Was Listening to Talking Cowboys and Broaddus Said Players Questioning Coaching Privately

visionary · Nov 21, 2013

VThokie7 said:
Even before the injuries began to stack up our defense was playing very poorly. It was just being masked by turnovers.

this does not correspond to the homer narrative

this team would have been great if not for injuries and bad luck

this is football and talent and coaching have no influence on outcomes

Blue Eyed Devil · Nov 21, 2013

Hopefully this Opie and Grandpa superfriends team won't last past January.

Idgit · Nov 21, 2013

VThokie7 said:
Even before the injuries began to stack up our defense was playing very poorly. It was just being masked by turnovers.

By definition, if you're getting the turnovers, you're not playing poor defense. The correlation between taking the ball away on defense and winning is pretty strong.

visionary · Nov 21, 2013

xwalker said:
I've re-watched the game more than once. They didn't quit. They were just that bad and out of sorts. They had Heath at Safety, Webb/Pellerin as nickel CBs, Bosworth at MLB. Add that to Sims and Carter playing without Lee in to lead them. They even had Everett Brown, the 265 pound DE, playing DT at some points in that game. Ware was limping around and the remainder of the DL are castoffs from other teams and one was a practice squad rookie that had never played in a regular season game.

On offense, once the Saints had a big lead, Rob Ryan could play a high risk style defense that made the Cowboys offense look even worse. He knew the Cowboys were so worried about the pass rush, that his CB completely abandoned coverage on TWilliams to jump a short out route to Witten. A D-Coordinator can cause havoc when his team has a big lead.

you may not like it but on the last couple of drives, this defense had given up

Blue Eyed Devil · Nov 21, 2013

visionary said:
this does not correspond to the homer narrative

this team would have been great if not for injuries and bad luck

this is football and talent and coaching have no influence on outcomes

Absolutely, and no team has ever been able to succeed with injury issues. That's why the 2010 Packers with 17 players on injured reserve didn't do anything in the playoffs, right?

ABQCOWBOY · Nov 21, 2013

5Stars said:
Right...and how does the media portray many things in life?

If I bacame a reporter and posted what I think I heard, would you believe it?

Happens every day. Reporters post what their own beliefs dictate and people run with it as if it is the God's Honest Truth. Happens every single day.

VThokie7 · Nov 21, 2013

Idgit said:
By definition, if you're getting the turnovers, you're not playing poor defense. The correlation between taking the ball away on defense and winning is pretty strong.

The correlation between giving up 500 yards of offense and losing is pretty strong too. You may want to rest your head on the 6 turnovers in week 1 and ignore the 478 yards and 31 points. But to me it was pretty clear that our defense was going to struggle to stop the pass.

xwalker · Nov 21, 2013

visionary said:
you may not like it but on the last couple of drives, this defense had given up

No, they didn't. That's an emotional reaction by fans. I've re-watched each play of that game 5 times.

visionary · Nov 21, 2013

xwalker said:
No, they didn't. That's an emotional reaction by fans. I've re-watched each play of that game 5 times.

difference of opinion my friend
i watched that game live and over as well

you are refusing to see what you dont want to see

human nature

17yearsandcounting · Nov 21, 2013

Bruce Carter was 100% trying to not get hit the 4th quarter. He was playing matador with Saints players.

Idgit · Nov 21, 2013

VThokie7 said:
The correlation between giving up 500 yards of offense and losing is pretty strong too. You may want to rest your head on the 6 turnovers in week 1 and ignore the 478 yards and 31 points. But to me it was pretty clear that our defense was going to struggle to stop the pass.

No doubt. I didn't phrase that post very well. The defense was not good just because we were getting turnovers, by any stretch. I've been saying a lot longer than most that the issue has been with poor pass defense, overall. My point was you can't remove the huge number of takeaways from the equation when evaluating the defense so far. Those takeaways are a big part of the reason we've beaten the teams we've been supposed to beat, and we've got a good track record at this point of being able to take the ball away. That's important.

Frozen700 · Nov 21, 2013

Beast_from_East said:
I dont need to read jack again, you said folks want to report stuff first in order to get attention............Broaddus obviously is reporting this first before any other beat writers, so what you are saying makes no sense. If the players only told Broaddus this, how would the other beat writers even know about it?

I seriously dont think Broaddus is trying to get attention by being the first to report something like Ed Werder does on ESPN, Broaddus is on the air every day so he does not need something to increase ratings or what have you.

