News: Darren Woodson: Jason Witten greatest tight end ever

[BoysFan4ever]

Jason is not only one of the best ever NFL TE's but one of the best Cowboys ever.

He's a great guy as well. Abusive childhood & has done wonderful OTF charity work with kids like himself.

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

With fantasy football and gambling now a days its hard for people to see why anybody would consider Jason Witten the greatest of all time. Blocking, while still be a great Receiving TE is rare. Usually you have a TE that specializes in one of those areas. When you look at the whole body of work Blocking and Receiving i think its hard to argue that he is not the greatest of all time. I think Woody nailed it on the head and I do not understand how or why Cowboys fan do not start a buzz about Witten being the greatest of all time.

Not even the greatest cowboy TE: In mein book it be Billy Joe Dupree. Being Romo's boy friend half helped Witten immensity.

 

[joseephuss]

Dallas back then ran about 55-60% of the time then threw to Michael Irvin when they passed it a large majority of the time. I'm not sure Witten would have great numbers if he played back then in that offense. Novacek isn't as good as Witten I agree. I would like to have seen Novacek in an offense more like the ones today that do use TEs more though. His YPC and TD's per catch numbers are pretty much the same as Witten's. Novacek probably averaged 2 or 3 targets per game if that.

There is a significant different between averaging 11.14 yards per reception(Witten) and 10.97 yards per reception(Novacek). Jay also only averaged 10.55 yards per reception while in Dallas.

Jay averaged 2.67 receptions per game in his entire career and 3.57 receptions per game during his time in Dallas. It is safe to assume he was targeted more than just 2 or 3 times per game during his career.

 

[joseephuss]

Not even the greatest cowboy TE: In mein book it be Billy Joe Dupree. Being Romo's boy friend half helped Witten immensity.

Then how do you explain his big year with Testaverde as the QB?

 

[skinsscalper]

Sharpe wasn't even that big. He was 6'-2" and 225 lbs. He was too slow to play wide receiver, so he got moved to tight end. Kellen Winslow was 6'-5" and 240 lbs to 250 lbs. He was a big guy who could and did stretch the field. I don't think Sharpe revolutionized anything.

Winslow was the first to do what Sharpe did. No doubt about it. But it wasn't until Sharpe that teams actually started drafting "that guy". Winslow was also one of those guys that got a oof balls thrown to him from Fouts because he was the most dangerous receiving threat on the field for the Chargers at that time. Sharpe had some pretty damn good WRs on his teams and he still put up the numbers.

Good call on Winslow, though. Dude was a freakin' beast. Too bad his son wasn't even a fraction of such. Too busy portraying a thug life and reppin' his street cred to actually put in the work. Kid had all this skills to make it happen, he was just a HOF idiot.

 

[Crown Royal]

Then how do you explain his big year with Testaverde as the QB?

He also played well in 2005 with Drew Bledsoe and caught a lot of tds from Jon Kitna in 2010.

Just because he's played a ton of games with Romo doesn't mean that Romo has 'made' him.

 

[NoLuv4Jerry]

I generally have avoided these threads because I cannot understand how a team that has none won anything in what seems like "forever" would spend times on debates like this. I cannot tell you how often on this forum I have read that we had the "best WR corps" in the NFL...the "best lbers in the NFL" the "best OL in the NFL" on the heels of season where the results suggest we were AVERAGE.

Jason Witten. Great player. Potential HOFer. But I cannot even consider "greatest to have ever done it" when discussing someone that has never played in a Super Bowl....heck someone who has never played in a conference championship game. This does not diminish his accomplishments. But there are way too many people that have "accomplishments" AND actually competed for and/or won a championship for Jason to surpass them.

Also....only in Dallas do players like Romo and Witten retain the kind of tenure they do without sniffing a championship. Teams eventually MOVE on. And does not mean said players can't play...but at some point...it's about winning....and if you have not won...then whatever you are doing is not working. The only QB I can think of with as many starts with the same team without coming close to winning is Phillip Rivers. And even he played in a conference title game. And I am not sure if there is another player in the NFL...that has had as many starts as Jason has had...with the same team...and has not come close to winning. That does not mean these guys are not great players. But it does mean that you will inevitably pile up numbers if you are as talented as both of these guys are....AND you are afforded the tenure they have been afforded.

