The Elite QB Farce

There’s no farce. Some people get their feelings hurt over it but all you have to do is look at the landscape in the NFL. The teams that are currently good and have been good for several years all have what you would call elite QBs. Packers (Rodgers), Saints (Brees), Seahawks (Wilson), Patriots (Brady), Steelers (Big Ben), Texans (Watson), Chiefs (Mahomes). Can you win “A” Super Bowl with middling QBs like Foles, Flacco, or say a Dak? Sure, but those teams won’t be consistent winners year in and year out. Which means your odds of actually winning that one Super Bowl are longer than when you have someone elite under center.

CATCH17 said:

Yep.. The contract is 100% my problem with Dak because I do think he’s a good player but he is not good enough to take up all that cap space. This past season should’ve proved that.

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I agree. He just hasn't shown enough IMO. But you know how that goes.

BoysForLife said:

I'm not asking him to take less that what he's worth

Just because other QB contracts are escalating doesn't mean Dak's should simply because he became a FA at "the right time".

Pay should be based on talent. Not timing
As simply as I can say it, Dak's not worth anywhere near what he's asking.

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What's he asking?

Streetwise said:

What's he asking?

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Somewhere between $35-40 million, it appears

He's not worth what Jerry already offered imo. And we know he's asking more than that

OmerV said:

Something I've pointed out before is that those kind of "elite" QBs aren't as available to just go get as people seem to think. If they were, why would it take 20 years of drafts to fill out what is a very short list? Brady was drafted 20 years ago, Brees, 19 years ago, Rodgers 15 years ago … Even Wilson, who is one of the younger QBs on the list, is going into his 10th season. That's the bulk of the short list of elites, so obviously just going out and getting one isn't something a team can simply decide to make happen. And, realistically, the reason QB salaries have skyrocketed so much is because there aren't even enough top QB's, much less elite ones.

By the way, I don't think Jackson and Watson have quite earned their way into elite status yet. They are the next ones just on the outside and ready to come in, but in my mind they aren't quite there. In my mind Mahomes is the only youngster that has earned his way in

You made a great point about Elway. Another point to consider is that Flacco, Dilfer, Foles, and Brad Johnson have won Super Bowls, none of whom can be called elite.

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That's why I separated them into the new guard group, they're the up and comers. We seem to group QB's and then there's period of just good and then some good ones come back like we might have with this new group.

I think the point some are making about paying for an elite QB and not having one is legit but that is market driven and the price of a franchise QB. The elite ones like Brees, Rodgers and Wilson demand more and the 2nd tier ones just follow along. A team will have to have a first contract player like Mahomes, Jackson or Watson or they will paying a high % pf their cap for their QB1.

The owners have no one to blame but themselves for changing the rules to make the most important position even more so and an unwillingness to not roll over. Mahomes, Jackson and Watson are going to take the salaries above what Prescott will make and it won't take long for whatever his deal is to be out of the top 10. There is only going to be a short time when his salary and ranking as a QB are out of balance.

And while this is not meant to be about the QB, he is not the reason this team has underperformed and not advanced further. The team is out of balance, the lean too heavily to the O side with money and talent.

BoysForLife said:

Somewhere between $35-40 million, it appears

Full disclosure he's not worth what Jerry already offered imo. And we know he's asking more than that

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Someone inside the organization said he wanted 40M and his camp dispelled that.

The sticking point seems to be the length of the contract. The Cowboys are smart enough to realize where the QB salaries will be in 4 years so they're trying to get a longer term deal. However, Prescott's agent knows the same thing and he's looking at another contract when the median is what he's trying to get for Prescott now, Wilson money, 35M.

If I am Dak, tag me and tag me again. I'd make around 60M the next two seasons and when I am available and completely free, that 35M will look like a deal compared to the contracts for Jackson, Mahomes, Watson. He might get 40M per from the Cowboys or another team and he's still under 30 years old.

I think it was an interesting comment Big Mike made about Dak running the offense. That is the key, it's not about stats, it's all about managing the offense.

Philmonroe said:

You have nothing else to do with your life sir so you watch the games for fun that doesn't make you a hardcore fan. It just means like I said you have nothing else to do,with yourself because you sure don't know much about football from the post I see.

