All-22 Defense vs Saints - My observations

[Enlightened32]

B Jones does not look like a safety at all. I keep seeing people say he will be starting safety next year but I don't see the body for it. He isn't a strong tackler and wouldn't strike fear in a WR coming over the middle.

Earl Thomas is one of the best FSs in the NFL. Do you really think he strikes fear in anyone?

 

[CowboyStar88]

Earl Thomas is one of the best FSs in the NFL. Do you really think he strikes fear in anyone?

no comparison between the 2

 

[BHendri5]

B Jones does not look like a safety at all. I keep seeing people say he will be starting safety next year but I don't see the body for it. He isn't a strong tackler and wouldn't strike fear in a WR coming over the middle.

Yes he is, a real safety is one that can cover as well as be a sure tackler, why do your safety have to strike fear in a WR?

 

[Enlightened32]

no comparison between the 2

Not the point, you dont have to put fear in a WR to be a great FS.

 

[CowboyStar88]

Yes he is, a real safety is one that can cover as well as be a sure tackler, why do your safety have to strike fear in a WR?

Well he can't tackle and haven't seen him really be a cover guy yet. How bout we leave him at Corner since Carr will mostly like be gone? Let Scandrick move back to Slot and resign Mo. I will be highly disappointed that Dallas spent a first rd pick on a safety. Sorry the value is at corner for Jones. We don't even know if he was a workout warrior we really don't know about the football skill yet. Let's wait and see. But for now he needs to focus on being able to tackle.

 

[xwalker]

Since I id the offense earlier in the week, I did the defense as promised, though a little late at this point. I have a link where I took notes on every defensive play below. For brevity I will hit some high level points

Players

• DeMarcus Lawrence may have played the best game from a RDE I have ssen in awhile. He was basically sound and disruptive on every play but 2. One was blocked well and another he tripped on a stunt

• Irving didnt play many snaps but was disruptive while in there. I only saw 1 play where he took himself out
• Claiborne is by far the best corner at this juncture. Still there were 2 plays where he is playing press man but doesnt attempt to get a hand on the WR on the release. Both were completions for 1st downs. Head scratcher
• Crawford was very disruptive early and seemed to wear down as the game went along.
• Hayden and Mincey were consistent, Mincey had a couple opportunities to really make a splash play but just missed a TFL on a RB.
• Hitchens seemed to get called alot for making some plays, but I counted no less than 3 times where he completely missed diagnosed a play or sat there and let a guard pancake him.
• Wilson looked really good, just wasnt prepared on game winning call. He sheds blocks well and is quick to diagnose runs. .
• B Jones seems to be improving and di well against TEs and made some good open field tackles for minimal gain that would have busted for bg yardage
• Carr may be a lost cause. THe PI penalty erasing the Church INT was stupid and lazy. Willie Snead consitently got the better of him
• Church is a backup safety at best. He is slow and has zero coverage skills. If the RB pick route wasnt working so well, I believe Brees would have moved to iso Church and HIll it is really painful to watch.
• Wilcox was average. There were a couple of plays he overran. His Illegal hands on a 3rd down pass break up was complete BS. There were about 4 plays where I could only remember that great Allan ball MS paint thread. He was 30 yards off the ball and we weren't in prevent.

Dallas surrendered 13 points through 3 quarters 3 and 3 of those came on a 3 and out 12 man penalty on the punt. The other FG came after Wilcox made the 3rd down stop but got that penalty

There were 2 formations that basically killed Dallas. One was the RB to the flat pick play (whether out of back field or Spiller lined up in slot) the other was a super Heavy set By NO of T-G-C-G-T-T-TE-TE. there were 5 plays run from this and the gains were always over 10 yards.

On the 4th quarter TD drive, Mo stopped cooks on a 3rd and 3 with a great coverage and tackle for 2 yards. 4th and 1....the RB flare play for 9. It was academic because they called Mo for illegal hands for some reason

In summary, none of these are shocking, but it boiled down to:

• missed opportunities and penalties
• lack of consistent pressure late
• bad communication after Lee went out from LBs.
• Church and Carr - if I have to be blunt with a specific player
• Lack of adjustment on 2 plays that the Saints went to over and over. Very rarely was the defense just outmatched..more outschemed

For NE, it is concerning that Dallas cant quickly adjust to defend a certain play. This would harken back to the Indy-NE game last year where NE found a play and ran it ad nauseum.

