PFF - Zeke is not a top 25 player under 25 years of age

75boyz · May 17, 2019

Proof said:
I’m just trying to figure out how he’s a product of the line, but ranks first in yards after contact.

(Drum) Ba dumm...tsss

big dog cowboy · May 17, 2019

percyhoward said:
PFF is the last source I would turn to if I was looking for a subjective opinion about football or anything else.

windward · May 17, 2019

Chuck 54 said:
Similar disrespect Emmitt always, and still does, receive....”it’s the OL and Dallas’ commitment to the run game.” Even moreso than Emmitt, Zeke’s power and speed would be highly productive in any offense, even those with lower rated OL’s.

Emmitt made that OL famous.

Larry Allen is the only player better than him on that OL.

HungryLion · May 17, 2019

windward said:
Emmitt made that OL famous.

Larry Allen is the only player better than him on that OL.

I remember Jimmy Johnson saying something to the affect of. “People want to say it was all the offensive line, but nobody knew who the offensive line was until Emmitt started running behind them”

Now that’s not to say they weren’t good players. They were. But Emmitt was a complete and total
Stud.

wick · May 18, 2019

percyhoward said:
They say laws are like sausages -- better not to see the way they're made. That's what PFF's player grading system reminds me of. Even though their multi-colored heatmaps give the illusion that there's some kind of science behind them, the real objective is to create product, which means they have to keep the grading system as simple as possible so that all the graders can pump out results for all the games fast.

Steve Palazzolo actually told me this in a tweet: "Two identical passes -- one going for 12 yards (tackled immediately) and one going for 40 (12 air yards and 28 yards after catch) -- the difference in total yards has nothing to do with the QB." In other words, it's based completely on the math, and doesn't factor in the QB's decision-making process at all. That means it actually rewards the QB who makes the wrong decision, because that extends the drive and gives him the opportunity for more (perfect) short passes.

According to Palazzolo’s explanation, there’s no difference between a throw that a receiver has to dive for (negating yards after contact) and one that hits him in stride, allowing him to score.

ultron · May 18, 2019

It's like saying Kobe Bryant or Michael Jordan aren't good basketball players because they took a lot of shots. This guy would've won 3 rushing titles in the 3 years he's played in the NFL if Goodell didn't F him over. He's the most under appreciated football player in the NFL when it comes to the media & I hope that doesn't somehow influence him to end up leaving Dallas when his rookie deal is up.

QuincyCarterEra · May 18, 2019

ultron said:
It's like saying Kobe Bryant or Michael Jordan aren't good basketball players because they took a lot of shots. This guy would've won 3 rushing titles in the 3 years he's played in the NFL if Goodell didn't F him over. He's the most under appreciated football player in the NFL when it comes to the media & I hope that doesn't somehow influence him to end up leaving Dallas when his rookie deal is up.

That's not what they're claiming though.

They aren't dinging him for running a lot, theu're dinging him for being inefficient with those rushes.
Just like Kobe wasnt efficient, and shouldn't be mentioned in the same sentence as MJ.

Zeke best attribute is his ability to shoulder the load like he does. It doesnt help improve the offense, but it's still impressive nevertheless.

aria · May 18, 2019

ultron said:
It's like saying Kobe Bryant or Michael Jordan aren't good basketball players because they took a lot of shots. This guy would've won 3 rushing titles in the 3 years he's played in the NFL if Goodell didn't F him over. He's the most under appreciated football player in the NFL when it comes to the media & I hope that doesn't somehow influence him to end up leaving Dallas when his rookie deal is up.

I’m not sure anyone ever said he wasn’t good but that he isn’t necessarily the best just because he’s won a couple rushing titles while also carrying the ball more times than any other back and having arguably the best O line in the league in 2016 and a top 5-10 O line in 2017 and 2018.

I personally would put him top 3 but not number 1. Most under appreciated? Hardly.

percyhoward · May 18, 2019

wick said:
According to Palazzolo’s explanation, there’s no difference between a throw that a receiver has to dive for (negating yards after contact) and one that hits him in stride, allowing him to score.

I don't think PFF would give the QB as much credit for an off-target throw. What he was saying was that -- the two throws being equidistant and equally accurate -- the play that gained 40 yards would be worth no more than the play that gained 12.

The thinking behind this is that they were identical throws and should be rewarded with identical scores. The problem with that thinking isn't that PFF treats both QB's passes equally, it's that they treat both QB's decisions equally. (Maybe the QB who hit the WR perfectly as he was falling out of bounds 12 yards downfield missed an open man on the other side of the field who was also 12 yards downfield and who might have gained 28 yards after the catch and scored.) What compounds this issue is that if the QB who completed the 12-yarder does it twice more on the drive, he'll end up with three times as many points as the QB who threw the pass on the 40-yard catch and run -- even if that 40-yarder was a TD.

Alexander · May 19, 2019

You people are a bunch of ingrates. They put Vander Esch on there. Jeez.

JohnsKey19 · May 19, 2019

windward said:
Emmitt made that OL famous.

Larry Allen is the only player better than him on that OL.