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You are an absolute Clown

CouchCoach said:

Someone inside the organization said he wanted 40M and his camp dispelled that.

The sticking point seems to be the length of the contract. The Cowboys are smart enough to realize where the QB salaries will be in 4 years so they're trying to get a longer term deal. However, Prescott's agent knows the same thing and he's looking at another contract when the median is what he's trying to get for Prescott now, Wilson money, 35M.

If I am Dak, tag me and tag me again. I'd make around 60M the next two seasons and when I am available and completely free, that 35M will look like a deal compared to the contracts for Jackson, Mahomes, Watson. He might get 40M per from the Cowboys or another team and he's still under 30 years old.

I think it was an interesting comment Big Mike made about Dak running the offense. That is the key, it's not about stats, it's all about managing the offense.

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He's not going to wait until he's 28 for a contract extension.

keysersoze said:

You are an absolute Clown

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Ok now that you've come to that conclusion do you have anything else sir?

BoysForLife said:

Somewhere between $35-40 million, it appears

He's not worth what Jerry already offered imo. And we know he's asking more than that

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I haven't seen a accurate number, just what fans have speculated. So, I'm not sure how anyone could say they know.

mattjames2010 said:

He's not going to wait until he's 28 for a contract extension.

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What's his alternative? And he would have made 60M while 26-27.

And don't say hold out because that's never going to happen. No QB has ever held out because they know they'd get 0 support from anyone, including their sponsors. Prescott has all those endorsements because he is the Cowboys QB, not a NFL QB.

There is one little itsy bitsy fly in the elite QB ointment. The new HC has never coached in the NFL without one.

That is going to be just one the most interesting things to watch unfold. The other is he's never run the ball more than 40% of the time but he's never had a RB like Elliott. So, can he do it with a QB not as good as what he's had and a RB better than he's ever had?

This is where the guy paying Elliott 15M a year might come into play. And I am sure that his name came up more than once in that 12 hour interview.

Do you think they'll rip off Kiefer Sutherland's hit "24 Hours" with "12 Hours for America's Team"?

CouchCoach said:

What's his alternative? And he would have made 60M while 26-27.

And don't say hold out because that's never going to happen. No QB has ever held out because they know they'd get 0 support from anyone, including their sponsors. Prescott has all those endorsements because he is the Cowboys QB, not a NFL QB.

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If we are truly sold on him we should sign him. And then we could tag Cooper instead. Who doesn’t look like he wants to stay here.

If we tag Dak then that means we aren’t sold on him IMO. Which would give me hope.

CouchCoach said:

Someone inside the organization said he wanted 40M and his camp dispelled that.

The sticking point seems to be the length of the contract. The Cowboys are smart enough to realize where the QB salaries will be in 4 years so they're trying to get a longer term deal. However, Prescott's agent knows the same thing and he's looking at another contract when the median is what he's trying to get for Prescott now, Wilson money, 35M.

If I am Dak, tag me and tag me again. I'd make around 60M the next two seasons and when I am available and completely free, that 35M will look like a deal compared to the contracts for Jackson, Mahomes, Watson. He might get 40M per from the Cowboys or another team and he's still under 30 years old.

I think it was an interesting comment Big Mike made about Dak running the offense. That is the key, it's not about stats, it's all about managing the offense.

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I thought I seen something say that Dak has specifically say he don't think he should be paid Wilson Money so if that's true then it would be below 35 and above Wentz and Goff so whats that 33 or 34? The tag is 28 the first year I think and more than that the second.In the big scheme of things what 6 a YEAR?

of course if you listen to some on this site Daks going to put this team in salary cap purgatory. Which is another knee jerk response.

ClintDagger said:

There’s no farce. Some people get their feelings hurt over it but all you have to do is look at the landscape in the NFL. The teams that are currently good and have been good for several years all have what you would call elite QBs. Packers (Rodgers), Saints (Brees), Seahawks (Wilson), Patriots (Brady), Steelers (Big Ben), Texans (Watson), Chiefs (Mahomes). Can you win “A” Super Bowl with middling QBs like Foles, Flacco, or say a Dak? Sure, but those teams won’t be consistent winners year in and year out. Which means your odds of actually winning that one Super Bowl are longer than when you have someone elite under center.

