Byron Jones or Amari Cooper?

KJJ

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
56,938
Reaction score
35,046
WillieBeamen said:
Byron


This board is comedy. Yall are OK with stacking all our resources on offense and filling out or defense with draft picks and mid/tier free agents :facepalm:


If Dak is who yall beieve he is, we dont need Coop
Click to expand...

Dak needs weapons. Check his numbers before Cooper and after Cooper, they’re not even close. You don’t pour big money into a QB and take away their #1 receiver.
 
TwentyOne

TwentyOne

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,625
Reaction score
4,301
Creeper said:
If we could sign only one, which should it be? A week ago, I would have said Cooper, hands down. Now, I am not so sure. I have seen a few interviews with Cooper lately and what I see is a guy who says he wants to stay, but he lacks passion. I think the lack of passion shows up on the field. He seems to play with little or no emotion. He is a good receiver, but is he a fit in Dallas? He plays with his head down, if you know what I mean. He is not Michael Irvin, TO, or Dez in this regard. He makes plays but it never looks like he is giving 100%. He disappeared down the stretch when they really needed him.

Looking at the averages of other WRs in the league, I would be shocked if Cooper does not want at least $16 million per year. In 2018, Mike Evans of the Bucs signed for 5 years and $82 million, or $16.5 million/year. Julio Jones and Michael Thomas average $22 million and $19.5 million respectively. I think it will take at least what Evans got if not more to sign Cooper.

CBs average a little less. The top CBs salary is about $15 million/year. I am guessing Jones will be offered at least 5 yrs, $75 million. The question is, would you rather have Cooper for $17-18 million a year or Jones for $15 miillion - or neither?
Click to expand...


From what i understand of Nolans defense preferences is NT and Safety over CB. So i guess Armani stays and Jones is gone. We draft and/or FA for another CB
 
TwentyOne

TwentyOne

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,625
Reaction score
4,301
KJJ said:
Dak needs weapons. Check his numbers before Cooper and after Cooper, they’re not even close. You don’t pour big money into a QB and take away their #1 receiver.
Click to expand...

WRONG: You pug big money in a QB because he doesnt need a real #1 WR. He can elevate a #2 to be a #1.
 
Patrick

Patrick

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,213
Reaction score
2,683
kskboys said:
And what's even more loveable is how fans think WR's win titles, when it's so obviously the trenches.
Click to expand...

Correct. Not sure why you're quoting me when I haven't mentioned anything on that matter.

I'd gladly let either one go for a similarly talented D-Lineman.
 

kskboys

Well-Known Member
Messages
44,399
Reaction score
47,279
Patrick said:
Correct. Not sure why you're quoting me when I haven't mentioned anything on that matter.

I'd gladly let either one go for a similarly talented D-Lineman.
Click to expand...
Because when you pay huge amounts to some positions, other positions suffer mightily.

I'd actually love to keep both Coop and Byron. However, I would keep neither if they want huge money. Because until we fix the trenches on D, nothing much we do is going to matter.
 
mattjames2010

mattjames2010

Well-Known Member
Messages
21,482
Reaction score
20,161
FanSince71 said:
I see what you’re saying here, it’s just that I think you’re somehow downplaying the importance of turnovers as factors for whether or not the team actually wins or loses. I couldn’t care less if INTs are overrated in reference to Byron Jones, because they are absolutely vital to winning football games.

That said, I’m not 100% sure that the Cowboys defense’s lack of turnovers is all on the players. Yes, players are on the field, coaches aren’t, but the Cowboys have played an ultra-conservative defense the past 7 seasons. Lots of zone coverage, about 25% blitzing and playing to make the opposing offense drive the entire field hoping they make a mistake to force a change of possession. It was all about making sure you don’t give up the big play and we rarely made that work in 7 seasons.

In one of his articles from The Athletic, Bob Sturm said:
“The Cowboys decided they needed a change. I do not believe they seriously considered Kris Richard or Rod Marinelli for future positions here. They tried their ideas repeatedly and found that no takeaways were a constant, and this constant was tilting the field against them. When that happens, you are asking more of your offense — not less — by starting every field position deeper than your opponents every week. And, no matter how careful your offense is with the football, they still lose the turnover battle because the defense can’t get it. They were determined to change in 2020 long before they hired the new help.”

Teams that win the turnover battle win 78% of their games.
Click to expand...

> they are vital

Where/when/context of the INT is far more important than the raw stat. Two or three INTs from a single DB is hardly going to change the course of a season the vast majority of the time. You know what does? Locking down whatever WR you go up against for the majority of the game forcing the QB to look elsewhere.

