Defensive Passer Rating will once again doom this team

[Corso]

This thread got so much more interesting!

Well done, friends! Well done!



JTerrell got the rare triple-like from me!

Good show!

 

[KJJ]

It takes more than one player to be able to create havoc up front. Or are you one of those ... FANS.... that think you can take 3 random SFA's, put them next to a all pro/pro bowler DLineman and suddenly you have the next Doomsday defense?

I'm one of those fans who thinks this defense wasn't going to be any good had it stayed completely healthy. Even with Ware putting up 19.5 sacks and Spencer producing 6 sacks along with Hatchers 4.5 sacks in 2011 the defense couldn't prevent Eli Manning from putting up 746 yards and 5 TD's in the final month of the season in games that had the Cowboys season riding on them. Even when the Cowboys create some havoc upfront they don't have corners that can cover consistently. Sean Lee has more int's since 2010 than any cornerback the Cowboys have. He has 11 career int's and his return average is 22.0 maybe they should play him at cornerback. LOL Brandon Carr has been a starting CB since 08 and has only 3 more int's than Lee.

 

[DanteEXT]

Even in the games Ware's played he hasn't been the force he's been. The injuries coupled with his age have made him less effective he's on the decline. Claiborne is always missing time he came to the Cowboys as a rookie missing time with an injury. He's been injury prone and even when healthy hasn't lived up to his top 10 draft status. If the Cowboys had a do over do you honestly believe they would still take Claiborne? One great player up front can create some havoc. You're not going to find a SFA who's going to create much which is why they're on the street.

Even when the defense was able to wreck some havoc up front they struggled in big games. When Ware produced 19.5 sacks in 2011 along with Spencer's 6 sacks and Hatchers 4.5 but the defense couldn't make stops when it got down to crunch time. It's the same problem every season on defense but at least this season despite all the injuries the defense is coming up with turnovers and defensive scores. The only way the current defense can stop anyone is with takeaways. The defensive struggles got Ryan fired last season and may doom Kiffin.

No, Ware has not been as much of a force. He's had moments. But he's also lining up with Hayden and Selvie, not Ratliff and Spencer. BIG difference. And one great player can be neutralized if that's all you got.

I don't know what the Cowboys would do with a do over. And unless you actually work for the team, neither do you. They may or may not evaluate Claiborne's work the same as you or I.

 

[jobberone]

As long as Witten is here Escobar will never start unless Witten gets hurt. If he doesn't produce by the time his contract is up he'll be gone just like Fasano and MartyB. Escobar could end up being a very productive TE but it's unlikely to happen in Dallas playing behind Jason Witten.

Well you only answered it tangentially and definitely not the look up part that defines the problem but you're right about limited snaps. However, you have to have someone to catch passes at TE just in case Witten is out. I recognize that isn't often but it has happened and becomes more of a possibility as Witten gets older. And you have to develop players. It appears you think the higher picks have to come in right away and play a lot of snaps and that's generally not the case. Also you are forgetting that preseason i.e. draft time we thought OL was a much bigger problem that DL which was considered a strength pre-decimation. With small rosters you can have a strength become a weakness quickly. LB and CB weren't considered big needs either by many.

They have had success in the spread shotgun so much they aren't using a traditional 12 or 13 as much. They are playing more jumbo or strong packages than putting 2 or 3 TEs in on those obvious running downs. Sometimes you have two TEs and other times the TE is flanked and there are heavies inline often unbalanced.

 

[KJJ]

No, Ware has not been as much of a force. He's had moments. But he's also lining up with Hayden and Selvie, not Ratliff and Spencer. BIG difference. And one great player can be neutralized if that's all you got.

I don't know what the Cowboys would do with a do over. And unless you actually work for the team, neither do you. They may or may not evaluate Claiborne's work the same as you or I.