B Jones has to be on Gronk, if he fails -he fails, but Gronk will get 200 yards or more on Church. The pressure has to be more consistent. Anytime there was pressure Bress had an
Incompletion. Have to get brady on the move.

Wilson has some speed to cover the flat, they have to work on that or NE is going to run Dion lewis out there all day.


You can view the notes y play here if interested.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zkwJwfngQ99BpJ7vW1Y48i6lGsbUJtedfnD0A3yXq2g/edit?usp=sharing

Great work.

 

[ConstantReboot]

I hit is as the #1 bullet point to the reason along with penalties. Figured that has been hit enough.

As an aside, started to make this a new thread, but I think the NFL is getting precariously close to engendering some long-term apathy if this inconsistency continues in calling penalties. Calling Wilcox for that play and not calling Breaux at least 5 other times is an issue. The Mo penalty accepted was a ceiling of Breaux's floor on plays. Top that with the Detroit game, The Dez call, the Eifert call then looking at the Maclin "catch" and OBJ "non-catch" when Wilcox leveled him, picks/non-picks, I never get excited about any pass play anymore.

The outcome of games has become way too dependent on judges cards like figure skating. There are games with 35-40 penalties now. It just is becoming hard to watch.

I noticed that too. Breaux was absolutely mauling Williams and yet there was no call. Yet we get called for the ticky tack fouls which favored the Saints. I watched that foul made by Carr. I don't think that should have been a hold at all because the receiver was not slowed by a simple tug. Wilcox's call was as BS as you can get.

The entire NFL rests on refs these days. They have too much power to make calls that can determine the outcome of the game. There is also favoritism involved in these calls. Just like that call that favored Seattle in beating the Lions. I too believe the games are now hard to watch and frankly I'm losing interest in the game these days.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

I think he has a shot to be this season's Selvie, with far more upside though.

They play a lot of man where they line up close and don't press. It's not press coverage without the press though. So, unless Claiborne is just ignoring the play call, I think they've been instructed not to press. They all do it.

I think Crawford will benefit the most from Hardy coming back. He will get to slide outside some and get more rest.

Mincey still didn't look healthy. His normal explosion wasn't there. Hayden is Hayden.

In his defense, Hitchens had to take over a role he isn't used to and seemed to be overthinking things. I noticed he hesitancy too. He doesn't normally play that way. All the more reason either Lee or McClain has to stay healthy and stick.

I said it in the game thread. Wilson is one of the best linebackers I have ever seen at shooting gaps. He actually reminds me a lot of Derrick Brooks and how he played in this defense. He doesn't wait for blockers, he missles through his gap.

Given what he was asked to do, I though Jones was our best DB in the game. He was the only one making solo tackles and single-handedly forced a couple 4th downs.

Agreed. He'll be gone in the offseason.

Church is an in the box safety with a lot of mileage. He has looked a step slow this season. I think he has been one of the most, if not THE most underrated guy on this team for four years, but this season he looks gassed.



Wilcox has no place on an NFL defense. He doesn't do anything well and his progress has absolutely stunted this season. I think he walks with Carr after the season.



Better figure it out because this is a hallmark of NE's offense.

They aren't replacing both starting safeties in one offseason. Wilcox would look much more better if he played his true spot at SS. He isn't a FS and if Claiborne keeps it up you can afford to move Jones to FS, then slide Wilcox over to SS.

 

[Bullflop]

According to Mick Spags, DE David Irving was in on 24 plays, rather than the "not many snaps" that the OP claims to have been the case. He offers an article on dc.com whereby this kid is being touted somewhat and is said to be "opening some eyes" with the Cowboys' staff. We might want to give a looksee to #95 in Sunday's contest vs. the Pats to see how he's performing.

 

[mahoneybill]

Since I id the offense earlier in the week, I did the defense as promised, though a little late at this point. I have a link where I took notes on every defensive play below. For brevity I will hit some high level points

Players

• DeMarcus Lawrence may have played the best game from a RDE I have ssen in awhile. He was basically sound and disruptive on every play but 2. One was blocked well and another he tripped on a stunt

