News: Could DT Payne compare to Russell Maryland if picked?

speedkilz88 · Feb 22, 2018

stilltheguru88 said:
When the combine says different you’ll still be stubborn

A 40 time turns him into something he's not on the football field?

AmishCowboy · Feb 22, 2018

I love Payne for the Cowboys

stilltheguru88 · Feb 22, 2018

QuincyCarterEra said:
What are you talking about?

From what speedkillz said, its literally impossible for the combine to say any different. There would be no evidence to disprove it.

How can the combine determine if Payne was a space eater, inconsistent, turned it on only for the playoffs, or that there were better prior Bama players?

He implied Jernigan is more of that than Payne. When Payne blows jerinigan out of the water I don’t want to hear excuses. Not to mention the scheme Payne played in didn’t showcase his true talenuts.

QuincyCarterEra · Feb 22, 2018

I'm also seeing an excuse for Payne's lack of production being he plays in a 2 gap scheme.

That's true, it cant be denied. But a few things:

1. Bama has a 2 gap base defense, but had multi fronts that they used based on who they were playing. So Payne would have only been 2 gap in MAYBE 65% of snaps, and thats being conservative.

2. A'shawn Robinson played NT in th exact same scheme his TFL # in his last healthy season was 7.5. Why then did Payne have 1?

I dont even dislike Payne, he was one of the best players in the playoffs. Where was he during the season is my question?

stilltheguru88 · Feb 22, 2018

QuincyCarterEra said:
I'm also seeing an excuse for Payne's lack of production being he plays in a 2 gap scheme.

That's true, it cant be denied. But a few things:

1. Bama has a 2 gap base defense, but had multi fronts that they used based on who they were playing. So Payne would have only been 2 gap in MAYBE 65% of snaps, and thats being conservative.

2. A'shawn Robinson played NT in th exact same scheme his TFL # in his last healthy season was 7.5. Why then did Payne have 1?

I dont even dislike Payne, he was one of the best players in the playoffs. Where was he during the season is my question?

Ashawn played on a better front. Payne was the best player on the dline

JeffInDC · Feb 22, 2018

kiheikiwi said:
Im trying to find someone to placate Marrinelli and his definition of what he wants in a 1-tech. This is why I Have trouble mocking Vita Vea to the Cowboys, but want to put Payne there.
In the end, his definition has not worked - at all, we havent stuffed the run, and the inside guys havent got much of a push. So, Rod - you will get DaRon Payne and you will like it !
Now get out there with the talent we just got you, and make it work !

Tim Settle

QuincyCarterEra · Feb 22, 2018

stilltheguru88 said:
Ashawn played on a better front. Payne was the best player on the dline

If that were true, thats the difference between 1 TFL & 7.5?

If this is true there's no way you draft Payne in the 1st. He couldn't produce by himself. He needs a lot of talent around him. Even though he already had a **** ton as he played for Bama.

Payne had an incredible DB group behind him, didnt have nearly as much competition than Ashawn for TFL/sacks/tackles/etc, and just didnt produce despite those advantages.

kiheikiwi · Feb 22, 2018

QuincyCarterEra said:
If that were true, thats the difference between 1 TFL & 7.5?

If this is true there's no way you draft Payne in the 1st. He couldn't produce by himself. He needs a lot of talent around him. Even though he already had a **** ton as he played for Bama.

Payne had an incredible DB group behind him, didnt have nearly as much competition than Ashawn for TFL/sacks/tackles/etc, and just didnt produce despite those advantages.

Ok, I get it, you dont like Payne. Your perogative. I do, and would jump at the chance to take him - at #19 !
Think he will be a better pro than college player and untill some other team drafts him, he is the player I covet.

QuincyCarterEra · Feb 22, 2018

kiheikiwi said:
Ok, I get it, you dont like Payne. Your perogative. I do, and would jump at the chance to take him - at #19 !
Think he will be a better pro than college player and untill some other team drafts him, he is the player I covet.

I don't dislike Payne. I'm just discussing the player.
Same way I did with Edmunds in another thread. Im not the biggest fan of Edmunds, but still like to discuss him from a football stand point.

I don't like him at pick 19, sure. But I like the player overall just fine.

Do you believe he'll be better in the pros due to his traits? If so what combine drills will you look at to reinforce your belief in those traits?

speedkilz88 · Feb 22, 2018

kiheikiwi said:
Ok, I get it, you dont like Payne. Your perogative. I do, and would jump at the chance to take him - at #19 !
Think he will be a better pro than college player and untill some other team drafts him, he is the player I covet.

The problem is people wanting to make him something he is not.

dfense · Feb 22, 2018

Hard to believe the Cowboys have not drafted a DT in the 1st round since Maryland. 27 years ago

QuincyCarterEra · Feb 22, 2018

dfense said:
Hard to believe the Cowboys have not drafted a DT in the 1st round since Maryland. 27 years ago

First two rounds.

DanA · Feb 22, 2018

QuincyCarterEra said:
I'm also seeing an excuse for Payne's lack of production being he plays in a 2 gap scheme.