Until Lee showed up Ware was the only great player on the defense. Although he was the Cowboys most dominant player opponents were having trouble neutralizing him and his double digit sack totals year after year back that up. Even before Ratliff was injured he was struggling with double teams. Opponents figured out a way to neutralize him due to his lack of size at NT. Even before Spencer arrived in 07 and Ratliff established himself as a solid player Ware was making a huge impact.

Ware put up 8 sacks his rookie year making the transition from a DE to OLB. He put up 19 sacks his first 2 seasons while learning a new position. As for Claiborne the Cowboys would LOVE a do over with that pick. I'm basing it on his play, lack of durability and Stephen Jones calling him out earlier in the season. It's clear the Cowboys are frustrated with him. No way would they touch him with a top 10 pick that cost them an extra pick to move up for him.

 

[KJJ]

Well you only answered it tangentially and definitely not the look up part that defines the problem but you're right about limited snaps. However, you have to have someone to catch passes at TE just in case Witten is out. I recognize that isn't often but it has happened and becomes more of a possibility as Witten gets older. And you have to develop players. It appears you think the higher picks have to come in right away and play a lot of snaps and that's generally not the case. Also you are forgetting that preseason i.e. draft time we thought OL was a much bigger problem that DL which was considered a strength pre-decimation. With small rosters you can have a strength become a weakness quickly. LB and CB weren't considered big needs either by many.

They have had success in the spread shotgun so much they aren't using a traditional 12 or 13 as much. They are playing more jumbo or strong packages than putting 2 or 3 TEs in on those obvious running downs. Sometimes you have two TEs and other times the TE is flanked and there are heavies inline often unbalanced.

The Cowboys have James Hanna who showed some potential catching passes in limited action last season. He had a 29 yard catch last season while catching 8 passes. This season he has 6 more catches and only 3 fewer receiving yards than Escobar. If the Cowboys wanted to draft a TE to develop they could have used a lower pick instead of using a #2 pick for a player to compliment a solid starter at the position who's only 31. In 08 they used a #1 pick on Felix Jones to compliment Barber who was their starter and it didn't workout real well because Felix never got enough opportunity his first 3 seasons.

When you're an 8-8 team that keeps missing the playoffs you need to use your premium picks and players who have a chance to step in as rookies and be productive. The Cowboys used a #3 on Williams and he's already lived up to his draft status and then some. He's made a real impact this season but has had the opportunity because Austin misses games every season. The Williams pick made sense because Austin can't stay healthy and the Cowboys are clearly looking to replace him.

 

[DanteEXT]

Until Lee showed up Ware was the only great player on the defense. Although he was the Cowboys most dominant player opponents were having trouble neutralizing him and his double digit sack totals year after year back that up. Even before Ratliff was injured he was struggling with double teams. Opponents figured out a way to neutralize him due to his lack of size at NT. Even before Spencer arrived in 07 and Ratliff established himself as a solid player Ware was making a huge impact.

Ware put up 8 sacks his rookie year making the transition from a DE to OLB. He put up 19 sacks his first 2 seasons while learning a new position. As for Claiborne the Cowboys would LOVE a do over with that pick. I'm basing it on his play, lack of durability and Stephen Jones calling him out earlier in the season. It's clear the Cowboys are frustrated with him. No way would they touch him with a top 10 pick that cost them an extra pick to move up for him.

Ware had Greg Ellis before Spencer, not like no one else was on the team. Teams doubling Ratliff to neutralize him helped Ware make plays. Spencer too. And everyone else.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

The Cowboys have James Hanna who showed some potential catching passes in limited action last season. He had a 29 yard catch last season while catching 8 passes. This season he has 6 more catches and only 3 fewer receiving yards than Escobar. If the Cowboys wanted to draft a TE to develop they could have used a lower pick instead of using a #2 pick for a player to compliment a solid starter at the position who's only 31. In 08 they used a #1 pick on Felix Jones to compliment Barber who was their starter and it didn't workout real well because Felix never got enough opportunity his first 3 seasons.