That is far more important than the flashy statistic everyone THINKS makes a DB. Jamal Adams has 2 INTs in 3 seasons, yet this board wants to give up multiple first rounders for him.
 
mattjames2010

mattjames2010

Well-Known Member
Messages
21,482
Reaction score
20,161
KJJ said:
Dak needs weapons. Check his numbers before Cooper and after Cooper, they’re not even close. You don’t pour big money into a QB and take away their #1 receiver.
Click to expand...

His best season came without Cooper.
 
blumayne38

blumayne38

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,702
Reaction score
2,496
iRepDatStar said:
We had passion but yall were scared of it.. or it rubbed some the wrong way.. now you got quiet and not the same. Do we see byron play with any passion? Not really If you ask me.. if I had to choose its coop.. hes more valuable to this teams success if you ask me.. not to mention we just drafted him last year
Click to expand...
If that’s the case then we need to draft another QB,
FanSince71 said:
I see what you’re saying here, it’s just that I think you’re somehow downplaying the importance of turnovers as factors for whether or not the team actually wins or loses. I couldn’t care less if INTs are overrated in reference to Byron Jones, because they are absolutely vital to winning football games.

That said, I’m not 100% sure that the Cowboys defense’s lack of turnovers is all on the players. Yes, players are on the field, coaches aren’t, but the Cowboys have played an ultra-conservative defense the past 7 seasons. Lots of zone coverage, about 25% blitzing and playing to make the opposing offense drive the entire field hoping they make a mistake to force a change of possession. It was all about making sure you don’t give up the big play and we rarely made that work in 7 seasons.

In one of his articles from The Athletic, Bob Sturm said:
“The Cowboys decided they needed a change. I do not believe they seriously considered Kris Richard or Rod Marinelli for future positions here. They tried their ideas repeatedly and found that no takeaways were a constant, and this constant was tilting the field against them. When that happens, you are asking more of your offense — not less — by starting every field position deeper than your opponents every week. And, no matter how careful your offense is with the football, they still lose the turnover battle because the defense can’t get it. They were determined to change in 2020 long before they hired the new help.”

Teams that win the turnover battle win 78% of their games.
Click to expand...
playing that kind of defense, we always relied on the offense being great at 3 things
1. T.O.P - time of possession
2. Total offensive 1st downs
3. 3rd down conversion %


After the romo went down it just didn’t work anymore, dak goes through stretches where he doesn’t sustain drives good enough...and we turn over the ball.
 
rnr_honeybadger

rnr_honeybadger

Well-Known Member
Messages
11,305
Reaction score
17,075
Patrick said:
This might make sense if the Cowboys had anything close to the defense the 49ers have, not to mention the coaching difference.
Click to expand...

Okay, well we have a better coach now. A coach who for years did more with way less talent.
 
WillieBeamen

WillieBeamen

BoysfanfromNY
Messages
15,174
Reaction score
43,724
KJJ said:
Dak needs weapons. Check his numbers before Cooper and after Cooper, they’re not even close. You don’t pour big money into a QB and take away their #1 receiver.
Click to expand...
Im aware



Like I said, it makes no sense in giving a QB record breaking money AND be forced to sign a receiver because the QB is trash without him.

Sounds like a QB problem to me
 
Loso86

Loso86

Well-Known Member
Messages
4,581
Reaction score
3,786
I guess the question is do I want a good cover corner who almost never gets his hands on the ball.......or do I want a wr who puts ALOT and disappears in big games against really good CBs......hmmm
 
KJJ

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
56,938
Reaction score
35,046
WillieBeamen said:
Im aware



Like I said, it makes no sense in giving a QB record breaking money AND be forced to sign a receiver because the QB is trash without him.

Sounds like a QB problem to me
Click to expand...

If you look at most of the top QBs in the league including Mahomes they all have a top receiver. They all have solid weapons. The addition of Cooper and the development of Michael Gallup has helped make Dak a very productive QB. Anyone who thinks he’s trash and some of these backups in the league would be better options doesn’t have a clue about football. The QB we have isn’t the problem!
 
KJJ

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
56,938
Reaction score
35,046
mattjames2010 said:
His best season came without Cooper.
Click to expand...

His rookie season wasn’t his most productive season and he had weapons that season including Dez who had 8 TD’s. Plus Zeke and our OL had a great year. Our OL isn’t near what it was in 2016.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top