciplinary action.

If the Arbitrator isn’t going to dismiss any of these cases then the appeal process doesn’t apply since all punishments are subject to appeal. I think it’s why they placed the option or clause in there. They don’t expect any to be dismissed making it basically meaningless.

The league has even officially said they don’t want to appeal the punishments . I think we will see similar punishments and fans will have someone new to boo besides Goodell.
 
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Diehardblues

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Now if any of the Arbitrator punishments fall well below what the league is pursuing then I think we will see appeals .

And why the league made it publicly known what their intent was to suspend for one year and potential unlimited based on the upcoming pending lawsuits and trials. At some point he could re apply .

The league is setting the tone or mark where they believe the Arbitrator should rule . Anything drastically contrary I believe they will appeal.
 

Reid1boys

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But facts of the case pertaining to criminally negligent don’t necessarily directly correlate on violation of Personal Conduct Policy. I’m not sure you fully grasp the intent of such policy . It’s not a legal proceeding. It’s a company policy disciplinary action.

If the Arbitrator isn’t going to dismiss any of these cases then the appeal process doesn’t apply since all punishments are subject to appeal. I think it’s why they placed the option or clause in there. They don’t expect any to be dismissed making it basically meaningless.

The league has even officially said they don’t want to appeal the punishments . I think we will see similar punishments and fans will have someone new to boo besides Goodell.
I understand exactly what is taking place here, but as someone who was in the union at UPS, was the president of my local chapter, and also filed a grievance that was settled for money against a university, I think you might misunderstand how these work. View the contract as the laws. The league as the police/prosecutor, and the arbitrator is very much like the judge. You assume that simple because the league is "pressing charges, " so to soak, that there will automatically be "Conviction." This is where I believe you are very mistaken. Go watch the video i posted of Mike dorp discussing, what is essentially a legal proceeding. It is easily the best information i have seen on this new process and might open your eyes a little.
 

Reid1boys

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Now if any of the Arbitrator punishments fall well below what the league is pursuing then I think we will see appeals .

And why the league made it publicly known what their intent was to suspend for one year and potential unlimited based on the upcoming pending lawsuits and trials. At some point he could re apply .

The league is setting the tone or mark where they believe the Arbitrator should rule . Anything drastically contrary I believe they will appeal.
They are laying the ground work in case zero punishment is given. This way they can say see, we did all we could. Why put that out in public? You don't think their wishes for disowned weren't actually filled with the arbitrator?
 

Haimerej

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Yep

The fact the Texans reserved a Houston hotel with massage tables and had these girls sign a consent form would suggest they knew what was going on.

And why they have been named in this latest lawsuit.

I would say that aspect could give the DA motive to be less than ardent in his fact finding. If the Texans organization is culpable he's weighing the benefit of going after a beloved Houston organization with the fact he's going to face an election.
 

Diehardblues

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I understand exactly what is taking place here, but as someone who was in the union at UPS, was the president of my local chapter, and also filed a grievance that was settled for money against a university, I think you might misunderstand how these work. View the contract as the laws. The league as the police/prosecutor, and the arbitrator is very much like the judge. You assume that simple because the league is "pressing charges, " so to soak, that there will automatically be "Conviction." This is where I believe you are very mistaken. Go watch the video i posted of Mike dorp discussing, what is essentially a legal proceeding. It is easily the best information i have seen on this new process and might open your eyes a little.
I understand . What I meant was this isn’t a legal case to prove conviction of a crime . The fact he was accused of such a crime is cause enough for disciplinary action of Personal Conduct Policy . The league doesn’t have a burden to prove he committed a crime . That doesn’t mean the process might be of legal nature. He does have legal representation pleading his case.
 

Haimerej

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C'mooooooon, J, you're twisting. I said it was a crime, just not assault, and you know it. I also have said repeatedly that it is unacceptable behavior. Please stop twisting things.

My mistake. Apologies for impugning you.

But why wouldn't it be considered assault? Wouldn't it be considered sexual assault if say, a patron cornered a waitress and hit her with his junk?
 

Diehardblues

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I would say that aspect could give the DA motive to be less than ardent in his fact finding. If the Texans organization is culpable he's weighing the benefit of going after a beloved Houston organization with the fact he's going to face an election.
Correct and why this will end up in Civil suit. No DA wants to be known as the elected official who took their team down.
 

Diehardblues

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My mistake. Apologies for impugning you.

But why wouldn't it be considered assault? Wouldn't it be considered sexual assault if say, a patron cornered a waitress and hit her with his junk?
It would . And why the Civil suits claims are sexual assault.
 

Diehardblues

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They are laying the ground work in case zero punishment is given. This way they can say see, we did all we could. Why put that out in public? You don't think their wishes for disowned weren't actually filled with the arbitrator?
Of course . It’s all about protecting the leagues image and now it’s also about protecting Goodell.

It’s a smart move taking the heat off of him. I don’t think it’s about dismissing or lessening the punishment .
 

Haimerej

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and what Ive been saying is basically none of us know exactly what happened. BUT the fact there are so many woman almost forces Watson to settle. They all have the same lawyer??? how did that happen? all these woman from different parts of the country got the same lawyer? So you dont think that lawyer didnt get the word out about this case and then woman started meeting with him and pow, another case?

Were crimes committed? maybe, maybe not. BUT, only thing factual is hes not been charged.

I think that goes back to my first point, i.e. how do you prove what happened in a he said/she said private room situation. I think there's enough evidence to prove something happened, i.e. all the texts.
 

Haimerej

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only 5 cases were used by the nfl... ONLY 5. That means they didnt feel any of the other cases had anything there to even help them in this case. That is very telling to me.

"ONLY 5". Still seems like a lot.
 

Haimerej

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No, there hs never been as you describe, because Goodell was always the one dishing out punishment. This arbitrator was NUTUALLY AGREED TO by the nflpa and the league. Now that she's in place, she doesn't answer to Roger.

I think we can all appreciate the typo, "NUTUALLY," in this context. Lol
 

Reid1boys

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My mistake. Apologies for impugning you.

But why wouldn't it be considered assault? Wouldn't it be considered sexual assault if say, a patron cornered a waitress and hit her with his junk?
You need to look up the EXACT definition of the crime in question. In watsons case, his actions didn't meet the definition of sexual assault. In your example, someone cornering another, keeping them there and then doing as you described, that would be a crime. None of the accusations against Watson said he used force, threats of violence or actual violence.
 

CouchCoach

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You need to look up the EXACT definition of the crime in question. In watsons case, his actions didn't meet the definition of sexual assault. In your example, someone cornering another, keeping them there and then doing as you described, that would be a crime. None of the accusations against Watson said he used force, threats of violence or actual violence.
As far as the DA is concerned, and the only thing all of them are concerned with is getting a conviction, all he did was piss off a lot of masseuses and they can pursue that through the civil courts. There is no evidence presented so far that he forced any of them to do anything.

Now, is this behavior that the NFL wants publicized? No, but the fact is most of the ignorant public thinks these masseuses work out of parlors anyway. They don't even see it or understand it as a therapy unless they've experienced it and the happy ending was just feeling better.
 

Flamma

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Trying to touch a masseusse w/ his hoohaw is assault? Man, you need to get out more. Hey, I don't like what he did, and he should be punished. But assault? Not even.

That's closer to sexual harassment than anything else.
 
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