When you're an 8-8 team that keeps missing the playoffs you need to use your premium picks and players who have a chance to step in as rookies and be productive. The Cowboys used a #3 on Williams and he's already lived up to his draft status and then some. He's made a real impact this season but has had the opportunity because Austin misses games every season. The Williams pick made sense because Austin can't stay healthy and the Cowboys are clearly looking to replace him.

I get that, but who were they going to select at #47 who was going to contribute heavily as a rookie and be productive (positively)?

There were no offensive lineman taken from Escobar to Warford at #65. I like Warford but he wasn't even on the Cowboys board.

The next offensive line was Winters a few spots later and he's been awful this season (ranked 70th out of all the guards).

What about defensive linemen?

You've got Johnathan Hawkins who was selected at #49.

You've got Margus Hunt who was selected at #53.

And you've got Bennie Logan at #67.

Hawkins has participated in 112 snaps so far this season and has 0 sacks and 8 tackles.

Hunt has participated in 112 snaps so far this season and has 0 sacks and 1 tackle.

Bennie Logan has participated in 341 snaps and has 3 sacks and 15 tackles.

Are any of those guys knocking anyone's socks off?

It's easy to say, "Well Dallas should have taken so & so at the spot they took Escobar." But the reality is at least when it comes to offensive and defensive linemen the pickings were pretty slim.

 

[KJJ]

I get that, but who were they going to select at #47 who was going to contribute heavily as a rookie and be productive (positively)?

There were no offensive lineman taken from Escobar to Warford at #65. I like Warford but he wasn't even on the Cowboys board.

The next offensive line was Winters a few spots later and he's been awful this season (ranked 70th out of all the guards).

What about defensive linemen?

You've got Johnathan Hawkins who was selected at #49.

You've got Margus Hunt who was selected at #53.

And you've got Bennie Logan at #67.

Hawkins has participated in 112 snaps so far this season and has 0 sacks and 8 tackles.

Hunt has participated in 112 snaps so far this season and has 0 sacks and 1 tackle.

Bennie Logan has participated in 341 snaps and has 3 sacks and 15 tackles.

Are any of those guys knocking anyone's socks off?

It's easy to say, "Well Dallas should have taken so & so at the spot they took Escobar." But the reality is at least when it comes to offensive and defensive linemen the pickings were pretty slim.

The Cowboys could have picked a player at a position other than TE who could have done more than Escobar has so far. The TE the Cowboys drafted in the 6th round in 2012 James Hanna has more catches than Escobar this season. Most didn't like the Frederick pick but the Cowboys had a real need and he's performed well because he's been given an opportunity to start. Had some other team drafted Frederick who didn't have the need that the Cowboys had he could be backing someone up right now. Had someone drafted Escobar who didn't have a Jason Witten and was looking for a starting TE he might be having a productive rookie season right now. As for Bennie Logan he was taken in the 3rd round and at least he's contributing with some sacks the Cowboys could have used him.

The Cowboys could have taken Eddie Lacy who's put up 822 yards and 6 TD's for the Packers. He would have been better than Randle who we took in the 5th and he may end up a better back than Murray. You can't look at the players that were drafted after Escobar and say what have they done because they might not be getting a great opportunity at the moment but they might have gotten that opportunity with the Cowboys due to all the injuries. The same goes for Escobar he might be producing for another team but with Witten here he's going to face the same problem producing that MartyB did with the Cowboys. He's looking pretty good now because he's getting the chance.

 

[KJJ]

Ware had Greg Ellis before Spencer, not like no one else was on the team. Teams doubling Ratliff to neutralize him helped Ware make plays. Spencer too. And everyone else.

