Recap: Cowboys Defensive Linemen Drafted since 2010

kskboys

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More importantly his system was supposed to generate errant throws and INTs. That hasn't materialized.
For the life of me I don't get it. Want to create TO's? Disrupt the pocket. When you are undermanned at DT, the QB can simply step up to avoid the outside rush. Which has been happening way too often the last few years.
 

Stash

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And add to that, this type of thinking has never resulted in a super bowl win.

Super Bowl? Barely even a playoff win!

To say nothing of the unsound nature of his up-the-field philosophy leaving the defense susceptible to getting run over as the Rams did.

It's not only not an asset, it's a liability.
 

kskboys

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Super Bowl? Barely even a playoff win!

To say nothing of the unsound nature of his up-the-field philosophy leaving the defense susceptible to getting run over as the Rams did.

It's not only not an asset, it's a liability.
Oak tried it w/ Seymour/Kelly just a few years ago, and both those guys were very good. Den used to try it all the time back in the 80's. Minny back in the 70's.

It's a philosophy that works against low and mid tier teams, but generally fails miserably against the top dogs.
 

ondaedg

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For the life of me I don't get it. Want to create TO's? Disrupt the pocket. When you are undermanned at DT, the QB can simply step up to avoid the outside rush. Which has been happening way too often the last few years.

When we ran the 3-4 our NT was 280lbs and would be turned into a pretzel by the center and guard double team. Meanwhile the Pats and Steelers were winning Super bowls with 340lb NTs that were immovable forces. I don't know if it's a JJ thing or what but we haven't figured out the NT/DT position for a long time.
 

quickccc

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Pull up that list of failures and things look even worse.

The fraud of Rod Marinelli's 'greatness' is being exposed. He's finished after this year, but we have to overcome it for the rest of this season. It then he will be 'retired' whether he likes it or not. It's just a shame that as with Linehan we have to wait another season for the inevitable.

that's what they were saying last year, ( that Marinelli was thought gone) after Rams utterly destroyed our run defense in playoffs.
But it was apparently never in question that Rod was finished. this organization loves the ole' geezer. they seem to think he's one of a kind, and I've heard the big three compliment him
in admiration several times over and how they are so lucky to have him here.
And the way he is still operating on the sidelines and camp, etc. doesn't suggest that he is close to being finished coaching here.
 

TwoCentPlain

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Yep. We're "haters" because we can actually be critical. How does it feel to go through life with zero accountability?

Accountable? Who are fans accountable to?:laugh:
Let's hear your critical analysis on the DL picks. Maybe compare it to other teams hit/miss %.
 

quickccc

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When we ran the 3-4 our NT was 280lbs and would be turned into a pretzel by the center and guard double team. Meanwhile the Pats and Steelers we're winning Super bowls with 340lb NTs that were immovable forces. I don't know if it's a JJ thing or what but we haven't figured out the NT/DT position for a long time.

Reports had it that the Cowboys coaches tried to get 285 lbs Jay Ratliff to move to DE in the 3-4, but he was " very reluctant " in accommodating that move.
 

FuzzyLumpkins

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Charlton DE
Ivey DT
Carrell DT
Collins DT
Tapper DE
Gregory DE/OLB
Russell DE
Lawrence DE
Gardner DE
Bishop DT
Crawford DT
Lissermore DT

I count 3 top 100 picks. I'm not sure what point is trying to be made here.
 

dallasfan4lizife

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Our D-line is 2014 bad this year. Quit look at the last names and watch them on the field. This will cause yet another playoff loss.
 

visionary

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Exactly, it is an organizational philosophy. No doubt Marinelli has some input, but the buck stops higher than his pay grade - even on DL picks.

You really think that if Marinelli told the higher ups that he needed a premium pick on DT or safety they would not have done that in 6 years?
 

