Football 101: The Talent Evaluation Process

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
35,684
Reaction score
27,237
bbgun;4423717 said:
But there is such a thing as an unreliable source (aka, your specialty).



Sources at two NFL organizations? You're sooooo connected. :laugh1:

What are your sources bb, that form your opinion?

All I see from you is confirmation bias. Sure his sources are not always correct but they have access that we do not and as such are going to have insights that we do not.

That doesn't sit well with you. Whatever.
 

bbgun

Benched
Messages
27,869
Reaction score
6
FuzzyLumpkins;4423895 said:
What are your sources bb, that form your opinion?

My brain and eyeballs.

All I see from you is confirmation bias. Sure his sources are not always correct but they have access that we do not and as such are going to have insights that we do not.

That doesn't sit well with you. Whatever.

That's because I don't like being fed garbage. His sources, assuming they exist, are lousy ones. It their intent is to feed him bad info and make him look foolish, then mission accomplished. AFAIK, the only poster with a reliable contact at VR is "dools."
 

casmith07

Attorney-at-Zone
Messages
31,538
Reaction score
9,312
Hey bb - did it ever occur to you that sometimes sources can be wrong?

Or sometimes people change their minds? If I was friends with, say, Kevin Ogletree, and he told me that the team told him that he'd be back, no question, but then changed their minds and released him, that all of a sudden doesn't count?
 

Hostile

The Duke
Messages
119,565
Reaction score
4,543
bbgun;4423911 said:
My brain and eyeballs.
Oh boy what a set up. Have to leave it alone though.

That's because I don't like being fed garbage. His sources, assuming they exist, are lousy ones. It their intent is to feed him bad info and make him look foolish, then mission accomplished. AFAIK, the only poster with a reliable contact at VR is "dools."
A guy who works for the Cardinals is a VR source?

I have never claimed that.

Out of curiosity, how did I know about the trade for Roy Williams? How have I rightly predicted the last 6 or 7 1st round picks we were going to go after? How was I able to confirm that Brad Sham indeed has an account here when he introduced himself?

Maybe your sources are in Park and the Dark?
 

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
35,684
Reaction score
27,237
bbgun;4423911 said:
My brain and eyeballs.



That's because I don't like being fed garbage. His sources, assuming they exist, are lousy ones. It their intent is to feed him bad info and make him look foolish, then mission accomplished. AFAIK, the only poster with a reliable contact at VR is "dools."

So exactly what external stimuli has indicated to you that when he says that x reports to Y and does this job function that is false?

Be specific if you are going to call some a liar at least back it up.

Once again I see gross generalizations such as "being fed garbage" or "their intent is to feed him bad info." You have enough class to try and justify such statements or you just going to keep the tradition of bashing people with access to sources that don't jive with your gross generalizations.
 

bbgun

Benched
Messages
27,869
Reaction score
6
casmith07;4423922 said:
Hey bb - did it ever occur to you that sometimes sources can be wrong?

Then why keep dipping back into the well? Get better sources, a la dools.

Or sometimes people change their minds? If I was friends with, say, Kevin Ogletree, and he told me that the team told him that he'd be back, no question, but then changed their minds and released him, that all of a sudden doesn't count?

The whole point of having a real source is to eliminate the uncertainty and rumors swirling on the forums and talk shows. Hell, I'd be worried that I was being used to spread misinformation.
 

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
35,684
Reaction score
27,237
Hostile;4423663 said:
Fuzzer brah, we've had our scraps, but when you are on my side, the world just makes sense. You see right through their charade and I thank you.

I think youre good people Hos and I do not like good people getting smeared like this. We do not agree all the time but I do not question your integrity whatsoever. You deserve more respect than this hogwash.

That he would rather smear you, a person he knows, so he can maintain a smear on someone he does not know, Jerry Jones, speaks about all I need to know.
 

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
35,684
Reaction score
27,237
bbgun;4423944 said:
Then why keep dipping back into the well? Get better sources, a la dools.