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Elite QBs aren't just interchangeable. You have to factor in coaching, scheme, surrounding talent, preparation etc. Sounds easy to hope for a QB who is already elite without accounting for those things it took to get him there. If Garrett only had Rodgers or Wilson or Brees? lol I have no doubt those guys would not be considered elite right now if they were drafted into the circus.

CouchCoach said:

What's his alternative? And he would have made 60M while 26-27.

And don't say hold out because that's never going to happen. No QB has ever held out because they know they'd get 0 support from anyone, including their sponsors. Prescott has all those endorsements because he is the Cowboys QB, not a NFL QB.

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He wouldn’t have to sign with us. He’d be a free agent

Again, he’s not waiting until he is 28 to get his second contract in the league when there will be some stupid team out that will secure his future with a contract

ClintDagger said:

There’s no farce. Some people get their feelings hurt over it but all you have to do is look at the landscape in the NFL. The teams that are currently good and have been good for several years all have what you would call elite QBs. Packers (Rodgers), Saints (Brees), Seahawks (Wilson), Patriots (Brady), Steelers (Big Ben), Texans (Watson), Chiefs (Mahomes). Can you win “A” Super Bowl with middling QBs like Foles, Flacco, or say a Dak? Sure, but those teams won’t be consistent winners year in and year out. Which means your odds of actually winning that one Super Bowl are longer than when you have someone elite under center.

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With the exception of Brady and the Pats. Which other team with ELITE QUARTERBACKS have won multiple Super Bowls? Actually the only other team to win multiple Super Bowls in recent history is the NY Giants and we all can agree that Eli is far from elite. So that bs theory is false if we are looking to win multiple championships and to not only contend. It’s good for fantasy football tho. But the best teams who are dynasties are superior because of coaching and team culture more so than an elite quarterback. But hey!!! Hang on to your beliefs and agendas if it makes you feel better.

keysersoze said:

With the exception of Brady and the Pats. Which other team with ELITE QUARTERBACKS have won multiple Super Bowls? Actually the only other team to win multiple Super Bowls in recent history is the NY Giants and we all can agree that Eli is far from elite. So that bs theory is false if we are looking to win multiple championships and to not only contend. It’s good for fantasy football tho. But the best teams who are dynasties are superior because of coaching and team culture more so than an elite quarterback. But hey!!! Hang on to your beliefs and agendas if it makes you feel better.

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Your using “ winning Super Bowls” as only measurement when its being a consistent SB contender . How many championships games have Rodgers and Brees been to.

Having an elite QB doesn't guarantee championships but it does make it easier to stay on top in Cap era.

Teams with Elite QB’s are more sustainable over time in Cap era. They need less supporting cast to remain competitive contenders.

And the Steelers have multiple SB’s wins in this eras as well since you mentioned it. With an Elite QB.

Diehardblues said:

Your using “ winning Super Bowls” as only measurement when its being a consistent SB contender . How many championships games have Rodgers and Brees been to.

Having an a elite QB doesn't guarantee championships but it does make it easier to stay on top in Cap era.

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You’re most certainly right. I only count Championships as the end all. Yea. I’ll count playoff appearances as a measure for improvement. But as all players and coaches say “The Goal Is To Win A Championship”. So if a so called elite quarterback doesn’t guarantee a championship, WTH are we having this discussion for? Apparently this debate is formulated to bash Dak. And no other purpose.

keysersoze said:

You’re most certainly right. I only count Championships as the end all. Yea. I’ll count playoff appearances as a measure for improvement. But as all players and coaches say “The Goal Is To Win A Championship”. So if a so called elite quarterback doesn’t guarantee a championship, WTH are we having this discussion for? Apparently this debate is formulated to bash Dak. And no other purpose.

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IMO this thread was presented as a defense for not having an Elite QB. Attempting to downgrade the importance of having one.

That’s why I’m responding anyway because I believe it’s of great importance in having a consistent SB contender. Obviously you can still win without one.