So they can both strengthen their case by winning. Romo just might sneak into the HOF if he can win a title and produce at a high level for 3 more years. Jason will eventually get in the HOF if he puts up consistent numbers for a couple more years....but again....both are great players that need to win and/or compete in a championship to make it a moot point.

But they have been on too many teams that produced mediocre results to ever be considered the "greatest at their position"

And for the record...I felt the same thing about Demarcus Ware. At some point...WINING must factor in. Ware was another "great" player.....and he piled up a lot of stats. But the results were mediocre. Last year....in the playoffs against Green Bay...in the 4th quarter....I think Aaron Rodgers did not throw an incompletion. It is on that type of stage where the "greatest" players make a play to decide the game. I know Ware was not on the team last year...but had he been on the team...and he sacked Aaron Rodgers during the tear he was on in the 4th quarter...that would be the type of signature play the goes down in Cowboys history. And when you combine a signature play....in a signature moment....with all the "stats"...that is symbolic of "one of the greatest"

 

[Seven]

Jason is not only one of the best ever NFL TE's but one of the best Cowboys ever.

He's a great guy as well. Abusive childhood & has done wonderful OTF charity work with kids like himself.

Spill it!

 

[BoysFan4ever]

Spill it!

His father was abusive. Jason's mother left him with her children & took them to her dad's I believe.

I don't think Jason has much of a relationship with his dad to this day.,

 

[joseephuss]

I generally have avoided these threads because I cannot understand how a team that has none won anything in what seems like "forever" would spend times on debates like this. I cannot tell you how often on this forum I have read that we had the "best WR corps" in the NFL...the "best lbers in the NFL" the "best OL in the NFL" on the heels of season where the results suggest we were AVERAGE.

Jason Witten. Great player. Potential HOFer. But I cannot even consider "greatest to have ever done it" when discussing someone that has never played in a Super Bowl....heck someone who has never played in a conference championship game. This does not diminish his accomplishments. But there are way too many people that have "accomplishments" AND actually competed for and/or won a championship for Jason to surpass them.

Also....only in Dallas do players like Romo and Witten retain the kind of tenure they do without sniffing a championship. Teams eventually MOVE on. And does not mean said players can't play...but at some point...it's about winning....and if you have not won...then whatever you are doing is not working. The only QB I can think of with as many starts with the same team without coming close to winning is Phillip Rivers. And even he played in a conference title game. And I am not sure if there is another player in the NFL...that has had as many starts as Jason has had...with the same team...and has not come close to winning. That does not mean these guys are not great players. But it does mean that you will inevitably pile up numbers if you are as talented as both of these guys are....AND you are afforded the tenure they have been afforded.

So they can both strengthen their case by winning. Romo just might sneak into the HOF if he can win a title and produce at a high level for 3 more years. Jason will eventually get in the HOF if he puts up consistent numbers for a couple more years....but again....both are great players that need to win and/or compete in a championship to make it a moot point.

But they have been on too many teams that produced mediocre results to ever be considered the "greatest at their position"

And for the record...I felt the same thing about Demarcus Ware. At some point...WINING must factor in. Ware was another "great" player.....and he piled up a lot of stats. But the results were mediocre. Last year....in the playoffs against Green Bay...in the 4th quarter....I think Aaron Rodgers did not throw an incompletion. It is on that type of stage where the "greatest" players make a play to decide the game. I know Ware was not on the team last year...but had he been on the team...and he sacked Aaron Rodgers during the tear he was on in the 4th quarter...that would be the type of signature play the goes down in Cowboys history. And when you combine a signature play....in a signature moment....with all the "stats"...that is symbolic of "one of the greatest"

Ozzie Newsome, Kellen Winslow, Tony Gonzales and Antonio Gates have never played in a Superbowl.

 

[RS12]

His father was abusive. Jason's mother left him with her children & took them to her dad's I believe.

I don't think Jason has much of a relationship with his dad to this day.,

There was a piece on Witten and his family life growing up yesterday ESPN 60 right after the segment on camp ended around 6PM PST. Probably on youtube already. Had interviews with both parents and grand father.

 

[NoLuv4Jerry]

Ozzie Newsome, Kellen Winslow, Tony Gonzales and Antonio Gates have never played in a Superbowl.

