Dak’s improved deep ball is way more important than any play call change

[kskboys]

I'd like to take this opportunity to lay claim that both, an improved long ball and better play calling, are equally important!
They both stand a good chance of fortifying our offense somewhat considerably. But hey, that's just me! (Or is it, really?)

I have to disagree since I believe Dak's long ball is fine.

 

[Bullflop]

I have to disagree since I believe Dak's long ball is fine.

There's room to disagree and plenty of room to await improvement, if one is so disposed.

Don't object if the latter is to be granted. There's likely a reason why it's being worked on.

 

[TwoDeep3]

False. Aikmans weakness was the deep ball and look what he did. Also, some of those missed plays last year were due to bad route running especially by Gallup. Disguising the offense so the defense has to hesitate is much much more important.

You need to do a sign-up for The Athletic and see if they have a test run for you so you can decide if you want to pay for a year subscription.

Then go in to the archives and find Bob Sturm's article and Dak and Gallup. He broke down every miss by that pair and why.

 

[Rockport]

You need to do a sign-up for The Athletic and see if they have a test run for you so you can decide if you want to pay for a year subscription.

Then go in to the archives and find Bob Sturm's article and Dak and Gallup. He broke down every miss by that pair and why.

Naw, I know a good QB when I see one.

 

[percyhoward]

Based on playoff performances, Bigben is way way better.

We're talking last five years, remember. The numbers I posted included postseason, but here's postseason only:

Rbrgr 64.8% 2106 yd 10 td 7 int 7.8 ypa 90.1
Brees 67.5% 1220 yd 9 td 5 int 8.1 ypa 98.1

 

[CowboyRoy]

Play calling doesn’t fix olawale and Beasley dropping TDs or gallup being all by himself vs saints and ball hitting a fan.

By the end of the season everything is about execution. Weeks 1-8 Moore May look like a genius but weeks 9-playoffs once teams have learned all the new wrinkles it’s about execution of those plays

Correct. Moore may be able to fool them in the first few round, but the good DC's will catch on. Can he continue the adjustments and can he continue to counter and adjust. Some pre snap motion alone isn't going to win us a title.

 

[CowboyRoy]

There's room to disagree and plenty of room to await improvement, if one is so disposed.

Don't object if the latter is to be granted. There's likely a reason why it's being worked on.

They work on handoffs too.

 

[Bullflop]

They work on handoffs too.

Yep, they do but this might be a bit trickier. I'm hoping it helps!

 

[CowboyRoy]

Yep, they do but this may be a bit trickier. Here's hoping it helps!

So now you believe that Dak can actually improve at something?

I think you have turned a corner.

 

[Bullflop]

So now your believe that Dak can actually improve at something?

I think you have turned a corner.

There's no corner -- Dak's always been one to improve. I see no difference now.

 

[kskboys]

We're talking last five years, remember. The numbers I posted included postseason, but here's postseason only:

Rbrgr 64.8% 2106 yd 10 td 7 int 7.8 ypa 90.1
Brees 67.5% 1220 yd 9 td 5 int 8.1 ypa 98.1

You're ranking strictly by numbers. I'm not.

 

[kskboys]

There's room to disagree and plenty of room to await improvement, if one is so disposed.

Don't object if the latter is to be granted. There's likely a reason why it's being worked on.

That's not what I'm disagreeing w/. Playcalling is simply ultra ultra important. You're claiming Dak improving a bit on his long throws has the same importance as moving from inept playcalling to quality playcalling(Hopefully). I don't think it's even in the same conversation.

 

[Bullflop]

That's not what I'm disagreeing w/. Playcalling is simply ultra ultra important. You're claiming Dak improving a bit on his long throws has the same importance as moving from inept playcalling to quality playcalling(Hopefully). I don't think it's even in the same conversation.

Let's not minimize how often accurate long balls will get you TDs, which will win games! Play calling and bombs have great value.

