Why does an athlete need $30m instead of $20m?

Jake

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Again, it's not the same. There is no salary cap for owners; how much or little Jerry earns has no effect on the Cowboys winning games. Whereas there is a salary cap for players. More money for one player (i.e., Zeke) means less money for others, means less talent that can be signed, equals less chance of an SB.

The owners pushed for a salary cap, not the players. If an owner then turns around and chooses to pay a guy $30 million that's also on the owners, not the players. No player is in a position to force any owner to pay a certain salary.

I get the frustration with trying to build a winner under a cap, but blaming the players for it is misplaced. It's on the owners.
 

TheDude

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This is different, though - diminishing returns. For someone who earns only $20,000 a year, getting their salary bumped up to $30,000 a year is a hugely meaningful raise. But at a certain point, filthy rich is just filthy rich; $20m/year vs. $30m/year.

By analogy, if you win a $200 million Powerball jackpot, you probably wouldn't be any less delighted than if you won a $300 million Powerball jackpot - either way, you're rich beyond your all-but-wildest dreams.

Just a strange mindset. Maybe dak wants to buy a team at some point and playing with Dallas negates him developing the next app and making $1bn. Who really cares? This is trying to be a subjective call on someone's morals. Need is irrelevant, someone has the money to pay, so what is the point?
 

NumOneQB

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Because owners are making 10X that off players backs. Why would a player not deserve more than less?
 

Cowboys1fan

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No human can ever have enough money. If you were in that position you’d want what the market dictates.

In your job now would you take way less just bc the money is more than you think you need? I want it all
 

kskboys

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Because owners are making 10X that off players backs. Why would a player not deserve more than less?
That's an argument to raise the salary cap, not for the salary of individual players.
 

ABQCOWBOY

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Sure there are other teams that would pay. There are a few teams who haven't had a legit franchise QB in years.

You say that but who? I mean, we've looked at several teams and none of them have the cap to do something this season. Now, if you wait for next season, sure, maybe but that's the problem right? If you wait, you lose a whole lot of money.
 

ABQCOWBOY

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That's hogwash. You have been trying to argue that looking at Wetnz's contract as $32MM/year is invalid because, as you claim, he isn't actually getting $32MM per year. You are using bonus structure to fabricate a false argument.

The reality is he is getting what he was always going to get for the remaining 2 years on his contract, and getting $128MM more for the additional 4 years, for an average of $32MM per year. That's the "math" you keep asking me to look at, and the fact that the bonus is structured where some of that $128MM is paid before the additional 4 years kicks in doesn't change that.

And what's more ridiculous is your argument that it would somehow work differently if Dak were to sign a 4 year, $128MM extension. The reality is that if Dak were to sign for 4 additional years at $128MM, the bonus structure wouldn't result in him getting exactly $32 million this year and every year that he is under contract any more than it means that for Wentz, but the dollars and additional years would still be the same. They would both be getting 4 additional years for $128MM.

Yep, I'm wrong, even though that's exactly what the Eagles Fans say themselves. I'm wrong but just one question for you, what's the average over 6 years? Go ahead and answer that question. How long is Wentz under contract for? Answer that question. At the end of the day, you really can't get around that but whatever. As I said, you want that deal for Dak, I am great with it. I don't care how you pay it, all up front, all backloaded, whatever. The bottom line will be 130 mil for 5 years which will average out to 26 mil a year. If that's what you want for Dak, lets do that today.
 

ABQCOWBOY

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QUOTE="ABQCOWBOY, post: 9250310, member: 318"]Owners take all the risk. Players do not. I am not trying to make the point that players don't have skin in the game because they do but owners really do bare the overwhelming burden of risk and because of this, they make more money.
I take it you can read your own post?[/QUOTE]

What's your point? I posted that but I didn't bring up the topic.
 

ABQCOWBOY

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There is no 'we.' You are acting like you do not understand LTBE yearly salaries/bonuses or guaranteed monies role in defining a player's market for potential salary. You were waving your hands at the nonguaranteed portions and now have decided to move the goalpost to "market factors."

That last bit is cute considering I anticipated that when I brought up the scarcity of supply. This notion that there would not be a line of teams looking to sign a FA pro bowl QB is laughable if not surprising.

Anywho, this is boring. I see now that this is once again you arguing towards a conclusion -in this case Dak not deserving $30m in AAV- and will just spew whatever you think might lead you towards said conclusion. That is the opposite of scientific and quite frankly piss poor epistemology. It is just what you do and I am now wasting my time anymore.

Last word is all you.