• Irving didnt play many snaps but was disruptive while in there. I only saw 1 play where he took himself out
• Claiborne is by far the best corner at this juncture. Still there were 2 plays where he is playing press man but doesnt attempt to get a hand on the WR on the release. Both were completions for 1st downs. Head scratcher
• Crawford was very disruptive early and seemed to wear down as the game went along.
• Hayden and Mincey were consistent, Mincey had a couple opportunities to really make a splash play but just missed a TFL on a RB.
• Hitchens seemed to get called alot for making some plays, but I counted no less than 3 times where he completely missed diagnosed a play or sat there and let a guard pancake him.
• Wilson looked really good, just wasnt prepared on game winning call. He sheds blocks well and is quick to diagnose runs. .
• B Jones seems to be improving and di well against TEs and made some good open field tackles for minimal gain that would have busted for bg yardage
• Carr may be a lost cause. THe PI penalty erasing the Church INT was stupid and lazy. Willie Snead consitently got the better of him
• Church is a backup safety at best. He is slow and has zero coverage skills. If the RB pick route wasnt working so well, I believe Brees would have moved to iso Church and HIll it is really painful to watch.
• Wilcox was average. There were a couple of plays he overran. His Illegal hands on a 3rd down pass break up was complete BS. There were about 4 plays where I could only remember that great Allan ball MS paint thread. He was 30 yards off the ball and we weren't in prevent.

Dallas surrendered 13 points through 3 quarters 3 and 3 of those came on a 3 and out 12 man penalty on the punt. The other FG came after Wilcox made the 3rd down stop but got that penalty

There were 2 formations that basically killed Dallas. One was the RB to the flat pick play (whether out of back field or Spiller lined up in slot) the other was a super Heavy set By NO of T-G-C-G-T-T-TE-TE. there were 5 plays run from this and the gains were always over 10 yards.

On the 4th quarter TD drive, Mo stopped cooks on a 3rd and 3 with a great coverage and tackle for 2 yards. 4th and 1....the RB flare play for 9. It was academic because they called Mo for illegal hands for some reason

In summary, none of these are shocking, but it boiled down to:

• missed opportunities and penalties
• lack of consistent pressure late
• bad communication after Lee went out from LBs.
• Church and Carr - if I have to be blunt with a specific player
• Lack of adjustment on 2 plays that the Saints went to over and over. Very rarely was the defense just outmatched..more outschemed

For NE, it is concerning that Dallas cant quickly adjust to defend a certain play. This would harken back to the Indy-NE game last year where NE found a play and ran it ad nauseum.

B Jones has to be on Gronk, if he fails -he fails, but Gronk will get 200 yards or more on Church. The pressure has to be more consistent. Anytime there was pressure Bress had an
Incompletion. Have to get brady on the move.

Wilson has some speed to cover the flat, they have to work on that or NE is going to run Dion lewis out there all day.


You can view the notes y play here if interested.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zkwJwfngQ99BpJ7vW1Y48i6lGsbUJtedfnD0A3yXq2g/edit?usp=sharing

Nice post/analysis. Really like the " call it like it is approach on player evaluation. Great to hear the positives about newer guys, along with the ugly reality of some of our vets e.g. Carr, Church.

 

[mahoneybill]

According to Mick Spags, DE David Irving was in on 24 plays, rather than the "not many snaps" that the OP claims to have been the case. He offers an article on dc.com whereby this kid is being touted somewhat and is said to be "opening some eyes" with the Cowboys' staff. We might want to give a looksee to #95 in Sunday's contest vs. the Pats to see how he's performing.

Agree. This is a game where we can afford to try out some newer guys to see what we have for later in the season, and going forward into next year. Ist game in a long time where I'm just going to watch individuals and not worry about the score or the W. If by some chance we come out with one that would be great but in
reality I see this being a minimum 10-14 pt NE victory.

 

[mahoneybill]

I noticed that too. Breaux was absolutely mauling Williams and yet there was no call. Yet we get called for the ticky tack fouls which favored the Saints. I watched that foul made by Carr. I don't think that should have been a hold at all because the receiver was not slowed by a simple tug. Wilcox's call was as BS as you can get.

The entire NFL rests on refs these days. They have too much power to make calls that can determine the outcome of the game. There is also favoritism involved in these calls. Just like that call that favored Seattle in beating the Lions. I too believe the games are now hard to watch and frankly I'm losing interest in the game these days.

Agree. It's to the point that after every positive play, O , D, or ST, I wait for the flag to fly to offset a positive moment.

 

[xwalker]

According to Mick Spags, DE David Irving was in on 24 plays, rather than the "not many snaps" that the OP claims to have been the case. He offers an article on dc.com whereby this kid is being touted somewhat and is said to be "opening some eyes" with the Cowboys' staff. We might want to give a looksee to #95 in Sunday's contest vs. the Pats to see how he's performing.