If Ellis was anything great the Cowboys wouldn't have given up 3 picks to move back in the first round to take Spencer in 07. Ellis was in his 8th year when Ware arrived and was more of a situational pass rusher at that time. He only played 9 games in 06 and Ware still had 11 sacks 3 of which came in week 17. Ware was going to produce no matter who was around him he was a force. It took Spencer 3 years to get going he only had 4.5 sacks his first 2 seasons.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

The Cowboys could have picked a player at a position other than TE who could have done more than Escobar has so far. The TE the Cowboys drafted in the 6th round in 2012 James Hanna has more catches than Escobar this season. Most didn't like the Frederick pick but the Cowboys had a real need and he's performed well because he's been given an opportunity to start. Had some other team drafted Frederick who didn't have the need that the Cowboys had he could be backing someone up right now. Had someone drafted Escobar who didn't have a Jason Witten and was looking for a starting TE he might be having a productive rookie season right now. As for Bennie Logan he was taken in the 3rd round and at least he's contributing with some sacks the Cowboys could have used him.

The Cowboys could have taken Eddie Lacy who's put up 822 yards and 6 TD's for the Packers. He would have been better than Randle who we took in the 5th and he may end up a better back than Murray. You can't look at the players that were drafted after Escobar and say what have they done because they might not be getting a great opportunity at the moment but they might have gotten that opportunity with the Cowboys due to all the injuries. The same goes for Escobar he might be producing for another team but with Witten here he's going to face the same problem producing that MartyB did with the Cowboys. He's looking pretty good now because he's getting the chance.

Bennie Logan hasn't been very good given the amount of snaps.

And as loud as Cowboy fans howled about the Escobar pick can you imagine the screams we would have heard if they had chosen a RB in that round?

 

[DanteEXT]

If Ellis was anything great the Cowboys wouldn't have given up 3 picks to move back in the first round to take Spencer in 07. Ellis was in his 8th year when Ware arrived and was more of a situational pass rusher at that time. He only played 9 games in 06 and Ware still had 11 sacks 3 of which came in week 17. Ware was going to produce no matter who was around him he was a force. It took Spencer 3 years to get going he only had 4.5 sacks his first 2 seasons.

For one, Ellis was coming back from an Achilles surgery (hence the 9 games in '06). The Cowboys not only were providing insurance in case Ellis failed to return but also were drafting his eventual replacement. Ellis was a going into his 10th season in 2007. He was an aging yet still effective player and the Cowboys were planning for the future. And this is a bad thing?

Two, according to nfl.com, Ellis started all but 3 games in his career. And those came in 2007 when coming back from injury. Coincidentally, a 12.5 sack season in 13 games with 10 starts. I don't believe Ellis falls into the situational pass rusher category.

Three, it didn't take Spencer 3 years to get going. He was the apprentice, Ellis was the master so to speak. He had 4.5 sacks in his first 2 years because he was a situational player while Ellis was the starter. Not that hard to figure out.

 

[KJJ]

Bennie Logan hasn't been very good given the amount of snaps.

And as loud as Cowboy fans howled about the Escobar pick can you imagine the screams we would have heard if they had chosen a RB in that round?

Logan is a rookie DT who has 3 sacks after 12 games it took Jason Hatcher 6 seasons to reach 3 sacks in a season. Hatcher is currently leading the Cowboys with 9 sacks so I would say Logan is off to a pretty good start for a player drafted in the 3rd round. The fact he's being given a lot of snaps says he must be doing a pretty good job. Had the Cowboys used their #2 on Lacy the fan base wouldn't have been in an uproar over it. He was the top rated RB in the draft and the Cowboys had a need at the position with Felix Jones not coming back and Murray having injury issues.