That's true, it cant be denied. But a few things:

1. Bama has a 2 gap base defense, but had multi fronts that they used based on who they were playing. So Payne would have only been 2 gap in MAYBE 65% of snaps, and thats being conservative.

2. A'shawn Robinson played NT in th exact same scheme his TFL # in his last healthy season was 7.5. Why then did Payne have 1?

I dont even dislike Payne, he was one of the best players in the playoffs. Where was he during the season is my question?

Didn’t A’shawn come out the same year as Reed, think Reed was the nose but I agree with your points. Production hasn’t been there.

QuincyCarterEra · Feb 22, 2018

DanA said:
Didn’t A’shawn come out the same year as Reed, think Reed was the nose but I agree with your points. Production hasn’t been there.

Yes sir!
I remember it being the other way around, but it has been a few years so you might be right. Both were the same exact weight, 307 pounds, at the combine so they might have flipped between NT and DE with each other.

kiheikiwi · Feb 22, 2018

QuincyCarterEra said:
I don't dislike Payne. I'm just discussing the player.
Same way I did with Edmunds in another thread. Im not the biggest fan of Edmunds, but still like to discuss him from a football stand point.

I don't like him at pick 19, sure. But I like the player overall just fine.

Do you believe he'll be better in the pros due to his traits? If so what combine drills will you look at to reinforce your belief in those traits?

Love that we all can discuss without it getting ugly - different/opposing views are good for us all.
Everything Ive read about Payne says he was a good student and player. No off the field problems etc. Good at training etc. We can all see when he wants it, hes unstoppable (see college playoffs).
So, what was the reason for his up and down production ? Motivation, lack of interest, school - what.
The distraction of school will be gone and now his football is his livelyhood.
While I have hated Marrinelli's mantra of 1-techs, I believe he would be a perfect hardass coach for Payne.
This is where the interviews etc. At the combine will be very helpful in determing if he is "the guy". I hope so.

Terrancemcclain · Feb 22, 2018

speedkilz88 said:
This is not true, they were #1 against the run in 2016 and #8 against the run in 2017. In 2017 they had issues with injuries at the 1T but were fine with Collins at the 1T. What hurt was injuries to Sean Lee, Hitchens and how long it took Jaylon to get healthier and knock the rust off. At the end of the season when Sean Lee had returned they were holding the run to the 80s in yds which was right in line with the eagles who were #1 in 2017 against the run.

I think its deceptive to merely bring up ranki ngs as a way to measure the cowboys run defense. If you were going by yards per carry then the cowboys run defense has never ranked in the top ten with rod as DC.in 2016 the cowboys defense faced the fewest rushing attempts of any team . also the cowboys let McClain and Thornton go after the 2016 season. While the cowboys only gave up a hundred yards rushing only once in 2016, they gave up over 100 yards rushing in eight games in the 2017 season and Sean Lee played in four of those games. the cowboys gave up over 150 yards rushing in four out of those eight games.so despite the assertion of some fans , the cowboys run defense is not fine and
The cowboys are not fine at DT.I dont know why some people continue to believe that the cowboys choice to neglect the one tech position is some sort of brilliant wisdom.hey jerry stop trying being cute and draft a *******one tech. If rod doesnt like it , show him the door.

*******tired of it :banghead:

stilltheguru88 · Feb 23, 2018

Terrancemcclain said:
I think its deceptive to merely bring up ranki ngs as a way to measure the cowboys run defense. If you were going by yards per carry then the cowboys run defense has never ranked in the top ten with rod as DC.in 2016 the cowboys defense faced the fewest rushing attempts of any team . also the cowboys let McClain and Thornton go after the 2016 season. While the cowboys only gave up a hundred yards rushing only once in 2016, they gave up over 100 yards rushing in eight games in the 2017 season and Sean Lee played in four of those games. the cowboys gave up over 150 yards rushing in four out of those eight games.so despite the assertion of some fans , the cowboys run defense is not fine and
The cowboys are not fine at DT.I dont know why some people continue to believe that the cowboys choice to neglect the one tech position is some sort of brilliant wisdom.hey jerry stop trying being cute and draft a *******one tech. If rod doesnt like it , show him the door.

*******tired of it

Great post

KDM256 · Feb 23, 2018

Hard for Payne to put up absurd amount of stats when he's had to share playing time with future draft picks ahead of him in Jon Allen and Dalvin Tomlinson.

Another misconception I've seen ahead lately on here is that people seems to think Payne is strictly a 1tech which is not the case, as Pruitt/Smart has had Payne play some 3T and if memory serves me correctly DE as well in some packages. Point I am trying to make is Payne can play all 3 downs, which should play a major role in how quick he's selected in the draft.

Kid might not have the stats but nobody can't deny the potential/upside he has. Kid is strong as an Ox and would be hard to double team if paired with David Irving.

Unfortunately 9-7 will not let us acquire the likes of a Payne, as I believe he'll be off the board at 19.

News: Could DT Payne compare to Russell Maryland if picked?

speedkilz88

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AmishCowboy

if you ain't first, you're last

stilltheguru88

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kiheikiwi

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DanA

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kiheikiwi

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