Discord in Commander Land!!!

[jksmith269]

Anyone else get the feeling this isn't about Lavars ability but a message being sent to him and the whole team because Lavar sued them, and to an extent won?


The LaVar Arrington-Washington Commanders saga disintegrated into a game of he said-they said yesterday at Commander Park.
Before practice, Arrington -- who played about 15 snaps in the Commanders' first three games before seeing no action at Denver -- maintained that he is befuddled by his lack of playing time.
What he said: "There are so many different things that I've heard, I don't know which one to pinpoint. Somebody knows the truth. I don't happen to be that [someone] and I don't know for sure what I suspect."
What the Commanders said: Following practice, coach Joe Gibbs took umbrage with Arrington's implication there has been a lack of communication.
"The comment I heard today was something about LaVar saying nobody has talked to him," Gibbs said. "I've talked to LaVar more than any player I've coached in 30 years, probably three times as much. I've had great conversations with him and have told him exactly what he needs to do.
"Our coaching staff has tons of experience and I believe they play the best guys. At whatever point LaVar is the best person to be in there, I'm convinced he'll be in there."
The Denver game was the first time in Arrington's career that he was on the active roster but did not play.
Arrington admitted he has "lowered my expectations" regarding any bump in playing time, starting with the Commanders' game Sunday at Kansas City.
"If it changes, I'll be ready," he said. "Anytime you know in your heart and your gut that you can help and then see the guys you train with and get close with out there fighting and you're not, you hate it."
Arrington hit many of the same talking points he did in his weekly radio appearance on Tuesday. He took issue with comments made recently by Cincinnati coach Marvin Lewis, the Commanders' defensive coordinator in 2002, who said Arrington drove him batty with his freelancing.
"For Marvin to say I drove him crazy and didn't know the schemes, I did lead all linebackers in the National Football League with 11 sacks that season," he said.
Arrington added, "I'm hungry to make a play and sometimes, I may overrun the play but who doesn't do that? Last time I checked, people make mistakes."

 

[Aikmaniac]

Is he that bad now that he isn't even playing? What's the deal?

 

[followthestar]

old-school coaches (the ones who win usually) understand football is a team game, and players - no matter their talent - won't play unless they understand that. lavar has more talent than his replacement i'm sure, but until he buys into the team concept, i think he'll continue to ride the pine as often as he plays. just another example of the lack of chemistry among the Commanders - and the reason they won't finish with a winning record regardless of their talent level...

 

[jksmith269]

Is he that bad now that he isn't even playing? What's the deal?

Like I said I think its because he challenged them and won. If he hadn't sued them I think he'd be playing. I also think its their little boss telling Joe not to play him. No way does a player go to 4 straight PB's and then just start to suck without being old.

 

[Doomsday101]

According to reports I have seen Arrington does too much free lancing on the field and tends to vacate areas he is responsible for because he is trying to make plays on his own. Which goes back to this is a team sports and you can't have players doing their own thing

 

[Eddie]

The Skins are forking themselves. He's going to count $12 mil against their cap next season if he's cut.

He has several million in roster bonus' coming up. The team is going to have to be nice to him. He's the one with the power at this point ... unless the team plans to eat the $12 mil.

Let's go Skins!!

 

[Danny White]

The next step, from what I hear, is that he may soon be deactivated on gamedays. IF it gets to that, then obviously they'd have to move him in the offseason.

It's a bizarre story around here. The Commanders sure aren't telling the whole story, and you get the idea that Arrington knows a lot more than he's letting on.

The funniest thing for a Commander-hater like me, though, is that it's revealed yet another example of how disingenous and forked-tongued "good guy" Joe Gibbs is. From his flip-flopping on Ramsey to the Arrington situation, it's gotten to the point that you can't trust a word that comes out of Gibbs' mouth.

He really parses and shades the truth constantly, and you can tell that it's a source of consternation for those who have covered the team for a long time.

 

[Doomsday101]

The next step, from what I hear, is that he may soon be deactivated on gamedays. IF it gets to that, then obviously they'd have to move him in the offseason.

It's a bizarre story around here. The Commanders sure aren't telling the whole story, and you get the idea that Arrington knows a lot more than he's letting on.

The funniest thing for a Commander-hater like me, though, is that it's revealed yet another example of how disingenous and forked-tongued "good guy" Joe Gibbs is. From his flip-flopping on Ramsey to the Arrington situation, it's gotten to the point that you can't trust a word that comes out of Gibbs' mouth.

He really parses and shades the truth constantly, and you can tell that it's a source of consternation for those who have covered the team for a long time.

I think Gibbs like any other coach makes changes, the ideal that because a coach say 1 thing early in training camp and does something different later on is not lying it is making change for the betterment of the team. I would much rather a coach change his mind on a bad player than to stick with him at the cost of the team. I know Gibbs told Ramsey it was his team but Ramsy did nothing to keep the job and it would have been foolish for Gibbs to stick with him just because he so called promised Ramsey the job.

