Brady or Belicheat?

[Captain43Crash]

Thats true... but Brady went and won it all with the FIRST COACH he ended up with after BB. I think that says it all.

What fact are you debating? You really want to challenge that Tampa was 7-9 before Brady arrived? Or do you want to challenge that 7-9 is a mediocre record? Either would be laughable to challenge, but go ahead smart guy.

Mr. “Facts”, you said Brady went to a mediocre team.

Wrong! Brady went to a team with an above average offense and and an excellent defense with an outstanding Defensive Coordinator. There was NOTHING mediocre about Tampa Bay when Brady joined them. That Tampa Bay defense dominated Rogers and Mahomes in the playoffs, while Brady drove the offensive bus.

 

[Captain43Crash]

Wow. You really put some research into every excuse in the book. You must be a cowboy fan of the Jerrah generation.

I'll end my participation in this thread with a simple quote from Bill Parcels. " You are what your record says you are". 7-9 is 7-9 no matter the excuses.

Of course your record is what your record says you are, but some teams are better, or worse, than their record says they are.

I’ll explain it for you: The Niners went 6-10 last year, but they are much better than last years record says they are. They had a bunch of injuries last year, so even though their record says they were 6-10, they are projected as the 8th best team in the recent NFL Power Rankings.

Tampa Bay was much better than a 7-9 team when Brady joined them, and he knew it!

You may leave the thread now.

 

[Ghost12]

Read up on cause and effect; you might learn something.

Now now... no need to be so pissy just because I have facts on my side....

The Patriots have been on a down hill slide as regards talent for several years.

Newsflash: The Patriots won the Super Bowl in Brady's 2nd to last year there, so please spare me the idea that there was some tremendous loss of talent for several years - unless you want to admit that Brady is so phenomenal that he overcame a tremendous loss of talent.

While the Bucs were going up.

In the 4 years before Brady got there, TB went from 9 wins to 5 wins to 5 wins to 7 wins. Someone phenomenally ignorant of football might say they were "going up" when the bottom line is they simply sucked.

For those of us who rely on facts:
NE went from 12-5 to 7-9 after losing Brady
TB went from 7-9 to Super Bowl Champions after getting Brady

Those are the facts, which trumps empty speculation 100% of the time.

 

[Ghost12]

Of course your record is what your record says you are, but some teams are better, or worse, than their record says they are.

I’ll explain it for you: The Niners went 6-10 last year, but they are much better than last years record says they are. They had a bunch of injuries last year, so even though their record says they were 6-10, they are projected as the 8th best team in the recent NFL Power Rankings.

LOL! NFL power rankings aren't worth the paper they are written on. It is nothing more than some jabroni's opinion.

 

[Captain43Crash]

LOL! NFL power rankings aren't worth the paper they are written on. It is nothing more than some jabroni's opinion.

Even if you think the NFL power rankings are a joke my point still stands, some teams are better than their records say they are due to injuries etc.
You don’t understand this?

I thought you were leaving this thread, LOL?

 

[Captain43Crash]

Now now... no need to be so pissy just because I have facts on my side....
Newsflash: The Patriots won the Super Bowl in Brady's 2nd to last year there, so please spare me the idea that there was some tremendous loss of talent for several years - unless you want to admit that Brady is so phenomenal that he overcame a tremendous loss of talent.
In the 4 years before Brady got there, TB went from 9 wins to 5 wins to 5 wins to 7 wins. Someone phenomenally ignorant of football might say they were "going up" when the bottom line is they simply sucked.

For those of us who rely on facts:
NE went from 12-5 to 7-9 after losing Brady
TB went from 7-9 to Super Bowl Champions after getting Brady

Those are the facts, which trumps empty speculation 100% of the time.

 

[John813]

Wow. You really put some research into every excuse in the book. You must be a cowboy fan of the Jerrah generation.

I'll end my participation in this thread with a simple quote from Bill Parcels. " You are what your record says you are". 7-9 is 7-9 no matter the excuses.

LOL.