The running game has been a problem and a lot of fans have soured on Murray who may not see a second contract with the Cowboys due to his lack of durability. Lacy who's a big back that can pick up the tough yards would have been a great pick. He would have seen plenty of action this season with Murray once again missing games with an injury. The Cowboys could have gone in another direction at #5 instead of taking Randle who's only averaging 2.5 a carry this season.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Logan is a rookie DT who has 3 sacks after 12 games it took Jason Hatcher 6 seasons to reach 3 sacks in a season. Hatcher is currently leading the Cowboys with 9 sacks so I would say Logan is off to a pretty good start for a player drafted in the 3rd round. The fact he's being given a lot of snaps says he must be doing a pretty good job. Had the Cowboys used their #2 on Lacy the fan base wouldn't have been in an uproar over it. He was the top rated RB in the draft and the Cowboys had a need at the position with Felix Jones not coming back and Murray having injury issues.

The running game has been a problem and a lot of fans have soured on Murray who may not see a second contract with the Cowboys due to his lack of durability. Lacy who's a big back that can pick up the tough yards would have been a great pick. He would have seen plenty of action this season with Murray once again missing games with an injury. The Cowboys could have gone in another direction at #5 instead of taking Randle who's only averaging 2.5 a carry this season.

Logan is more of a "stay at home" DT... As a matter of fact the last 3 games he's been playing NT... So there ya go– he's not a good match for this scheme.

If you don't think the Cowboy fan base would have spun a nut over drafting a RB in the 2nd round... Well...

 

[KJJ]

For one, Ellis was coming back from an Achilles surgery (hence the 9 games in '06). The Cowboys not only were providing insurance in case Ellis failed to return but also were drafting his eventual replacement. Ellis was a going into his 10th season in 2007. He was an aging yet still effective player and the Cowboys were planning for the future. And this is a bad thing?

Two, according to nfl.com, Ellis started all but 3 games in his career. And those came in 2007 when coming back from injury. Coincidentally, a 12.5 sack season in 13 games with 10 starts. I don't believe Ellis falls into the situational pass rusher category.

Three, it didn't take Spencer 3 years to get going. He was the apprentice, Ellis was the master so to speak. He had 4.5 sacks in his first 2 years because he was a situational player while Ellis was the starter. Not that hard to figure out.

Ellis was an aging disgruntled player who the Cowboys were looking to replace with Spencer sooner rather than later. Most thought Spencer would overtake Ellis by at least his second season but that wasn't the case. Spencer was clearly slow to come along he only had 6 starts his first 2 seasons and 4.5 sacks. A lot more was expected of him than that those first 2 seasons especially with the price the Cowboys paid to move back into the first round to select him. According to NFL.com Ellis had 13 starts in 05. He had 9 starts in only 9 games played in 06 due to his injury. He had 10 starts in only 13 games played in 07 and started all 16 games his final year in Dallas in 08. Both Ellis and Spencer were splitting time in 07 and 08 because Spencer couldn't beat Ellis out who was still productive. The Cowboys finally had it with Ellis who wasn't a happy camper and turned the reigns over to Spencer in 09. Spencer really didn't impress until the final few weeks of the 09 season where he played great. Some felt he even outplayed Ware the final month of the season.

He appeared to finally turn the corner and become the player the Cowboys hoped for but in 2010 he regressed and although he's been a pretty solid player he's never been good enough for the Cowboys to reward him with a long-term contract. They like him but it's clear they're not in love with him so they keep franchising him rather than committing to him long-term. After this season he'll be gone no way will the Cowboys commit to him long-term now after missing virtually the entire 2013 season with an injury. He simply can't be counted on and who knows where his game will be next season.

 

[DanteEXT]

Ellis was an aging disgruntled player who the Cowboys were looking to replace with Spencer sooner rather than later. Most thought Spencer would overtake Ellis by at least his second season but that wasn't the case. Spencer was clearly slow to come along he only had 6 starts his first 2 seasons and 4.5 sacks. A lot more was expected of him than that those first 2 seasons especially with the price the Cowboys paid to move back into the first round to select him. According to NFL.com Ellis had 13 starts in 05. He had 9 starts in only 9 games played in 06 due to his injury. He had 10 starts in only 13 games played in 07 and started all 16 games his final year in Dallas in 08. Both Ellis and Spencer were splitting time in 07 and 08 because Spencer couldn't beat Ellis out who was still productive. The Cowboys finally had it with Ellis who wasn't a happy camper and turned the reigns over to Spencer in 09. Spencer really didn't impress until the final few weeks of the 09 season where he played great. Some felt he even outplayed Ware the final month of the season.