True. Although a case can be made for E-Will pre-accident.

Jake · May 19, 2019

Toruk_Makto said:
Serious question for you to consider. How often does Zeke get more than what is blocked.

Hint: Not often.

The NFL's leader in rushing yards, Zeke was a beast in the yards after contact categories. He was tied for fifth in rushing yards after contact (595) and tied for 10th in receiving yards after contact (123), and 58.5 percent of his rushing yards came after contact. Elliott also ranked tied for 11th in broken tackles (22) among backs.

http://www.nfl.com/fantasyfootball/...saquon-barkley-headlines-2018s-top-rbs-in-yac

Toruk_Makto · May 19, 2019

Jake said:
The NFL's leader in rushing yards, Zeke was a beast in the yards after contact categories. He was tied for fifth in rushing yards after contact (595) and tied for 10th in receiving yards after contact (123), and 58.5 percent of his rushing yards came after contact. Elliott also ranked tied for 11th in broken tackles (22) among backs.

http://www.nfl.com/fantasyfootball/...saquon-barkley-headlines-2018s-top-rbs-in-yac

Those numbers are in aggregate. Meaning not per rush. Meaning not an efficiency metric. Which also means a function, given we know Zeke places low on forcing missed tackles, on clean running lanes that means he's going full speed when first contacted. That's on the line not Zeke.

atlantacowboy · May 19, 2019

Risen Star said:
More proof that PFF and all the poindexters who try to covert football into a mathematical formula are complete trash.

-

Ezekiel Elliott is not one of the NFL’s top players under 25-years old, allow that sink in for a moment. The reigning rushing champion isn’t good enough to be on a list that includes top players in the league under 25-years old.

Now realize this isn’t a fact, just an opinion of Pro Football Focus who put out their annual top 25 players under 25 years of age at the start of the upcoming season. Elliott did not make the list, but he did manage to make the “just missed” portion.

Mark Chichester and PFF cited their reasoning:

“There’s no doubt that Ezekiel Elliott is one of the top players at his position, but it’s hard to overlook the fact that his production is, in large part, thanks to the offense that Dallas has built around him. Over the last three years, Elliott ranks first in rushing attempts (868), rushing yards (4048), rushing yards after contact (2567) and first down conversions (219). However, his three-year rushing grade of 80.2 ranks ninth among the 36 backs with at least 300 attempts in that span, while his 0.119 missed tackles forced per attempt ranks tied for 27th among the same group.”

Elliott gets dinged for having the offense flow through him, a preposterous line of thinking. Downgrading a player that is so good that the team builds around him is silly. Punishing him for still leading the league when the opposition clearly focuses their defensive game plan around stopping him is absurd.

https://cowboyswire.usatoday.com/20...llas-cowboys-top-25-under-25-2019-nfl-season/

He got dinged b/c of his average grade per game which is 80.2. Thats good but there are 8 rbs who grade out higher. PFF is not just looking at rushing yards and TDs. They are looking at what he does on every play and grading him accordingly. Fact is that his 2017 campaign is really killing his 3 year average which is what they are using to rank.

I like Zeke but I don't think he's focused on football year round, and I hope to god we don't pay him Leveon Bell money. 20 carries for 47 yards in a playoff game doesn't win a lot of love.

QuincyCarterEra · May 22, 2019

Jake said:
The NFL's leader in rushing yards, Zeke was a beast in the yards after contact categories. He was tied for fifth in rushing yards after contact (595) and tied for 10th in receiving yards after contact (123), and 58.5 percent of his rushing yards came after contact. Elliott also ranked tied for 11th in broken tackles (22) among backs.

http://www.nfl.com/fantasyfootball/...saquon-barkley-headlines-2018s-top-rbs-in-yac

Having the most Carries in the league by more than 15%, and not only not being #1 in yards after contact but being all the way down at 5th and 11th in broken tackles is...... not good.

NotForLong · May 22, 2019

Risen Star said:
Over the last three years, Elliott ranks first in rushing attempts (868), rushing yards (4048), rushing yards after contact (2567) and first down conversions (219).

https://cowboyswire.usatoday.com/20...llas-cowboys-top-25-under-25-2019-nfl-season/

Its a Shame Ezekiel had to waste his Carear playing with Useless Dak . . . 9 -10 men fronts. What a joke of a QB. . . Riding Zekes coat tails . . . Did you know there are some who give all the credit for the Cowboys Record the last 3 years to Dak. . . SMH . . .

PFF - Zeke is not a top 25 player under 25 years of age

75boyz

Well-Known Member

big dog cowboy

THE BIG DOG

windward

NFL Historian

HungryLion

Well-Known Member

wick

Well-Known Member

ultron

Well-Known Member

QuincyCarterEra

Well-Known Member

aria

Well-Known Member

percyhoward

Research Tool

Alexander

What's it going to be then, eh?

JohnsKey19

Well-Known Member

Jake

Beyond tired of Jerry

Toruk_Makto

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atlantacowboy

Well-Known Member

QuincyCarterEra

Well-Known Member

NotForLong

Well-Known Member