 

[McKDaddy]

get the ball out on time & accurately will keep the offense in rythm & ahead of the chains. Making the defense pay with chunk plays is gravy on top. It looks good but it rests on being able to threaten every blade of grass from the line of scrimmage to the deep intermediate. Do that and you will find that everything becomes much easier.

 

[kskboys]

Let's not minimize how often accurate long balls will get you TDs, which will win games! Play calling and bombs have great value.

Let's not minimize the importance of having a saavy football mind at OC who can scheme people open and keep the opposing D on their heels.

Did you see what Belly did to the vaunted Rams O? That's the effect a coordinator can have.

 

[Bullflop]

Let's not minimize the importance of having a saavy football mind at OC who can scheme people open and keep the opposing D on their heels.

Did you see what Belly did to the vaunted Rams O? That's the effect a coordinator can have.

Something tells me that you're intent upon carrying this debate into an inordinate amount of BS before this eventually ends. Not every team has a Bill Belly and I doubt we do as yet. Endless repetition will only bore other members into moving on to other threads. We've both made our points now, imho, ok?

 

[percyhoward]

You're ranking strictly by numbers. I'm not.

Brees has been the better QB over the last five years. Going strictly by the numbers, he's been the best passer in the league, and Ben isn't even top 5.

That's why, if you put Ben ahead of Brees, you'll need to explain why the numbers are misleading. For example, you could say Luck would have Ryan's numbers if Julio was a Colt etc. Then it's actually debatable, because you'd have tried to make a case.

It's one thing to simply state an opinion, and another thing to support it.

 

[kskboys]

Something tells me that you're intent upon carrying this debate into an inordinate amount of BS before this eventually ends. Not every team has a Bill Belly and I doubt we do as yet. Endless repetition will only bore other members into moving on to other threads. We've both made our points now, imho, ok?

Yeah, I do grow weary of the truckloads of BS you are spewing.

 

[kskboys]

Brees has been the better QB over the last five years. Going strictly by the numbers, he's been the best passer in the league, and Ben isn't even top 5.

That's why, if you put Ben ahead of Brees, you'll need to explain why the numbers are misleading. For example, you could say Luck would have Ryan's numbers if Julio was a Colt etc. Then it's actually debatable, because you'd have tried to make a case.

It's one thing to simply state an opinion, and another thing to support it.

Ok. It's very weak to base a QB analysis strictly on numbers. Brees consistently fails in the playoffs against better D's. He's purely a numbers guy.

It's one thing to defend and opinion, but another thing to have no support but numbers that are easily disputed. And it's very weak to discard other people's arguments because you don't like them. I had really thought a discussion might be happening, but all you're interested in doing is repeating yourself w/ nothing but some numbers. And those are so easy to refute. Brees has better numbers than Brady, so you're now claiming he's better than Brady, right?

You like Brees better. I accept that. I like Ben better. Why is that so hard for you to accept?

 

[kskboys]

Brees has been the better QB over the last five years. Going strictly by the numbers, he's been the best passer in the league, and Ben isn't even top 5.

That's why, if you put Ben ahead of Brees, you'll need to explain why the numbers are misleading. For example, you could say Luck would have Ryan's numbers if Julio was a Colt etc. Then it's actually debatable, because you'd have tried to make a case.

It's one thing to simply state an opinion, and another thing to support it.

Ratings for both for the last 5 years:

2018: 2. Brees 5. Rothy
2017: 2. Rothy 3. Brees
2016: 3. Rothy 5. Brees
2015: 3. Rothy 5. Brees
2014: 5. Rothy 6. Brees

Yes, I'm fully aware that everyone has different rating services that they believe in. This is mine. It's from Lindy's. Some of these years, Pocket Passers were separated from Mobile Qb's. That's why you see them rated so highly in some years.

Until this last season, most rating services I saw had Rothy over Brees, for the reasons I previously mentioned.

BTW, I consider these two Qb's to be very close. Brees is much more consistent, but Ben is more clutch and has an amazing ability to extend plays.