 

[Pape]

If i've learned anything over the years its that Bill doesn't suffer players he doesn't think can compete. Nobody churns the roster more. So, obviously, the Pats have a higher opinion of him than you do.

I'm sure they do. They must because they brought him back. If it were up to me? I would have gone a different route...

My opinion of Cam is he's a great guy, his teammates love him, a guy who works hard, and who just happens to be a lousy quarterback.

BB churns the roster, for sure. However, if you work hard, BB will keep you around. Cam is committed, and works hard. Who knows maybe he is all healed up from his injuries, and this year will be better. Tom House happens to think a lot of his issues were due to a foot injury. Maybe he's right.

What I do know is I won't believe it until I see it. Last year was too much like the "Almost had it" meme fishing guy for me... Hard to watch at some points.

 

[kskboys]

I'm sure they do. They must because they brought him back. If it were up to me? I would have gone a different route...

My opinion of Cam is he's a great guy, his teammates love him, a guy who works hard, and who just happens to be a lousy quarterback.

BB churns the roster, for sure. However, if you work hard, BB will keep you around. Cam is committed, and works hard. Who knows maybe he is all healed up from his injuries, and this year will be better. Tom House happens to think a lot of his issues were due to a foot injury. Maybe he's right.

What I do know is I won't believe it until I see it. Last year was too much like the "Almost had it" meme fishing guy for me... Hard to watch at some points.

At his salary, Cam would make a nice backup.

 

[Pape]

At his salary, Cam would make a nice backup.

I preferred last years salary.... unfortunately, until he's unseated, hes our guy!


its like going from a aston martin vanquish to a ford focus

 

[Turk]

Now now... no need to be so pissy just because I have facts on my side....
Newsflash: The Patriots won the Super Bowl in Brady's 2nd to last year there, so please spare me the idea that there was some tremendous loss of talent for several years - unless you want to admit that Brady is so phenomenal that he overcame a tremendous loss of talent.
In the 4 years before Brady got there, TB went from 9 wins to 5 wins to 5 wins to 7 wins. Someone phenomenally ignorant of football might say they were "going up" when the bottom line is they simply sucked.

For those of us who rely on facts:
NE went from 12-5 to 7-9 after losing Brady
TB went from 7-9 to Super Bowl Champions after getting Brady

Those are the facts, which trumps empty speculation 100% of the time.

Your facts read like graffiti on a toilet stall wall

 

[Ghost12]

Even if you think the NFL power rankings are a joke my point still stands, some teams are better than their records say they are due to injuries etc.
You don’t understand this?

To set aside team records and say "Team A is better than Team B" is nothing more than an opinion, and opinions vary tremendously among the fandom. Sure there are times when I would say a team was better than their records says they are, but there's no guarantee you (or anyone else) would agree with that opinion. For example, right now there's some idiot in this forum telling me the Patriots were on a "downhill slide for several years" even though they won the Super Bowl in Brady's 2nd-to-last season with the team. I mean, how do you respond to that level of idiocy?

That's why opinions are beyond worthless. You don't understand this?

I thought you were leaving this thread, LOL?

You thought wrong. Where the f did I ever say that? I enjoy torturing people like you with facts too much LOL

 

[Turk]

To set aside team records and say "Team A is better than Team B" is nothing more than an opinion, and opinions vary tremendously among the fandom. Sure there are times when I would say a team was better than their records says they are, but there's no guarantee you (or anyone else) would agree with that opinion. For example, right now there's some idiot in this forum telling me the Patriots were on a "downhill slide for several years" even though they won the Super Bowl in Brady's 2nd-to-last season with the team. I mean, how do you respond to that level of idiocy?

That's why opinions are beyond worthless. You don't understand this?

You thought wrong. Where the f did I ever say that? I enjoy torturing people like you with facts too much LOL

Your facts are nothing at all.

Anyone claiming opinion as fact is a complete moron.

 

[Turk]

Here is a fact for the Brady Knob Jobbers:
How many picks did he throw in the AFC Championship Game?

 

[Ghost12]

Your facts are nothing at all.

Anyone claiming opinion as fact is a complete moron.

