MLB 2017 Regular Season

WPBCowboysFan · May 2, 2017

MichaelWinicki said:
The way pitchers are managed throughout the league just puzzles me... I remember when the Mets would trot out a Seaver or Koosman every 4th game... And those guys would toss 200+ innings year in and year out.

Jim Palmer and Gary Thorne were talking about the issues and all the TJ surgeries last night during the broadcast. They even put up a recent quote from John Smoltz on it. Smoltz basically said these young guys are full speed ahead all the time. And its not necessary to throw at top speed all the time.

Palmer said he always thought that kids throwing so many curves early was the cause for the arm problems but he and the Orioles asst trainer were talking about it the night before at the hotel Starbucks and its not the curve ball. Its more to do with young kids throwing hard all the time and all year round.

A lot of the discussion is just speculation because nobody knows for sure. But Im sure there is some merit to a lot of the different theories.

MichaelWinicki · May 2, 2017

WPBCowboysFan said:
Jim Palmer and Gary Thorne were talking about the issues and all the TJ surgeries last night during the broadcast. They even put up a recent quote from John Smoltz on it. Smoltz basically said these young guys are full speed ahead all the time. And its not necessary to throw at top speed all the time.

Palmer said he always thought that kids throwing so many curves early was the cause for the arm problems but he and the Orioles asst trainer were talking about it the night before at the hotel Starbucks and its not the curve ball. Its more to do with young kids throwing hard all the time and all year round.

A lot of the discussion is just speculation because nobody knows for sure. But Im sure there is some merit to a lot of the different theories.

Good post.

Yeah, I know at one time it was believed the curve-ball had a lot to do with it, but I think it comes back to velocity... With seemingly most guys hitting 90 mph (at least) and more pitchers than ever throwing 95mph or more on a consistent basis.

And yeah you would think pitchers could get guys out with slower stuff.

But the game now is all about throwing as hard as you can and swinging the bat as hard as you can.

I'd like to see it go back in time a little.

Tabascocat · May 2, 2017

I think breaking balls at a younger age have a lot to do with it. In my day, we just threw fastballs and worked on a straight change-up. The guys who had that "extra" skill worked on a curve. This applies to the maturing years, not late HS to College level.

My friends sons now always ask me to teach them sliders and other pitches that strain the tendons and ligaments.....these guys are between 12 and 15.

Who really knows the cause today but I would bet money it has more to do with the work-out regimens.

Trouty · May 3, 2017

dexternjack said:
Different pitchers these days. They bulk up too much which puts extra strain on their arms and upper chest. Guys like me, tall and lanky, rarely have arm issues. I have pitched around 600 innings from College to the minors and to this day........I sometimes get a sore rotator cuff if I overdo it in a softball game. That is it, no surgeries from baseball. I am pushing 47 and can still throw 90+ but only good for a few pitches

We have two guys, tall and lanky (Heaney, Skaggs), who have either gone through, or are going through TJ surgery. Richards (soon to be) and Trop (just had the procedure) are also not what I would call bulky, in any sense.

The increase in pitchers going on the DL is due to PEDS/HGH being eliminated/tested incredibly frequently, moreso than player-builds, imo.

Lots of hardball pitchers in the PEDS era were built like brick **** houses, but never went down

Trouty · May 3, 2017

Angels' SP is absolutely decimated. Our BP, too.

Gah! Welp, at least we just beat Seattle in 11. Took 4 and 1/2 hours to go 11.

I love baseball. This talk of speeding up the game is for non-diehards as far as I'm concerned.

Biggems · May 3, 2017

Trouty said:
Angels' SP is absolutely decimated. Our BP, too.

Gah! Welp, at least we just beat Seattle in 11. Took 4 and 1/2 hours to go 11.

I love baseball. This talk of speeding up the game is for non-diehards as far as I'm concerned.

I do like the intentional walk rule they want. No need to waste 4 pitches and arm wear. Just tell the guy to walk to first.

Only other rule I want, make both leagues the same, either dh or not. I say keep the dh for offensive reasons.

FloridaRob · May 3, 2017

From a purists, i hate the DH. I could manage a major league team with a DH. The decisions for pitching are so much different in the NL. It could lose or win a game in some cases.

Tabascocat · May 3, 2017

Trouty said:
We have two guys, tall and lanky (Heaney, Skaggs), who have either gone through, or are going through TJ surgery. Richards (soon to be) and Trop (just had the procedure) are also not what I would call bulky, in any sense.

The increase in pitchers going on the DL is due to PEDS/HGH being eliminated/tested incredibly frequently, moreso than player-builds, imo.

Lots of hardball pitchers in the PEDS era were built like brick **** houses, but never went down

Those guys(current Angels) are also from a different era than we were. They used a lot of breaking balls starting at a young age. You are kind of making my point....the training regimen does include hormones and steroids. When I say bulk up, I don't necessarily mean stack on 40 lbs of muscle but the structural changing of the throwing arm significantly.

I think everything goes hand-in-hand and no way to pinpoint what exactly is going on. Pitchers overthrow, use PEDS of some sort, throw nasty pitches in a developmental age, bulk up arms, etc, etc.

Guys like Clemens and Wells were prototypical brick houses who still may not have had major injuries with or without PEDS. Randy Johnson is that tall and lanky guy.....a rubber-band type arm like me.

