Stephen Jones: "we’re going to pay Zeke a significant contract at some point"

OmerV

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Fournette is another example of why you dont pay RB's.

As for Saquan Barkley. Great player. Generational talent. Had an outstanding season. Arguably better than Zeke.

Result? 5-11.

You can do that with a 5th round pick.

Fournette is obviously not in Zeke's situation. Zeke has proved his value, and Fournette has not.

As for Barkley, your comment about the 5-11 record is not a fair one. The Giants were 3-13 in 2017, so they had a hell of a lot of problems that no one player, no matter how great, could have fixed them all.
 

beware_d-ware

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Fournette is obviously not in Zeke's situation. Zeke has proved his value, and Fournette has not.

As for Barkley, your comment about the 5-11 record is not a fair one. The Giants were 3-13 in 2017, so they had a hell of a lot of problems that no one player, no matter how great, could have fixed them all.

Pinning wins and losses on one player is the laziest move in football.
 

baltcowboy

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Quick question.

Name the 5 best TBs in the NFL right now. Or maybe even the 10 best.
I only worry about the Cowboys and Zeke is what all of the defenses try to stop. I love Dak but I know are opponents want to contain Zeke. He is our most valuable player.
 

aria

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I GURANTEE cowboys don’t go less than 12-4 this year.

They are at the very least making the divisional round.
That doesn’t mean Dak, Cooper and Zeke are the best trio as you said. Playing the AFCE and having the lowly Giants and Skins in our division have a little/LOT to do with us getting there.
 

Sydla

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I only worry about the Cowboys and Zeke is what all of the defenses try to stop. I love Dak but I know are opponents want to contain Zeke. He is our most valuable player.

You said he was the best RB in the league. Who are the 5 best TBs in football to you?
 
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Fournette is obviously not in Zeke's situation. Zeke has proved his value, and Fournette has not.

As for Barkley, your comment about the 5-11 record is not a fair one. The Giants were 3-13 in 2017, so they had a hell of a lot of problems that no one player, no matter how great, could have fixed them all.
Sure it's fair.

What the record tells you is that resources need to be spent at QB, o-line, defense. To compete, that's where the Giants focus needs to be. That's where they cure their ills. Not RB.
 

beware_d-ware

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And as far as Zeke vs Murray - I think the biggest difference there is injuries. Murray's injury history was extensive, Zeke is basically sitting at zero. If I am going to invest long term in a player, that makes a huge difference.
 

OmerV

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But the player shouldn't skew the data. If the data showed the Cowboys front office that paying a TB big money into his late 20s might result in a significant lack of return on resources, they shouldn't let emotion skew their analysis.

I'm not saying he skews the data, but the data is based on averages, not on every single player having exactly the same career span or number of years of effectiveness. So the decision becomes whether a team is welling to bet on a player being one of the ones that brings up the averages or if they think he is one that is at the average or below. Obviously the better and more consistent a player is, the more risk a team might be willing to take. And they might look at other variables such as injury history, cap space, what they see and perceive about how the player's body is holding up in practice and games, and I'm sure other things I'm not thinking of. It's not all just one thing.
 

Sydla

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I'm not saying he skews the data, but the data is based on averages, not on every single player having exactly the same career span or number of years of effectiveness. So the decision becomes whether a team is welling to bet on a player being one of the ones that brings up the averages or if they think he is one that is at the average or below. Obviously the better and more consistent a player is, the more risk a team might be willing to take. And they might look at other variables such as injury history, cap space, what they see and perceive about how the player's body is holding up in practice and games, and I'm sure other things I'm not thinking of. It's not all just one thing.

But you are banking on your guy being the guy who bucks the trends. How is that a smart decision? Further, one of the reasons for the decline in many TBs? Usage. And right now Zeke has had more touches than any NFL RB in the last three years and it isn't even close.
 

OmerV

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Sure it's fair.

What the record tells you is that resources need to be spent at QB, o-line, defense. To compete, that's where the Giants focus needs to be. That's where they cure their ills. Not RB.

That makes no sense at all because there is no evidence that had they drafted an O-Lineman or a defensive player or even a QB instead of Barkley that the record wouldn't still have been 5-11 Or for all we know it could have been worse.
 

Hawkeye0202

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We are a run-first team. It's the way we are built, so elite RB is critical to our offense, especially with a young developing QB. Why wouldn't you wanna resign Zeke?
 

OmerV

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But you are banking on your guy being the guy who bucks the trends. How is that a smart decision? Further, one of the reasons for the decline in many TBs? Usage. And right now Zeke has had more touches than any NFL RB in the last three years and it isn't even close.

Again, it's averages, and the average age at which a player declines is based on some players being above the average and some being below it. And yes, that's what I'm saying - that a team looks at all variables and decides if they are willing to take the chance on certain players continuing to play at a high level beyond that average age. No team is relying solely on age and averages without looking at all variables. If they were, no team would ever sign a 25-26 year old RB to an extended contract. Yet it happens. Obviously there is risk with it, but all risk can't be eliminated, and every team has to decide what risks to take and when to take them and who to take them on.
 

mattjames2010

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That makes no sense at all because there is no evidence that had they drafted an O-Lineman or a defensive player or even a QB instead of Barkley that the record wouldn't still have been 5-11 Or for all we know it could have been worse.

Their last playoff run was the season their defense was playing at a high level - who was their RB then? The year they lost their stud Tiki Barber, they won a Super Bowl.

The point being here is, despite Barkley having arguably the best production of any back in the league in 2018, they were a 5-11 team. Again, the amount an RB actually impacts a game week to week is minimal - giving them 15+ million yearly is not a great way to go about building a team especially when the modern NFL trends show elite RBs simply don't win Super Bowls.

I remember the wonderlic discussion, you tend to ignore trends. So, hopefully you've learned since.
 

mattjames2010

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HE WILL GET BIG MONEY he made 14 as FT thats 14 real million he will get his money this year, just because Conner made an adequate replacement it was not on purpose and he wasn't BELL, not in the same league BRAH..Bell handled it wrong and I hope zeke dosnt cause the drama but dont get it twisted bell will get the money he hoped for just not from PIT..Conners goo Bell is Elite..besides pitt plays these games with all their players and is losing a ton of them..the team will pay for this soon..btw connner ddnt finish the season and Pitt missed the playoffs..

Except....he was Bell. And he would have topped Bell in even more categories if he was forcefed the ball more. Steelers didn't miss the playoffs due to Bell, they missed it because their locker room is more of a circus now and they still lose to bad teams. Bell is expendable now because of what Connor did.
 

Willfreedom909

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That doesn’t mean Dak, Cooper and Zeke are the best trio as you said. Playing the AFCE and having the lowly Giants and Skins in our division have a little/LOT to do with us getting there.
AFC?
 

Sydla

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Again, it's averages, and the average age at which a player declines is based on some players being above the average and some being below it. And yes, that's what I'm saying - that a team looks at all variables and decides if they are willing to take the chance on certain players continuing to play at a high level beyond that average age. No team is relying solely on age and averages without looking at all variables. If they were, no team would ever sign a 25-26 year old RB to an extended contract. Yet it happens. Obviously there is risk with it, but all risk can't be eliminated, and every team has to decide what risks to take and when to take them and who to take them on.

Note, most teams don't sign 25-26 year TBs to big contracts. That's kind of the point of all of this. Most teams look for short term guys, etc.

And the recent run of SB teams has shown that largely, teams don't need to spend big bucks and long terms contracts on TBs to win.

The fact that 2 guys on their rookie contracts are in the Top 10 of highest paid TBs indicates that teams simply don't throw cash around at TBs.
 
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