You obviously skipped school in 1st grade the day they taught the difference between "fact" and "opinion". There is no opinion in any of the following.

For those of us who rely on facts:
NE went from 5-13 to Super Bowl Champs once Brady took over as starter
NE went from 12-5 to 7-9 after losing Brady
TB went from 7-9 to Super Bowl Champions after getting Brady
Belichick is career 11 games under .500 (with 1 playoff win in 8 years) without Tom Brady

Those are the facts, which trumps empty speculation 100% of the time.

 

[Ghost12]

Here is a fact for the Brady Knob Jobbers:
How many picks did he throw in the AFC Championship Game?

LOL!! Which one? I mean, he's been to 13 of 'em....

Think about it: Tom Brady makes the CCG 74% of the time he plays. BB makes it 0% of the time he coaches without Brady.

Just the facts, ma'am.

 

[Turk]

LOL!! Which one? I mean, he's been to 13 of 'em....

Think about it: Tom Brady makes the CCG 74% of the time he plays. BB makes it 0% of the time he coaches without Brady.

Just the facts, ma'am.

Your facts are like used toilet paper; worthless and they stink.

 

[JJHLH1]

Former players and analysts agree that Brady > Belichick.

 

[DandyDon52]

Almost Every all time head coach who had sustained success in the nfl did so because he had an all time QB.

Vince Lombardi won all of his NFL championships with Bart Starr, none without. What did Bill Walsh win without Joe Montana? Chuck Knoll without Terry Bradshaw? Tom Landry was regular season successful after Staubach, but he didn’t exactly have a hall of fame career without him.

The guys who don’t get enough credit for never having all time QBs are Parcells and Gibbs. Both win during SF’s heyday, and Parcells went on to turn around 4 different franchises... all without even a HoF QB. Ironically they’re not viewed as highly as the other list, and it’s quite possibly because they never had that spotlight QB to prop up their reputation.

So the question is: is Joe Montana nothing without Walsh? Wouldn’t he have at least won 1, maybe even 2 rings without him? Remember he won 1 with George Seifert just as Troy won one with Switzer. Yes they’re the teams those coaches built, but they didn’t literally have to be there to coach them. Belichick is not a offensive coach; Brady would have likely been Brady without Belichick. But would Belichick have been Belichick without Brady? Bill Belichick has now been head coach for 8 seasons where he did not have Tom Brady starting 10+ games for him. He missed the playoffs in 7 of those seasons.

It’s entirely possible Bill Belichick is ringless if he never found Tom Brady. It is not possible Tom Brady has no hardware by 42 in any scenario. So yeah, Brady

yeah I go with Brady.
BB was 6-14 at NE with bledsoe, then Tom got the starting job, and the team turned a losing , then .500 season into a winning season
and a trip to SB which they won.
Bill won his first SB with Tom lol they both won their first at same time.
Now Brady goes to tampa, and they march straight to SB, and BB doesnt even make playoffs lol, so it is quite obvious who is more valuable.

 

[DandyDon52]

Last year I'm sure sealed the deal for some but I think I'll wait it out to see how this year plays out.

The Bucs were a good team with a terrible QB in Winston. Going from Winston to Brady was the final piece.
Years of high draft picks, with some success and a trio of receivers and TEs was the perfect landing spot for Brady.

The Pats had a handful of opt outs and one offseason to "replace" Brady. It wasn't like it was the same team minus Brady. And having to settle for Cam broken Newton stifled the offense.

I would take Bill over Brady cause Bill would instill a football atmosphere in valley Ranch not seen since Bill Parcells and would mean Jerry took a backseat in football operations to a certain degree.

Well this question isnt about the cowboys or jerry lol and valley ranch is no more!

It is if you were a owner.....
Jerry probably never had any interest in either one, he made no effort to get brady to come here recently, probably thought tom was washed up
or just not that good without BB.
jerry has MMM (i added mighty to front ) and the worlds best stats QB in Dak , so jerry wasnt interested in either of these guys.
I mean when you have the Mighty Mike McCarthy, and Stats Prescott, that is pretty much all you need.