Don't start. You know that the deal is essentially an extension. What is the average of 6 years, which is what you really want to be concerned about because it's the cap that is important here. Argue if you wish but Philly is paying Wentz this:

Guaranteed at signing: $66.4 million (5th)

Practial Guaranteed: $107.9 million (1st)

Average: $32 million (currently 4th)

Contract value (four-year extension): $128 million (6th)

Contract value (over next six years): $158 million (1st)

Wentz has 2 years left, he just added 4 more. That's 6 years at 158 mil. That averages out to 26.3333 mil. Any way you slice it, any way you argue, any way you rationalize, it's still 26 and you can't change that. Last word, remember.
 

OmerV

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Yep, I'm wrong, even though that's exactly what the Eagles Fans say themselves. I'm wrong but just one question for you, what's the average over 6 years? Go ahead and answer that question. How long is Wentz under contract for? Answer that question. At the end of the day, you really can't get around that but whatever. As I said, you want that deal for Dak, I am great with it. I don't care how you pay it, all up front, all backloaded, whatever. The bottom line will be 130 mil for 5 years which will average out to 26 mil a year. If that's what you want for Dak, lets do that today.
Lol, so instead of the constant effort to play silly games with numbers, just answer this ... is Wentz being paid an additional $32MM/year above his existing contract for an additional 4 years of commitment above his existing, contract, and how would that differ from Dak getting paid an additional $32MM/year for an additional 4 years? Dak also has an existing contract you know.
 
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BigD_95

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The difference is that NFL owners don't have an "owner salary cap." Whereas NFL players have to have their salaries all fit under a cap. If one player gets an extra $10 million a year, then that's less money available to pay the other 52 players on the roster, which equals less ability to keep talent on the roster, and less chance of a championship. It's a zero-sum thing. More here means less there.


It's why NFL players should sit out until they do away with the salary cap. The salary cap has ruined the NFL. So tired of drafting players - getting them to a high level and only lose them because of the cap.

As a fan I wouldn't care if Dak made 32 million a year but when I know other good players cant be resigned because of an above average QB I get upset.
 

ABQCOWBOY

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Lol, so instead of the constant effort to play silly games with numbers, just answer this ... is Wentz being paid an additional $32MM/year above his existing contract for an additional 4 years of commitment above his existing, contract, and how would that differ from Dak getting paid an additional $32MM/year for an additional 4 years? Dak also has an existing contract you know.

It wouldn't, which is what I just finished say. Lets go ahead and do that. Lets pay him 32 mil for an additional 4 years and roll with that. That's a bad deal for Dak, BTW, but I'm good with it. I mean, what about what I'm saying here are you not clear on. I would do that deal right now, but it sucks for Dak but yeah. If that's what you want to see, we have no issue at all. I'm good with it.
 

ABQCOWBOY

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What's your point? I posted that but I didn't bring up the topic.
I replied to THAT post!
The one where YOU talk about RISK!!
That's the point![/QUOTE]

My point is that I didn't bring that up. That's my point. That conversation was already in play but who cares, the real discussion is what are you going to pay Dak? That's the topic of the thread.
 

IrishAnto

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I replied to THAT post!
The one where YOU talk about RISK!!
That's the point!

My point is that I didn't bring that up. That's my point. That conversation was already in play but who cares, the real discussion is what are you going to pay Dak? That's the topic of the thread.[/QUOTE]

YOU were the first to say the OWNERS take all the risk!
Nobody before your post in this thread said that and I replied to that!
You can understand that?
 

Doomsday101

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I think it is more of a status than anything else. Players look to be the highest paid not because 20 mill is not enough to live very comfortably on but because they look at what another player is getting. I do think there will come a day when this bubble burst and it will all come crashing down
 

ABQCOWBOY

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YOU were the first to say the OWNERS take all the risk!
Nobody before your post in this thread said that and I replied to that!
You can understand that?

Yes, I responded to post #7. What's your point? Owners do take all the risk financially. That's why they get the majority of the profits. Do you disagree with that statement?
 

IrishAnto

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Yes, I responded to post #7. What's your point? Owners do take all the risk financially. That's why they get the majority of the profits. Do you disagree with that statement?
Yes I do disagree with that statement, which is why I replied to your post in the first place.

Boy it’s like having a conversation with a goldfish!
 

ABQCOWBOY

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Yes I do disagree with that statement, which is why I replied to your post in the first place.

Boy it’s like having a conversation with a goldfish!

You are free to disagree but that's all it is. Owners make more because they have way more risk. Players do not. Call me whatever you want but it's you who is not facing the facts. There is a reason they make the money. I mean, does this really need to be explained to you? How can you not understand the reality of this?
 

IrishAnto

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You are free to disagree but that's all it is. Owners make more because they have way more risk. Players do not. Call me whatever you want but it's you who is not facing the facts. There is a reason they make the money. I mean, does this really need to be explained to you? How can you not understand the reality of this?
I'm not re-hashing an argument I've already had with you.
If your not capable of remembering it, then that's your problem not mine.
 
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