Yes, he played 24 snaps on defense which was 33% of the snaps.

 

[dallasdave]

Since I id the offense earlier in the week, I did the defense as promised, though a little late at this point. I have a link where I took notes on every defensive play below. For brevity I will hit some high level points

Players

• DeMarcus Lawrence may have played the best game from a RDE I have ssen in awhile. He was basically sound and disruptive on every play but 2. One was blocked well and another he tripped on a stunt

• Irving didnt play many snaps but was disruptive while in there. I only saw 1 play where he took himself out
• Claiborne is by far the best corner at this juncture. Still there were 2 plays where he is playing press man but doesnt attempt to get a hand on the WR on the release. Both were completions for 1st downs. Head scratcher
• Crawford was very disruptive early and seemed to wear down as the game went along.
• Hayden and Mincey were consistent, Mincey had a couple opportunities to really make a splash play but just missed a TFL on a RB.
• Hitchens seemed to get called alot for making some plays, but I counted no less than 3 times where he completely missed diagnosed a play or sat there and let a guard pancake him.
• Wilson looked really good, just wasnt prepared on game winning call. He sheds blocks well and is quick to diagnose runs. .
• B Jones seems to be improving and di well against TEs and made some good open field tackles for minimal gain that would have busted for bg yardage
• Carr may be a lost cause. THe PI penalty erasing the Church INT was stupid and lazy. Willie Snead consitently got the better of him
• Church is a backup safety at best. He is slow and has zero coverage skills. If the RB pick route wasnt working so well, I believe Brees would have moved to iso Church and HIll it is really painful to watch.
• Wilcox was average. There were a couple of plays he overran. His Illegal hands on a 3rd down pass break up was complete BS. There were about 4 plays where I could only remember that great Allan ball MS paint thread. He was 30 yards off the ball and we weren't in prevent.

Dallas surrendered 13 points through 3 quarters 3 and 3 of those came on a 3 and out 12 man penalty on the punt. The other FG came after Wilcox made the 3rd down stop but got that penalty

There were 2 formations that basically killed Dallas. One was the RB to the flat pick play (whether out of back field or Spiller lined up in slot) the other was a super Heavy set By NO of T-G-C-G-T-T-TE-TE. there were 5 plays run from this and the gains were always over 10 yards.

On the 4th quarter TD drive, Mo stopped cooks on a 3rd and 3 with a great coverage and tackle for 2 yards. 4th and 1....the RB flare play for 9. It was academic because they called Mo for illegal hands for some reason

In summary, none of these are shocking, but it boiled down to:

• missed opportunities and penalties
• lack of consistent pressure late
• bad communication after Lee went out from LBs.
• Church and Carr - if I have to be blunt with a specific player
• Lack of adjustment on 2 plays that the Saints went to over and over. Very rarely was the defense just outmatched..more outschemed

For NE, it is concerning that Dallas cant quickly adjust to defend a certain play. This would harken back to the Indy-NE game last year where NE found a play and ran it ad nauseum.

B Jones has to be on Gronk, if he fails -he fails, but Gronk will get 200 yards or more on Church. The pressure has to be more consistent. Anytime there was pressure Bress had an
Incompletion. Have to get brady on the move.

Wilson has some speed to cover the flat, they have to work on that or NE is going to run Dion lewis out there all day.


You can view the notes y play here if interested.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zkwJwfngQ99BpJ7vW1Y48i6lGsbUJtedfnD0A3yXq2g/edit?usp=sharing

Great writeup, enjoyed that !!!

 

[Bullflop]

Yes, he played 24 snaps on defense which was 33% of the snaps.

It'd be great if he turned out to be someone we got on the cheap and turned out to be a solid player. It's not really impossible to get lucky every now and then. Perhaps I'm getting ahead of myself a bit by suggesting as much but anything this guy can contribute would be coming at just the right time for us. If nothing else, he might at least prove to be worth keeping around to develop further.

 

[xwalker]

It'd be great if he turned out to be someone we got on the cheap and turned out to be a solid player. It's not really impossible to get lucky every now and then. Perhaps I'm getting ahead of myself a bit by suggesting as much but anything this guy can contribute would be coming at just the right time for us. If nothing else, he might at least prove to be worth keeping around to develop further.

Getting 24 snaps from a player that was on another team's practice squad the week before is quite amazing. He was impressive in the game.