 

[joseephuss]

Like I said I think its because he challenged them and won. If he hadn't sued them I think he'd be playing. I also think its their little boss telling Joe not to play him. No way does a player go to 4 straight PB's and then just start to suck without being old.

But he could start to suck due to injury. I have heard a few media guys say that his injuries really have had an affect on him. Add that to what you are saying and what is being said about him not playing within the schemes, that becomes a bad combination of things.

 

[1fisher]

The next step, from what I hear, is that he may soon be deactivated on gamedays. IF it gets to that, then obviously they'd have to move him in the offseason.

It's a bizarre story around here. The Commanders sure aren't telling the whole story, and you get the idea that Arrington knows a lot more than he's letting on.

The funniest thing for a Commander-hater like me, though, is that it's revealed yet another example of how disingenous and forked-tongued "good guy" Joe Gibbs is. From his flip-flopping on Ramsey to the Arrington situation, it's gotten to the point that you can't trust a word that comes out of Gibbs' mouth.

He really parses and shades the truth constantly, and you can tell that it's a source of consternation for those who have covered the team for a long time.

Here's what I think.............. That's one of the funniest sig lines I've ever seen...... Bill looks hilarious!!!

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Unfortunately for us though, Gibbs handling of this situation is correct and despite the sniping has significantly improved the Skins. They are much better defensively without him because they now play team defense and not the individual, free-lance defense that Arrington is known for.

No question one way or another he will be moved in the off-season, although the salary cap hit makes it difficult. I wonder if he could be traded for another high-priced disgruntled athlete in the same division? Hmm...

AdamJT13, what do you have to say about the salary cap implications of moving Arrington?

 

[Danny White]

I think Gibbs like any other coach makes changes, the ideal that because a coach say 1 thing early in training camp and does something different later on is not lying it is making change for the betterment of the team. I would much rather a coach change his mind on a bad player than to stick with him at the cost of the team. I know Gibbs told Ramsey it was his team but Ramsy did nothing to keep the job and it would have been foolish for Gibbs to stick with him just because he so called promised Ramsey the job.

It's tough to describe, Dooms, just how fake Gibbs sounds in his press conferences unless you hear them for yourself. Anytime there is any controversy or bad news, he just basically lies about it or avoids the truth... and it's so obvious, even the home town homer media personalities can tell he's not being honest.

It's strange.

I didn't live in this area during his first go-around, but I had seen and met him several times prior to his new gig, and I had a tremendous amount of respect for the guy. But now listening to him as coach, I really think the guy's a phony.

And while his actions regarding Arrington may be correct, his words are phony as can be, IMO.

 

[TruBlueCowboy]

Well this just blows. Only a great coach like Gibbs would have the stones to do something like this. The other guys before him would have rolled over. Gibbs is simply cleaning house, fellas. Commanders fans got so used to mediocrity, they weren't ready for guys like Ramsey and Arrington to be benched. We had the same issues. We once thought players like Joey Galloway or Chad Hutchinson would stay a while but Parcells quickly reversed our thinking. Arrington is one of those guys that just didn't get it. There is no lawsuit conspiracy, Gibbs and Williams want a disciplined defense, and they won't let any player be above the coach.

 

[Doomsday101]

It's tough to describe, Dooms, just how fake Gibbs sounds in his press conferences unless you hear them for yourself. Anytime there is any controversy or bad news, he just basically lies about it or avoids the truth... and it's so obvious, even the home town homer media personalities can tell he's not being honest.

It's strange.

I didn't live in this area during his first go-around, but I had seen and met him several times prior to his new gig, and I had a tremendous amount of respect for the guy. But now listening to him as coach, I really think the guy's a phony.

And while his actions regarding Arrington may be correct, his words are phony as can be, IMO.

Coaches are not looking for honesty awards they say lots of things and end up changing their minds. I don't look at that is lying, it is his job to win games and no matter what promise he may have made to a particular player if they are not doing the job then the coach is going to move in another direction. Gibbs has his team at 3-1 and if I was a skin fan that is all that should matter. One thing I really believe and that is Joe Gibbs is a damn fine coach and unless Danny boy messes this up Gibbs will get his team back to a competitive level. And I say as a fan of the Cowboys not that of a skins fan.

 

[playit12]

Coaches are not looking for honesty awards they say lots of things and end up changing their minds. I don't look at that is lying, it is his job to win games and no matter what promise he may have made to a particular player if they are not doing the job then the coach is going to move in another direction. Gibbs has his team at 3-1 and if I was a skin fan that is all that should matter. One thing I really believe and that is Joe Gibbs is a damn fine coach and unless Danny boy messes this up Gibbs will get his team back to a competitive level. And I say as a fan of the Cowboys not that of a skins fan.

only thing that seems to have been proven thus far is that Greg Williams is a good coach. He drastically improved Buffalo's D and then came to Washington and did the same thing with the same style. Go beyond the D and this is not a good team. I don't have anything positive to say about the offense, and that seems to be where Gibbs has made his biggest marks.

