Taco in an alternate universe

buybuydandavis said:

Where Jimmy and Jerry don't blow the best thing ever.
Where Terry Glenn doesn't blow out his knee in training camp.

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ItzKelz said:

We do not run a 3-4 defense.

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Hardline said:

T. J. Watt was the better player
You take the best player and worry about scheme fit later.

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ItzKelz said:

This makes no sense what so ever. The reason we have Quinn now is because he didn't fit Miami's scheme.....he was the best pass rusher in the NFL per snap.

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Hardline said:

It actually makes a lot of sense. Talented players can adapt to any scheme.
T. J. Watt plays with his hand in the dirt as well. He would be playing at the same level here in our scheme . His talent goes with him.

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ItzKelz said:

DeMarcus Ware played with his hand down in college.....he was an Outside LB in a 3-4 scheme in the NFL. Makes no sense at all when TJ by all scouts and teams was viewed as a OLB.

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JoeKing said:

I think we sub in Quinn for Taco moving forward and give him an extension next offseason.

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Hardline said:

You just agreed with me that talented players can adjust to different schemes.

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JoeKing said:

What if Taco Charlton played up to the value of the 1st round draft pick that was used to acquire him? Would that have affected D Law's new deal? Would the Cowboys be SB champs right now? The FO has invested so much in this guy and has seen very little return on that investment. If we value 1st round draft picks then we need to recognize the difference Taco could have made to this team. Your thoughts?

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America's Cowboy said:

Oh really?

Let's see...

In their first 2 years as NFL players: QB sacks

1) Lawrence Taylor: 0 sacks (1981) & 7.5 sacks (1982). Total: 7.5 sacks
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TaylLa00.htm

2) Charles Haley: 12 sacks (1986) & 6.5 sacks (1987). Total: 18.5 sacks
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HaleCh00.htm

3) Demarcus Ware: 8 sacks (2005) & 11.5 sacks (2006). Total: 19.5 sacks
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WareDe99.htm

** TJ Watt: 7 sacks (2017) & 13 sacks (2018). Total: 20 sacks
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WattT.00.htm

As you can see, for their first 2 career years totals in sacks comparisons, TJ Watt is definitely in the same mold of a sack artist as the greats in Lawrence Taylor, Charles Haley and Demarcus Ware. TJ actually has a higher sack total than all 3 for their first 2 career years. The key for TJ Watt will be if he can keep it up and stay healthy. Time will tell.

On the other hand, it is soft Taco who definitely is not the same caliber of a player as those above. Not even close.

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rocyaice said:

I don’t care what they did the first two years. Those are hall of gamers. No matter what stat you pull out I’m not comparing him to any hall of famers. He’s not there yet.

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Hardline said:

It actually makes a lot of sense. Talented players can adapt to any scheme.
T. J. Watt plays with his hand in the dirt as well. He would be playing at the same level here in our scheme . His talent goes with him.

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America's Cowboy said:

You're not being fair if you truly want to compare. You have to go by what currently is available, not what you prefer it to be or not be. Sorry but currently, TJ is much more comparable during his first 2 years in the league, with them sack artists greats than soft Taco. That's just a fact. What hurts is that the front office dropped the ball again and made the wrong choice.

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America's Cowboy said:

Some people are slow to accept this fact. It's easier to limit a player's abilities, even though there is film to prove a player can play in more than one scheme and with a hand in the ground or standing up.

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JoeKing said:

I wasn't suggesting we only give Quin Taco's Money. I expect he get's an extension next season.

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blueblood70 said:

nearly a 2nd rounder so the dramatic use of first round bust doesnt apply.. sure Marinelli made a small mistake maybe passing on TJ who knows if that would have worked but he was a very late first rounder , better that then say trading up and taking player at 6 overall and he doesnt work out.. much different when you hear First Rounder..

he has time to get it turned around and I feel its more mental immaturity thats got him in the dog house..He has BMOC complex coming from Michigan and taken in first round, he expected to jump in and get to start..he has shown disinterest in practice and thats what has got him in his present coaches doghouse limiting his minutes and hes not really been allowed to show out in games given when and where hes put in....if he comes into camp with new attitude and works hard im sure in the absence of RG he will get chance to show a little more..

some of his tweets are true coaches have gave him little chance to play in postion at times in games long enough to make things happen and its his own fault..

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xwalker said:

The point is that having Taco on the roster has basically zero impact on keeping Quinn.

The only reason to cut Taco would be if they have 9 or 10 DL that are all better options for a roster spot.

Taco started 7 games in 2018. It's not as if he had zero impact on the team.

He played more on on run downs and Gregory played more on pass downs.

In 2019 Taco likely continues to play more on run downs with Quinn replacing Gregory as the RDE that plays more on pass downs.

Taco got frustrated that he was doing the dirty work and Gregory was getting the "glory" opportunities as a pass rusher. When Taco vented his frustrations, they benched him for "bad attitude".

Ideally Taco should play the Strong Side DE (Left DE) position but DLaw plays LDE and plays a high percentage of the snaps.

The LDE position in Marinelli's defense best suits a power type pass rusher. Both DLaw and Taco are in the power pass rusher category.

Marinelli's RDE best fit speed pass rushers like Quinn and Randy Gregory.

They actually align differently on the left vs right. The LDE is generally aligned tighter and the RDE is aligned wider. A wide alignment is good for a speed rusher while a tight alignment is good for a power rusher.

The strong/weak side is also different because of the DT alignment. The 3-tech most often aligns on the right side and on the OG's outside shoulder. The 1-tech aligns on the OG's inside shoulder. The LBs align based on the DT aligmment with the Weak Side LB always on the same side as the 3-tech.

These are all based on Marinelli's primary DL formation which is the 4-3 under. They sometimes use other formations but they primarily use the 4-3 under.

Taco has similar if not better physical traits as compared to DLaw. Taco's success is dependent on the mental aspect of his game. He has to refine his pass rushing techniques and he has to learn to study opposing OTs to find the best way to rush against specific OTs. As a RDE he is going against LTs which are always the opponents best OT.

Also knowing when to rush vs play the run is a key issue.

Depending on the defensive play call, the RDE might or might not have edge contain responsibility against the run (including QB runs). If the DE does not have edge contain, then he can pass rush off the snap without worrying about run contain because a LB or Safety will have edge contain responsibility.

Unfortunately for Taco, he generally had edge contain; whereas Gregory often didn't.

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