Trouty · May 3, 2017

dexternjack said:
Those guys(current Angels) are also from a different era than we were. They used a lot of breaking balls starting at a young age. You are kind of making my point....the training regimen does include hormones and steroids. When I say bulk up, I don't necessarily mean stack on 40 lbs of muscle but the structural changing of the throwing arm significantly.

I think everything goes hand-in-hand and no way to pinpoint what exactly is going on. Pitchers overthrow, use PEDS of some sort, throw nasty pitches in a developmental age, bulk up arms, etc, etc.

Guys like Clemens and Wells were prototypical brick houses who still may not have had major injuries with or without PEDS. Randy Johnson is that tall and lanky guy.....a rubber-band type arm like me.

Good argument, Dex. I'm sure (as much as I can be on a couch

) Randy was using PEDS, tho.

Clemens, Wells, Schilling, even Pedro were using, and many, many more.

It was the funnest time in baseball, tho. There's no doubt about it.

I do agree, arm angle with increased pitching velocity (and no PEDS/HGH) is what's causing all these damned injuries.

Trouty · May 3, 2017

FloridaRob said:
From a purists, i hate the DH. I could manage a major league team with a DH. The decisions for pitching are so much different in the NL. It could lose or win a game in some cases.

i love the DH

And I'm an AL purist

Tabascocat · May 3, 2017

Trouty said:
Good argument, Dex. I'm sure (as much as I can be on a couch ) Randy was using PEDS, tho.

Clemens, Wells, Schilling, even Pedro were using, and many, many more.

It was the funnest time in baseball, tho. There's no doubt about it.

I do agree, arm angle with increased pitching velocity (and no PEDS/HGH) is what's causing all these damned injuries.

I have no doubt that those guys were using PEDS. My argument is even without them(HGH/PEDS), they had a good chance to stay healthy and avoid TJ's because of the era they were forged in. It is a shame that their legacies are tarnished because of the allegations when in reality, they were probably not even needed

The steroid era was exciting for sure but it left a dent in the history of the game. Sosa, McGwire and Bonds were awesome TV chasing that HR record.

Trouty · May 3, 2017

dexternjack said:
I have no doubt that those guys were using PEDS. My argument is even without them(HGH/PEDS), they had a good chance to stay healthy and avoid TJ's because of the era they were forged in. It is a shame that their legacies are tarnished because of the allegations when in reality, they were probably not even needed

The steroid era was exciting for sure but it left a dent in the history of the game. Sosa, McGwire and Bonds were awesome TV chasing that HR record.

That season was so fun. Even Galarraga was in the hunt for 2/3's of the season

Yeah, those players need to be in the HoF (maybe not Sosa with his corked bats).

Bonds not being in is a shame. Clemens, too.

Tabascocat · May 3, 2017

Trouty said:
That season was so fun. Even Galarraga was in the hunt for 2/3's of the season

Yeah, those players need to be in the HoF (maybe not Sosa with his corked bats).

Bonds not being in is a shame. Clemens, too.

Luis Gonzales too! I have known him since College, so don't ask me if he used......I plead the 5th. :laugh:

cowboyfan4life2 · May 3, 2017

Can we start calling Matt Harvey the sad knight, what the heck happened to him, I actually used to get excited for Matt Harvey days, the guy has become a bum.

Tabascocat · May 3, 2017

cowboyfan4life2 said:
Can we start calling Matt Harvey the sad knight, what the heck happened to him, I actually used to get excited for Matt Harvey days, the guy has become a bum.

He only has two pitches right now:
1. outside/inside
2. right down the middle

There is no movement or velocity

WPBCowboysFan · May 3, 2017

Trouty said:
I love baseball. This talk of speeding up the game is for non-diehards as far as I'm concerned.

Yep there is absolutely nothing wrong with the game of baseball. The beauty of it is u get 6 months of games almost every day and all this talk about speeding it up and shortening games is stupid and serves only to try to pacify the retards. And if they have a problem with the game the way it is a few subtle changes here and there wont make any difference. Dont mess up the perfect game to try and appease retards!

WPBCowboysFan · May 3, 2017

FloridaRob said:
From a purists, i hate the DH. I could manage a major league team with a DH. The decisions for pitching are so much different in the NL. It could lose or win a game in some cases.

All this "strategy" talk in the NL with pitchers hitting is a faux argument. Watching pitchers hit is watching bad baseball. It sux. Its not pure. Its just sucky baseball. Having a DH is way better and its not even debatable.

Trouty · May 3, 2017

WPBCowboysFan said:
Yep there is absolutely nothing wrong with the game of baseball. The beauty of it is u get 6 months of games almost every day and all this talk about speeding it up and shortening games is stupid and serves only to try to pacify the retards. And if they have a problem with the game the way it is a few subtle changes here and there wont make any difference. Dont mess up the perfect game to try and appease retards!

Trouty · May 3, 2017

Love Manny's response to the media about Sale going after him, @WPBCowboysFan! What a damn stud!

Hearing Sale might get suspended

WPBCowboysFan · May 3, 2017

Trouty said:
Love Manny's response to the media about Sale going after him, @WPBCowboysFan! What a damn stud!

Hearing Sale might get suspended

Its been crazy

Tonight Gausman hits a batter with a slider and gets tossed. No warning. Adam Jones just got ejected after striking out. Home plate ump is being a lil B * * * * tonight.

Sale throws a 98 mph fastball intentionally at Manny and stays in the game. The 3rd pitcher throwing at Manny. Tonight Gausman is off on his first slider of the night and gets tossed.

MLB 2017 Regular Season

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