Could any coach really have done worse on Offense than Gibbs? Because I think any improvement there and the Skins would have been a playoff team last year and this year.

By the way I do think the D is overated. They absolutely can not force turnovers, which as I recall, has a stronger coorelation to winning than any other stat (Time of Possesion, third down coversions, Red Zone scoring, ext..).

 

[Doomsday101]

only thing that seems to have been proven thus far is that Greg Williams is a good coach. He drastically improved Buffalo's D and then came to Washington and did the same thing with the same style. Go beyond the D and this is not a good team. I don't have anything positive to say about the offense, and that seems to be where Gibbs has made his biggest marks.

Could any coach really have done worse on Offense than Gibbs? Because I think any improvement there and the Skins would have been a playoff team last year and this year.

By the way I do think the D is overated. They absolutely can not force turnovers, which as I recall, has a stronger coorelation to winning than any other stat (Time of Possesion, third down coversions, Red Zone scoring, ext..).

As Head Coach he is responsible for all phases of the team and also Gibbs is having to change this offense from what Spurrier put together. Turning a team around still takes some time but I'll never under-estimate coaches like Gibbs or Parcells. I don't let my dislike of the Skins cloud my mind when it comes to viewing their HC.

 

[SkinsandTerps]

Like I said I think its because he challenged them and won. If he hadn't sued them I think he'd be playing. I also think its their little boss telling Joe not to play him. No way does a player go to 4 straight PB's and then just start to suck without being old.

First off, LaVar hasnt been to 4 probowls.
Second, Probowls are really BS.
Third, The Commanders would have won the case had it not been dropped. The Commanders made amends to satisfy a player that they felt could contribute at some point and is viewed as a fan favorite with incredible talent and upside.
Fourth, who said he sucked ? I for one have always felt that LaVar can hurt on a drive as much as he can help end one. He is inconsistent.

LaVar doesn't play disciplined football. Marvin Lewis said that he was one of the hardest players to coach, Joe Pa said that LaVar was the third best LB on that team, Gibbs has said that he has spoken to LaVar more than any other player in his 30 years of coaching, and that LaVar clearly knows what needs to be done for him to get on the field.

The Commanders run a very disciplined D that was proven successful without LaVar and Bailey last season, and without Smoot, and Pierce this season. With a rookie CB this season, with a rookie S last season. It is a system. If LaVar cant embrace the system then he wont play.

Unfortunately even with all of his talent, LaVar doesn't get it.

 

[Eskimo]

The Skins are forking themselves. He's going to count $12 mil against their cap next season if he's cut.

He has several million in roster bonus' coming up. The team is going to have to be nice to him. He's the one with the power at this point ... unless the team plans to eat the $12 mil.

Let's go Skins!!

They'll probably do a post-June 1st cut and then the hit will be only his pro-rated salary bonus in 2006 with the remainder of the hit taken in 2007.

 

[THUMPER]

"For Marvin to say I drove him crazy and didn't know the schemes, I did lead all linebackers in the National Football League with 11 sacks that season," he said.
Arrington added, "I'm hungry to make a play and sometimes, I may overrun the play but who doesn't do that? Last time I checked, people make mistakes."

I wonder how many big plays he gave up that season because he was out of position. I'd be willing to bet it was more than 11.

Coaches don't bench playmakers unless the cost is too high to keep them on the field.

 

[jksmith269]

First off, LaVar hasnt been to 4 probowls.
Second, Probowls are really BS.
Third, The Commanders would have won the case had it not been dropped. The Commanders made amends to satisfy a player that they felt could contribute at some point and is viewed as a fan favorite with incredible talent and upside.
Fourth, who said he sucked ? I for one have always felt that LaVar can hurt on a drive as much as he can help end one. He is inconsistent.

LaVar doesn't play disciplined football. Marvin Lewis said that he was one of the hardest players to coach, Joe Pa said that LaVar was the third best LB on that team, Gibbs has said that he has spoken to LaVar more than any other player in his 30 years of coaching, and that LaVar clearly knows what needs to be done for him to get on the field.

The Commanders run a very disciplined D that was proven successful without LaVar and Bailey last season, and without Smoot, and Pierce this season. With a rookie CB this season, with a rookie S last season. It is a system. If LaVar cant embrace the system then he wont play.

Unfortunately even with all of his talent, LaVar doesn't get it.

Your right it was 3 straight PB's

The case wasn't dropped it was settled out of court with Lavar receiving the money in incentives that with him on the bench he will never be able to get. So I guess Dan Snyder gets his money one way or another in this case.