As far as folks not believing Broaddus, both the audio and the transcript are in this thread and they can listen for themselves if they dont believe him. I have no reason to believe he is lying, so I dont know why anybody would not believe him. He has no history of making wild claims so why would he do it now?

You are getting all worked up....

If you can't see that post in not an attack against broaddus, I won't waste my time explaining.

Take a deep breathe, I know you feel a little sensitive, because people were throwing rocks at you and Broaddus, but just calm down. You are catching cardiac arrest for no reason.

Drink some warm milk and lay down in bed. Don't start a thread if you can't deal with people on the first page giving you backlash.

xwalker · Nov 21, 2013

visionary said:
difference of opinion my friend
i watched that game live and over as well

you are refusing to see what you dont want to see

human nature

Give me the name of 5 players and I'll re-watch that game with a focus on those players. Make it specific to this game. Some players like Bruce Carter and Doug Free have appeared to give less than 100% effort in other games.

T-RO · Nov 21, 2013

Beast_from_East said:
Next time listen to the tape instead of trying to find excuses for your boy Opie................besides, he is the head coach and the buck stops with him, so if the players are questioning the scheme and he does nothing about it..........thats on him.

You completely fail to understand the chain of command at valley ranch. Wade had zero influence over the offense when he was head coach. Red wasn't accountable to Phillips but directly to Jerry. Now its the same with Kiffin...they don't report nor are accountable to Garrett at all. They only answer to Jerry.

That's the org chart for the Cowboys. If you haven't learned that by now you haven't been paying attention.

cowboys2233 · Nov 21, 2013

Beast_from_East said:
Broaddus said that when he walks through the lockerroom players are telling him "can you belive what the coaches did there" and Broaddus also said that he believes the players are starting to question the defensive scheme being used.

Looks like Opie and Grandpa are starting to wear out their welcome, really dont see how Garrett survives if this thing goes south and we miss the playoffs. Look for a clean sweep of the coaching staff if that happens.

I think Broaddus has got to be the most out of touch "insider" I've ever heard of. This guy is so wrong so frequently, it's not even funny.

visionary · Nov 21, 2013

xwalker said:
Give me the name of 5 players and I'll re-watch that game with a focus on those players. Make it specific to this game. Some players like Bruce Carter and Doug Free have appeared to give less than 100% effort in other games.

like i said that is my opinion, i am not looking to try and prove anything
i have neither the time not inclination to go back and watch the game again

jterrell · Nov 21, 2013

Blue Eyed Devil said:
Absolutely, and no team has ever been able to succeed with injury issues. That's why the 2010 Packers with 17 players on injured reserve didn't do anything in the playoffs, right?

ahh, love how overused that one is.
What they don't tell you about 3 of those 17 guys ever started for the Green Bay Packers again.

xwalker · Nov 21, 2013

visionary said:
like i said that is my opinion, i am not looking to try and prove anything
i have neither the time not inclination to go back and watch the game again

Well I do have the time and inclination. I'm telling you the team didn't quit. There might have been an isolated player or two that didn't give 100% effort; however, that happens in other games also.

jterrell · Nov 21, 2013

It is completely logical and almost expected that in a locker room that gave up 600 yards passing there would be questions about what the heck was going on.

The issue is the yardage not the questioning.

Stupid to fire a coach for players that aren't good enough to play anyways.

Jerry and his old cronies bought and then sold this 4-3 cover 2 80s crap to the fan base.
This is Jerry's baby.
He gets the blame for this one.

But fans need to try and build at least a little football IQ.
The same guys screaming for Ryan to be fired and hating the 3-4 is now screaming for Kiffen to be fired and hating the 4-3.
The same guys who thought injuries weren't an excuse last year so we should fire Ryan say the same now.
Its as if no good coach ever has a bad year because his players get injured.
It is stupid.

visionary · Nov 21, 2013

jterrell said:
Jerry and his old cronies bought and then sold this 4-3 cover 2 80s crap to the fan base.
This is Jerry's baby.
He gets the blame for this one.

.

wait, i thought Kiffin was a Garrett hire
Garrett had 'ties' to kiffin from his TB days
IIRC we had several stories about how Garrett had been impressed with kiffin and marinelli and had learned a lot from them

the narrative changes daily

jterrell said:
ahh, love how overused that one is.
What they don't tell you about 3 of those 17 guys ever started for the Green Bay Packers again.

care to hazard a guess as to how many of the "critical" injured guys on defense will start for us again?
what if it is 3 or less?

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