He appeared to finally turn the corner and become the player the Cowboys hoped for but in 2010 he regressed and although he's been a pretty solid player he's never been good enough for the Cowboys to reward him with a long-term contract. They like him but it's clear they're not in love with him so they keep franchising him rather than committing to him long-term. After this season he'll be gone no way will the Cowboys commit to him long-term now after missing virtually the entire 2013 season with an injury. He simply can't be counted on and who knows where his game will be next season.

My apologies, after scanning up from 98 looking at 16/16, 13/13/, 16/16, 16/16, 15/15, 16/16 and 16/16 I must have glazed over that 16/13 in '05.

Ellis may have been disgruntled but he played as hard as anyone on this team. But if you want to diminish his contributions to this franchise to make yourself feel better, go right ahead. Doesn't make you right.

I'm done.

 

[KJJ]

Logan is more of a "stay at home" DT... As a matter of fact the last 3 games he's been playing NT... So there ya go– he's not a good match for this scheme.

If you don't think the Cowboy fan base would have spun a nut over drafting a RB in the 2nd round... Well...

With all the injuries the Cowboys have had upfront they would have found a way to use Logan within the scheme. When you have a rash of injuries you sometimes have to adjust with a player who may not be best suited for a scheme but you have to find a way. You can't predict who's going to go down along your OL or DL during a season which can force you to have to plug a player in and make the best of it. If you look at a player like Selvie he only had 3 sacks in his first 4 years with 3 different teams and he currently has 6 sacks this season. Teams find ways to use players they need within the frame work of their defense. Most players have some versatility and can adjust. Teams draft players who played one position and play them at another position because they have a need at that position.

Had the Cowboys taken Lacy no way would that pick have had everyone standing on a ledge. All we do here is complain about our running game and with Felix gone and Murray missing games every year with injuries selecting the top rated back in the 2nd round would have been a pick that made a lot of sense. It's not like you're taking a player to backup or compliment a HOF caliber player who's still playing at a high level. Fans have been souring on Murray who's missed games every season. Having a solid replacement who could help him carry the load would have helped a lot more than a TE who's only caught 5 passes for 70 yards and a TD. Lacy is on pace to have over 1000 yards this season and it's not like he's playing behind a great OL. The Packers lost Bulaga prior to the season and with Rodgers out that's put more pressure on their running game that had been non existent until Lacy came along.

The Packers top rusher last season only produced 464 yards. Lacy has had three 100 yard games this season including 150 yards vs Chicago without Aaron Rodgers at QB. He had a 56 yard run for a TD in that game. He put up 120 yards on Baltimore. In the 11 games that Lacy has played he has 822 rushing yards which is only 75 yards short of Murray's career best in 2011. Lacy also has 24 catches out of the backfield. Be completely honest if you could swap Escobar for Lacy would you do it? Murray may not be here after his contract and the Cowboys are going to be looking for a back. I would make that swap in a heartbeat!

 

[KJJ]

My apologies, after scanning up from 98 looking at 16/16, 13/13/, 16/16, 16/16, 15/15, 16/16 and 16/16 I must have glazed over that 16/13 in '05.

Ellis may have been disgruntled but he played as hard as anyone on this team. But if you want to diminish his contributions to this franchise to make yourself feel better, go right ahead. Doesn't make you right.

I'm done.

I'm not trying to diminish Elli's contributions he was a solid player but never a great player and he certainly didn't make any of us feel better about passing on Randy Moss. He played hard but was clearly unhappy his last few seasons in Dallas which isn't a healthy situation to have on your team. He knew the Cowboys were trying to replace him with Spencer and he wanted out. The point I'm trying to make is that no matter who Ware had around him he was going to make plays and get sacks. He's special!

