Did you guys know Romo though 09-16 won 15 games?

ABQCOWBOY · Jan 25, 2020

You know, I'm not saying it's right but I am saying that this is the way it is in the NFL and what's more, it's always been this way. QBs get too much credit for wins and they get too much blame for losses. QBs are judged off wins and losses, that's just how it is.

Now, we can all argue till the Cows come home over the merits of this but when those Cows do show up on the porch, QBs will still be getting too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses. They will still be judged on Ws and Ls.

It is what it is.

Loso86 · Jan 25, 2020

rocyaice said:
Against winning teams?

Does this mean anything?

I guess my question is, how many of those years did he have a good and reliable defense and same goes for the quarterbacks at the top of the list?

HungryLion · Jan 25, 2020

ABQCOWBOY said:
You know, I'm not saying it's right but I am saying that this is the way it is in the NFL and what's more, it's always been this way. QBs get too much credit for wins and they get too much blame for losses. QBs are judged off wins and losses, that's just how it is.

Now, we can all argue till the Cows come home over the merits of this but when those Cows do show up on the porch, QBs will still be getting too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses.

It is what it is.

It’s true.

I was just about to post in this thread when I saw your post.

To beat good teams. Beyond good QB play, You need good coaching. You need good defensive play. You need to force turnovers, etc.

It takes entire team efforts to beat good teams.

IMO the main problems in Dallas for a while haven’t been the QB. That goes for when Romo was the QB and it goes for Dak right now also.

Section446 · Jan 25, 2020

Who cares? Dude hasn't been here in years.

ABQCOWBOY · Jan 25, 2020

DakPresgoat said:
It’s true.

I was just about to post in this thread when I saw your post.

To beat good teams. Beyond good QB play, You need good coaching. You need good defensive play. You need to force turnovers, etc.

It takes entire team efforts to beat good teams.

IMO the main problems in Dallas for a while haven’t been the QB. That goes for when Romo was the QB and it goes for Dak right now also.

I don't feel as if we've ever had enough to actually be considered real contenders for the Super Bowl, since the end of the 90s Dynasty teams. We've had enough talent at certain times but we've never had all the rest. I'm really hoping that we can somehow put it together now but time will tell. The only thing that hasn't changed in all those years is Ownership/GM. If we fail this time, that's going to be a pretty harsh condemnation of Jerry. At some point, that reality has to set in. Maybe it already has and it doesn't matter but I have to believe that Jerry wants to win. It's a fish or cut bait kinda feeling, to me.

gimmesix · Jan 25, 2020

Flamma said:
This is a team statistic being applied to the quarterback. People here act as if a quarterback is similar to a pitcher in baseball, they are not.

And even a pitcher can't be judged on wins and losses. A player commits an error and it allows a run when an out would have ended the inning. A pitcher gives up one or two runs but his team is shut out. Is that a bad pitcher?

He can be judged on ERA, though, because that's essentially him vs. the batter, while a quarterback can't even really be judged entirely on things like completion percentage and interceptions because of drops, bad routes, protection, etc.

Football is so much of a team-dependent sports that I think we do players an injustice when we try to boil their play down to just the statistics (and I'm as guilty of that as anyone). It's possible that the quarterback didn't complete the pass because he made a bad throw, but it's just as possible that his protection broke down immediately and he had to throw it away or the receiver dropped the ball or the receiver ran a bad route.

I think there is some value to statistics, but we need to be a careful about how we apply them.

Nav22 · Jan 25, 2020

WillieBeamen said:
You are wrong about just about everything.

Im right about everything..

You are sensitive because there are folks that hate Dak as the QB of this team. Thats not me being a troll, thats a you-thing.

Funny hearing that from the least respected poster on this board.
:lmao2:

Cool Dez avatar, Human Joke!

Dodger12 · Jan 25, 2020

rocyaice said:
Did I say they played together? Those were the linemen they invested in and the actual good ones I listed. Did you want me to list Nate Livings and Mackenzie Bernadeau too?

When you list 5 OL as evidence of a quality OL, you can assume that you inferred that they played together. Otherwise, who cares if he played with 1 of the 5 you listed with 4 other linemen? That does nothing for your argument that he had a talented OL.

Number1 · Jan 25, 2020

rocyaice said:
Oh really? What's been going on with him?

not sure but looks like an extreme case of denial ... there are a few other loose in the same condition

gimmesix · Jan 25, 2020

rocyaice said:
Of course they have played poorly. No one plays well every game. But Dak and Romo both have had good season that were good enough to be on playoff teams.

And whether fair or unfair....people use W/L to judge quarterbacks because they have the most impact on a game out of the players. Ware never could impact a game like Romo.

Now I don't agree with that. I think there are times when you can tell a good team is being held back by a quarterback. Rex Grossman comes to mind and Mitch Tribusky.

But make no mistake there are teams in this league that can still win when their quarterback has a bad game. 49ers can suffer a Jimmy G bad game and still win. Titans too. Cowboys have never had a team be able to do that. If the quarterback is bad that game that might as well be a loss.

I remember a couple of years ago going back and watching some of the '70s games with Staubach. If our defense and running game had not been good, there were definitely times when we would not have gotten far with the way Staubach was playing. There were other times when Staubach stepped up when one of those two areas had a letdown. That's team play.

Expecting a quarterback to be good every game is unrealistic. Same for the running game and the defense. Each has to carry the load at times. The reason Romo got extended and Dak will is because front offices understand the reality of it. These quarterbacks aren't the reason why we haven't won a Super Bowl since the 1990s.