Have any at least played in a conference championship game? So far witten has 2 playoff wins in over 10 seasons....not enough to be considered the best ever

 

[big dog cowboy]

Have any at least played in a conference championship game? So far witten has 2 playoff wins in over 10 seasons....not enough to be considered the best ever

The super bowl bar was to high so it gets lowered to conference championship games now? I doubt each resume of the HOF fraternity includes a laundry list of playoff wins. The have been a ton of great players in this league that never had a ton of post season success. Most don't consider Witten the best ever right now. When his career is over it may be a different story. But playoff wins will be down the list of criteria to be considered best ever.

 

[NoLuv4Jerry]

The super bowl bar was to high so it gets lowered to conference championship games now? I doubt each resume of the HOF fraternity includes a laundry list of playoff wins. The have been a ton of great players in this league that never had a ton of post season success. Most don't consider Witten the best ever right now. When his career is over it may be a different story. But playoff wins will be down the list of criteria to be considered best ever.

No....it was in my ORIGINAL post. The person that responded added Super Bowl as the criteria. Romo, Witten great player(s).....but too many medicore results for me to be considered the greatest to ever play the position. That is just how I see it.

But as I have said in many posts. Jerry had to do SOMETHING to keep people engaged when were not relevant....and promoting players piling up stats or handing out the #88 to the Antonio Bryants of the world is marketing genius of Jerry. But the team is finally built correctly. And the football team is being run like a TRUE football operation. And I definitely hope Witten and Romo get a chance to compete for a Super Bowl right here in Dallas before they hang it up. I think they deserve it. And like I said...they have both been afforded an opportunity not many players get. Can't think of any current players in the NFL with the kind of tenure that have had with one team without having much playoff success. Phillip Rivers comes to mind...but even he went to the AFC title game. But they have been great players....and they have been model citizens off the field. So that goes a long way in the decision to keep them together. So I will focus on trying to win...and the spoils associated with WINNING will come.

 

[BoysFan4ever]

There was a piece on Witten and his family life growing up yesterday ESPN 60 right after the segment on camp ended around 6PM PST. Probably on youtube already. Had interviews with both parents and grand father.

Really? I read an interview he did on his childhood.,he's very open about how he grew up & how it has shaped him into the man he is now.

You gotta love Jason!'

 

[NickZepp]

Have any at least played in a conference championship game? So far witten has 2 playoff wins in over 10 seasons....not enough to be considered the best ever

Gonzalez was in at least one NFC Championship game. Maybe one other with the Chiefs in the early 00s. Newsome was in a few in the 80s.

 

[BoysFan4ever]

I don't care how many playoff games he's been in. Really?

This is all you need to know about Jason...he's repped the Star as well as any Dallas player ever has.

 

[joseephuss]

Gonzalez was in at least one NFC Championship game. Maybe one other with the Chiefs in the early 00s. Newsome was in a few in the 80s.

He never played in an AFC championship game. Gonzales has one career playoff win on his resume.

 

[joseephuss]

Have any at least played in a conference championship game? So far witten has 2 playoff wins in over 10 seasons....not enough to be considered the best ever

None of those guys I mentioned had great post season success in terms of total playoff wins. They like Wittenberg are great individual players in the ultimate team sport.

 

[perrykemp]

Ditka

• 10× Pro Bowl (2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2014)

• 2× First-team All-Pro (2007, 2010)

• 2× Second-team All-Pro (2008, 2012

and talk about an Iron Man of the NFL he has never missed a game

As it relates to being called the best TE of all time, the '2 x First-team All-Pro' is actually a big minus.

First team All-Pros are considered one of major factors for HOF voting. I am not suggesting Witten isn't HOF worthy because he absolutely is, however, Witten being 1st team All-Pro only twice in a 12 year career indicates he has rarely been considered the best TE in the league in the vast majority of the years he has played.

If a player is to be considered the best player every at your position, I'd suggest that a player like that would typically be a near unanimous choice as <the> best player at his position on a consistent year to year basis. Think Jerry Rice at WR, Deion Sanders at CB, etc etc.

If I had to compare Witten to another HOFer it would be someone like Art Monk who ended up as the time leader in receptions and yards for a WR, however, was 1st team All-Pro just 1 time. He ended up as the all time leader in receptions and yards and in the HOF because he was consistently good and it, in many ways, was an award for longevity as much as anything else.

As much I much Witten, I wonder if he falls more into the Art Monk category of greatness as opposed to the 'greatest TE in the history of the NFL' category.