The Cowboys entered this season with injury issues on their DL but that didn't stop Ware from having 4 sacks in the first 3 games because he was healthy. If he wasn't being hampered by injuries he would have a lot more than 5 sacks right now. His lack of production this season has nothing to do with the players he has around him it has to do with him not being 100%.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

With all the injuries the Cowboys have had upfront they would have found a way to use Logan within the scheme. When you have a rash of injuries you sometimes have to adjust with a player who may not be best suited for a scheme but you have to find a way. You can't predict who's going to go down along your OL or DL during a season which can force you to have to plug a player in and make the best of it. If you look at a player like Selvie he only had 3 sacks in his first 4 years with 3 different teams and he currently has 6 sacks this season. Teams find ways to use players they need within the frame work of their defense. Most players have some versatility and can adjust. Teams draft players who played one position and play them at another position because they have a need at that position.

Had the Cowboys taken Lacy no way would that pick have had everyone standing on a ledge. All we do here is complain about our running game and with Felix gone and Murray missing games every year with injuries selecting the top rated back in the 2nd round would have been a pick that made a lot of sense. It's not like you're taking a player to backup or compliment a HOF caliber player who's still playing at a high level. Fans have been souring on Murray who's missed games every season. Having a solid replacement who could help him carry the load would have helped a lot more than a TE who's only caught 5 passes for 70 yards and a TD. Lacy is on pace to have over 1000 yards this season and it's not like he's playing behind a great OL. The Packers lost Bulaga prior to the season and with Rodgers out that's put more pressure on their running game that had been non existent until Lacy came along.

The Packers top rusher last season only produced 464 yards. Lacy has had three 100 yard games this season including 150 yards vs Chicago without Aaron Rodgers at QB. He had a 56 yard run for a TD in that game. He put up 120 yards on Baltimore. In the 11 games that Lacy has played he has 822 rushing yards which is only 75 yards short of Murray's career best in 2011. Lacy also has 24 catches out of the backfield. Be completely honest if you could swap Escobar for Lacy would you do it? Murray may not be here after his contract and the Cowboys are going to be looking for a back. I would make that swap in a heartbeat!

Would I take Lacy over Escobar at this very moment?

You bet!

But the career of any player can't be boiled down to the 14th week of their rookie season.

And I still wouldn't have selected a RB in the second round.

 

[KJJ]

Would I take Lacy over Escobar at this very moment?

You bet!

But the career of any player can't be boiled down to the 14th week of their rookie season.

And I still wouldn't have selected a RB in the second round.

If you would take Lacy at this very moment over Escobar why not back in April when he was the top rated back and a higher rated player than Escobar? How could the top rated RB not be a better choice than a pass receiving TE in the Cowboys offense? The Cowboys can throw the ball but they struggle to run it. Did you expect the Cowboys to take a TE with their #2 pick? There's a lot things we knew back in April that we know at this very moment. We knew back in April the Cowboys had a big issue with their running game and most of us predicted Murray would miss games in 2013 due to injuries. We all knew the Cowboys would be looking for a back to replace Felix and one who could step in for Murray when he got injured. I have posts on the board immediately after the draft saying Escobar wasn't going to be very productive playing with Witten.

I certainly wasn't going out on a limb Witten has only missed one game due to injury his entire career so Escobar wasn't going to get many opportunities in the passing game. I could have told you back in April that Lacy would be productive spelling Murray and taking over for him when he got injured which I knew was inevitable. Most thought prior to the season that Hanna would be more productive than Escobar in 2013 seeing he showed some potential in 2012 and had one season under his belt. Most of us knew the running game was still going to be an issue in 2013 so Lacy would have been an excellent choice in the second round and the Cowboys could have moved down 13 spots to get him.