Qcard

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Now do OL. And LB. And CB. I'm not trying to put lipstick on a pig, we haven't been as successful on DL and that's plainly obvious. But I don't know what this thread is getting at. Should we fire Will McClay? He'd have his pick of NFL jobs if we did.
I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater but there is a philosophical issue in DLine draft strategy.

I think Will is great but this needs fixing wouldn't you agree?
 

ondaedg

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Reports had it that the Cowboys coaches tried to get 285 lbs Jay Ratliff to move to DE in the 3-4, but he was " very reluctant " in accommodating that move.

This is surprising to me because of the punishment he took being an undersized NT in the 3-4. He could have been a good DT in a 4-3 but he was definitely not a long term solution at NT.
 

quickccc

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Now do OL. And LB. And CB. I'm not trying to put lipstick on a pig, we haven't been as successful on DL and that's plainly obvious. But I don't know what this thread is getting at. Should we fire Will McClay? He'd have his pick of NFL jobs if we did.

I don’t have issues with displaying names/number of past drafted DL, I would like think McClay can re-group his troops and come up with a better strategic evaluation of how they evaluate
DL talent and draft board value.

My issues still with the team is Scheme fit.. Coach preference and Coach/Position value, and how i think It’s impacting how the Cowboys draft/acquire DL via draft, FA, trade

1) Scheme fit - if cowboys have no issues drafting a 237 lb randy Gregory to instantly making him a 4-3 DE with his hand into the ground, why would they (Marinelli?) have an issue with a 252 lb. TJ Watt
(who was 15 pounds heavier) with his hand in the ground ? to me, the better coaches make that happen.

2) Coach preference – I wouldn’t have a problem with Marinelli’s preference, ( just as jimmie johnson had his own DT preference too) and I know some here on the board have in their minds with prototype “ fatties” but I feel so long as we can get average weight 300 pound guys that play much bigger than their suggested size, and prove they make it difficult on a regular basis- I’m fine with that. But the problems is… it’s still ever a revolving door of JAGs nick hayden, terrell mcclain, cedric thorton, stephen paea, Richard ash, brian price, antwuan woods etc., etc.

3) Coach/position value – it’s a reason why this team remains having such a trend of JAGs , decent types but never difference makers. Never one that alter/ changes the dynamics of how teams have to run the ball against us. And that seems to be because we have such low regards for the 1 tech role. With only the cedric thorton FA signing/ failure, we have tinkered with bargain based FA and very late round chimes but still we have come up empty.
Is it Marinelli or McClay that is buying into, or selling this philosophy that we don’t have invest higher and more when it comes to that 1 tech role ? We can continue to go cheap and low value and still come up rosy? We can’t get a 4th round pick guy who excelled vs run and one of the better run defending DT prospects in the NFL draft ?

it's not like McClay & co haven't been trying with the likes of Dlaw, Gregory, Maliek, Tapper, Taco and Hill, and even Irving off another team's practice squad.
 

camaro69

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Hey I'm an older guy with a question. I've heard Rod say that his defense is built around the 3T. From around 1985 - 05 guys like La'Roy Glover, Warren Sapp, J Randle and many more had Double digits sack's playing that position.
Outside of Aaron Donald there are no great interior lineman when it come to sacks. In 2000 La'Roy Glover Had 18 sacks, Sapp had 16.5. When you limit yourself to a body type, Physical traits you end up with second rd picks standing on the sideline.
Because your chasing the past .Yes the 3T is part of the 43 defense. I have no clue what changed but I don't see the sacks from the position in todays game. So what's wrong with a Fletcher Cox or N Suh
We moved on from Garretts offense. When well we move on from Rod outdated defense
 

quickccc

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This is surprising to me because of the punishment he took being an undersized NT in the 3-4. He could have been a good DT in a 4-3 but he was definitely not a long term solution at NT.

as exceptionally as he was as a pro bowl pass rushing NT, i thought Rat would have been that much more an impact 3 tech in a one gap 4-3 scheme, but I think he was on fumes
and his last legs in his last dayz while we were still in the 3-4 scheme.
 
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