The whole point of having a real source is to eliminate the uncertainty and rumors swirling on the forums and talk shows. Hell, I'd be worried that I was being used to spread misinformation.

There is a difference between trying to take an objective approach and discounting out of hand. You do none of the former and all of the latter.
 

bbgun

Benched
Messages
27,869
Reaction score
6
Hostile;4423924 said:
.
A guy who works for the Cardinals is a VR source?

Huh? I was complimenting Dools. The fact that your AZ source didn't realize that AZ was in the lead for the 2015 SB is delicious.

Out of curiosity, how did I know about the trade for Roy Williams?

The fact that Jerry had been pining for him for years?

How have I rightly predicted the last 6 or 7 1st round picks we were going to go after?

Everyone steals from Goose. BTW, it took a "source" to realize that WR made sense in 2010 and OT made sense in 2011?

How was I able to confirm that Brad Sham indeed has an account here when he introduced himself?

Dear God, the namedropping never stops. I dunno, maybe you inundated him with emails as with Steve Dennis or Commissioner Goodell.
 

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
35,684
Reaction score
27,237
So you question his sources and he starts to give you an idea of who his sources are and you call it name dropping. Your posturing is pretty transparent.
 

5Stars

Here comes the Sun...
Messages
35,538
Reaction score
12,821
FuzzyLumpkins;4423960 said:
So you question his sources and he starts to give you an idea of who his sources are and you call it name dropping. Your posturing is pretty transparent.

That's his M.O. :laugh2:
 

bbgun

Benched
Messages
27,869
Reaction score
6
FuzzyLumpkins;4423960 said:
So you question his sources and he starts to give you an idea of who his sources are and you call it name dropping. Your posturing is pretty transparent.

He never said Sham was a "source," only a (closeted) forum member.
 

casmith07

Attorney-at-Zone
Messages
31,538
Reaction score
9,312
bbgun;4423944 said:
Then why keep dipping back into the well? Get better sources, a la dools.

Why? Because its a source for information or tips, not a source of fact. That's what ESPN is for when they break a story of a signing - fact.

So any time a source is wrong we should dump that source? Don't be so naive, you're older and wiser than that.

The whole point of having a real source is to eliminate the uncertainty and rumors swirling on the forums and talk shows. Hell, I'd be worried that I was being used to spread misinformation.

Real sources are not right 100% of the time.

Shot in the dark - your eyes green?
 

Hostile

The Duke
Messages
119,565
Reaction score
4,543
bbgun;4423954 said:
Huh? I was complimenting Dools. The fact that your AZ source didn't realize that AZ was in the lead for the 2015 SB is delicious.
Yeah, I gave him crap for that. He's a stand up guy and he took it.

You still went from bashing his report that I shared (that a major news site also reported) to talking about VR sources. All over the map.

The fact that Jerry had been pining for him for years?
Bad guess. I reported it in September 2007 and when the Detroit Lions denied it daily I stuck to my guns. You should wonder why.

Everyone steals from Goose. BTW, it took a "source" to realize that WR made sense in 2010 and OT made sense in 2011?
I don't steal from Goose. So I guess not everyone does.

How did I know we were going to acquire Drew Henson? I PMed Verdict and Chief about it and even told them the compensation and that Aikman attended the workout days before a news report ever mentioned it. Feel free to ask them if this is true.

How did I know that Quincy Carter had stabbed Joey Galloway in the back in a film session and Galloway had to be restrained by Woodson and Emmitt? TwoDeep3 can verify that I posted that weeks before JFE wrote her article about Quincy spiraling downhill. Feel free to ask him. He's even mad at me so he'll probably entertain you with some names for me.

Dear God, the namedropping never stops. I dunno, maybe you inundated him with emails as with Steve Dennis or Commissioner Goodell.
The eyes get greener.
 