ABQCOWBOY · Jan 25, 2020

gimmesix said:
I remember a couple of years ago going back and watching some of the '70s games with Staubach. If our defense and running game had not been good, there were definitely times when we would not have gotten far with the way Staubach was playing. There were other times when Staubach stepped up when one of those two areas had a letdown. That's team play.

Expecting a quarterback to be good every game is unrealistic. Same for the running game and the defense. Each has to carry the load at times. The reason Romo got extended and Dak will is because front offices understand the reality of it. These quarterbacks aren't the reason why we haven't won a Super Bowl since the 1990s.

And yet, you can put Tom Brady up and look at what he has accomplished. Not because he is that much better then any other QB in his era but because he did what none of the others would. He gave up big money in exchange for cap flexibility. I can't stress how important that was for the Pats. How often have they been able to make moves to get key vet players over the years?

For the record, I don't think anybody expects QBs to be perfect all the time. But they do expect them to be able to make plays when they are their.

nightrain · Jan 25, 2020

I read on here that Brady always plays a soft schedule.

Chuck 54 · Jan 25, 2020

Yes....lol....Romo’s record vs winning teams was all Garrett’s fault, like everything else.
Funny how the same fans who want accountability and think the new coach will finally hold players accountable actually hold no one, past or present, accountable because everything was Garrett’s fault. So funny!

TheMarathonContinues · Jan 25, 2020

Dodger12 said:
When you list 5 OL as evidence of a quality OL, you can assume that you inferred that they played together. Otherwise, who cares if he played with 1 of the 5 you listed with 4 other linemen? That does nothing for your argument that he had a talented OL.

That group was around for Romo's prime. And let's take off Rivera. Flozell, Gurode, Kosier, Davis and Colombo was a very good offensive line. Better than a lot of teams had at that time.

WillieBeamen · Jan 25, 2020

Nav22 said:
Funny hearing that from the least respected poster on this board.

Cool Dez avatar, Human Joke!

Still taking the avatar angle :laugh:

When you have nothing, say anything I guesa :lmao:

Dodger12 · Jan 25, 2020

rocyaice said:
That group was around for Romo's prime. And let's take off Rivera. Flozell, Gurode, Kosier, Davis and Colombo was a very good offensive line. Better than a lot of teams had at that time.

By 2010 and especially 2011, most of the OL you mentioned were gone and Rivera only played a year. Kosier and Colombo were cast-offs from other teams and we overpaid for Davis. We had issues at both tackle positions and Doug Free was a turnstile. Adams was among the league leaders in holding penalties. And we tried to patch that line up by going cheap with guys like Bernadeau and Nate Livings. Ryan Cook replaced Phil Costa at center...let that sink in. Only Romo's escapeability saved those lines.

No way you can compare Romo's lines to Dak's. Dak has never had a line with the talent of Phil Costa/Cook, Bernadeau, Nate Livings and Doug Free playing at the same time. No one ever claimed Romo had a consistently good OL, while Dak has had the benefit of having one of the best during his 4 years.

Jake · Jan 25, 2020

rocyaice said:
Against winning teams?

Does this mean anything?

Defensive rankings:

2009 - 2nd
2010 - 31st
2011 - 16th
2012 - 25th
2013 - 26th
2014 - 15th
Romo barely played in 2015-16.

QBs don't win games by themselves.

CowboyRoy · Jan 25, 2020

rocyaice said:
That’s what was told to us. Has that been proven as fact? This organization is known to lie.

it’s possible, but doubtful. It was obvious with Garrett he had little control.

gimmesix · Jan 25, 2020

ABQCOWBOY said:
And yet, you can put Tom Brady up and look at what he has accomplished. Not because he is that much better then any other QB in his era but because he did what none of the others would. He gave up big money in exchange for cap flexibility. I can't stress how important that was for the Pats. How often have they been able to make moves to get key vet players over the years?

For the record, I don't think anybody expects QBs to be perfect all the time. But they do expect them to be able to make plays when they are their.

I don't think anyone consciously expects QBs to be perfect all the time, but when the team loses, they turn to the mistakes the QBs made as reasons. I remember Romo being blamed for the loss to Denver because of a mistake he made in the 51-48 game.

Brady is definitely a perfect example of a really good quarterback being surrounded by what it takes to succeed. I don't think it's all due to Brady taking a home-team discount.

TheMarathonContinues · Jan 25, 2020

Dodger12 said:
By 2010 and especially 2011, most of the OL you mentioned were gone and Rivera only played a year. Kosier and Colombo were cast-offs from other teams and we overpaid for Davis. We had issues at both tackle positions and Doug Free was a turnstile. Adams was among the league leaders in holding penalties. And we tried to patch that line up by going cheap with guys like Bernadeau and Nate Livings. Ryan Cook replaced Phil Costa at center...let that sink in. Only Romo's escapeability saved those lines.

No way you can compare Romo's lines to Dak's. Dak has never had a line with the talent of Phil Costa/Cook, Bernadeau, Nate Livings and Doug Free playing at the same time. No one ever claimed Romo had a consistently good OL, while Dak has had the benefit of having one of the best during his 4 years.

Ok I’m not arguing who had the better line even though the offensive line in 2014 is the best offensive line we’ve seen around here in a long time. Once again no debated Romo had some
Bad lines. But the narrative you guys have created is he never had a line and that’s a myth.

Did you guys know Romo though 09-16 won 15 games?

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