Beast_from_East

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,420
Reaction score
26,444
Hostile;4423111 said:
What is all too typical is that every move the team makes is wrong according to many of you. Yet when shown repeatedly how other teams operate in the exact same ways...excuses.

The problem is pretty simple Hos, whatever the front office structrure is, whatever the coaching structure is, whatever the scouting structure is.........................IT IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH.


This team has won a single playoff game in 16 years, bottom line.


Doesnt matter how much the organization tries to sugar coat it for the fans, it doesnt change that fact. Something is not right with this team and has not been right for some time. Now you can call it making excuses and being chicken littles all you want, but you cant change the win-loss record of this franchise over the past 16 seasons.
 

bbgun

Benched
Messages
27,869
Reaction score
6
casmith07;4423970 said:
Why? Because its a source for information or tips, not a source of fact. That's what ESPN is for when they break a story of a signing - fact.

So any time a source is wrong we should dump that source? Don't be so naive, you're older and wiser than that.

Huh? The whole point of having an inside source is to get as close to the truth as humanly possible. ESPN = speculation. VR = fact because they're in the know. They sometimes impart bad info? Then post a disclaimer the next time you recycle their "insight."

Real sources are not right 100% of the time.

Shot in the dark - your eyes green?

Baby blue, actually. What I lack is a "big shot" gene.
 

junk

I've got moxie
Messages
9,294
Reaction score
247
Hostile;4423272 said:
Take away the username and I couldn't tell some of you from tr1 on ES.

I guess I really have no idea what that means. I think I've been to ES like twice.....usually following links from here.

Anyway, I just went back and re-read this thread just to see all the various twists and turns.

A few things jumped out at me:
1. There seems to be a concerted effort to paint the Cowboys organization as being just like other organizations in their front office structure. However, in almost every case where people pointed out examples of Dallas being different, they were largely ignored.

2. I'll admit I'm pretty down on the team right now. I think that largely has to do with the team's failures the last couple of years. Not only have they failed on the field, but they seem to fail in the same manner year after year. This boggles my mind - this team won 2 more games with Quincy Carter and Troy Hambrick in the backfield.

3. I'm not a big fan of the "GM by committee" that has been laid out in this thread. I don't expect a GM to do everything....he'll delegate to scouts and staff. However, he should be the guy in charge that sets the direction for the franchise. He should be the face of the personnel department. He should be the final decision maker. He should spend his days scouting personnel so he is informed to be the final decision maker.

I love what Ozzie Newsome has done in Baltimore. He started out as a scout and learned along side Belichick in Cleveland. He eventually worked his way up to GM paying his dues along the way. Check out his "20/20 Club". Other than Ireland, has Dallas ever had anyone out of their front office get promoted to a new position on another team?

4. I know it was dismissed as a waste of time, but if you compare Dallas to some of the other top teams in the league, you notice that they don't really have a position of strength. One area that they are particularly deep or significantly better than other teams in the league or even a team that is relatively short on holes. The Giants have their DL. The Packers receiving talent. The Ravens are have some nice across the board talent. The Saints OL.

What is the Cowboys area of strength that is significantly better than other teams? Maybe receiving corps if Austin stays healthy and Bryant progresses?
 

casmith07

Attorney-at-Zone
Messages
31,538
Reaction score
9,312
bbgun;4423982 said:
Huh? The whole point of having an inside source is to get as close to the truth as humanly possible. ESPN = speculation. VR = fact because they're in the know. They sometimes impart bad info? Then post a disclaimer the next time you recycle their "insight."



Baby blue, actually. What I lack is a "big shot" gene.

You hear that Hos? Not only must you now wait at least 24 hours after the final freak out after a loss to post Witten/Ware updates, but now everything that is not a verifiable fact, notarized with a raised seal, and signed and photographed with two forms of ID you must post a disclaimer.

Someone needs a promotion - genius guideline changes for the Zone at every turn.

Officially hitting the eject button on this thread. bbgun - you win, brometheus.
 
Top