DMN Blog: KC's Jon McGraw, Demorrio Williams fined for hits/To defer or not to defer

[WoodysGirl]

KC's Jon McGraw, Demorrio Williams fined for hits
2:46 PM Fri, Oct 16, 2009 | Permalink | Yahoo! Buzz
Todd Archer/Reporter Bio | E-mail | News tips

He wasn't called for a penalty during the game but the NFL fined Kansas City safety Jon McGraw was fined $5,000 for a helmet hit on Tony Romo.

McGraw hit Romo in the second quarter after a throw to Sam Hurd.

Williams was fined $7,500 for a horse collar tackle tackle of wide receiver Miles Austin.

He was not penalized for the tackle during the game.


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To defer or not to defer
2:00 PM Fri, Oct 16, 2009 | Permalink | Yahoo! Buzz
Todd Archer/Reporter Bio | E-mail | News tips

Last year the NFL moved to the college rule on the opening kickoff as far as allowing teams to defer and Wade Phillips said he would defer every time if the Cowboys won the toss.

He started out that way. The Cowboys deferred the choice in the first five games in 2008, but they have since changed their philosophy. The Tampa Bay game a year ago started a new trend of winning the toss and taking the ball to start the game.

The last 10 times the Cowboys won the toss, including all five games this year, they have elected to receive.

Why the change?

"Well I have my own reasons," Phillips said. "I don't think I want to help anybody else. So I do it the way I do it because of my own reasons. But I don't think that's public. It's just the way we do it."

I understand secrecy in football from coaches, but I don't understand what's gained by not saying why he has changed his mind.

"Well, you're going to have to figure it out on your own because I think we do the right thing," Phillips said.

OK, so now I'm turning to you guys. What could be the reason? The Cowboys went 4-1 when they deferred after winning the toss. They are 7-3 when they win and receive and they are 1-5 when they lose the toss.



Comments (26) Leave comment | E-mail entry

 

[DatNguyen59]

I think it would be best to defer because we are known for our slow starts. We also come out of halftime fired up, so that could really help us to get the ball.

 

[big dog cowboy]

KC's Jon McGraw, Demorrio Williams fined for hits
2:46 PM Fri, Oct 16, 2009 | Permalink | Yahoo! Buzz
Todd Archer/Reporter Bio | E-mail | News tips

He wasn't called for a penalty during the game but the NFL fined Kansas City safety Jon McGraw was fined $5,000 for a helmet hit on Tony Romo.

McGraw hit Romo in the second quarter after a throw to Sam Hurd.

Williams was fined $7,500 for a horse collar tackle tackle of wide receiver Miles Austin.

He was not penalized for the tackle during the game.

Both penalities were obvious from where I was sitting. This was very frustrating given the fact Ball did not go helmet to helmet and got flagged. I was warned about this officiating crew before the game started. Now I wonder how they all still have jobs.

 

[theebs]

Both penalities were obvious from where I was sitting. This was very frustrating given the fact Ball did not go helmet to helmet and got flagged. I was warned about this officiating crew before the game started. Now I wonder how they all still have jobs.

I think taking the ball first is crazy and it is one of the things that drives me nuts.

The crowd in Dallas is fueled by offense not defense, yet we keep taking the ball and the crowd is all wild and loud while we have the ball, and then on the flipside of that the crowd is always returning to their seats and quiet to start the third when the visiting team keeps getting the ball.

Its insane, How could you not want to start on defense and have the ball to start the third. Especially in Dallas.

 

[WarDaddy]

I think taking the ball first is crazy and it is one of the things that drives me nuts.

The crowd in Dallas is fueled by offense not defense, yet we keep taking the ball and the crowd is all wild and loud while we have the ball, and then on the flipside of that the crowd is always returning to their seats and quiet to start the third when the visiting team keeps getting the ball.

Its insane, How could you not want to start on defense and have the ball to start the third. Especially in Dallas.

Exactly. I kept thinking, "Why in the hell do we keep losing the coin toss?"

I always figured a coach would want to start the second half with the ball. If you're leading you can add to the lead. If you're losing you can climb out of the hole. If it's tied at the half, you begin with the ball.

 

[Tusan_Homichi]

What about the other blow to the head Romo took? There was a gif of it on here a few days ago. That one bothered me more than the one the fine was handed out on.

Edit: This one

http://i846.***BLOCKED***/albums/ab23/SirHypnotoad/Cowboys/2009/Week05%20KC/GIF/05-12-Another-Helmet-to-QB-nocall.gif

 

[hendog]

What about the other blow to the head Romo took? There was a gif of it on here a few days ago. That one bothered me more than the one the fine was handed out on.

Edit: This one

http://i846.***BLOCKED***/albums/ab23/SirHypnotoad/Cowboys/2009/Week05%20KC/GIF/05-12-Another-Helmet-to-QB-nocall.gif

It's a wonder he got up from that hit.

 

[Kevinicus]

Both penalities were obvious from where I was sitting. This was very frustrating given the fact Ball did not go helmet to helmet and got flagged. I was warned about this officiating crew before the game started. Now I wonder how they all still have jobs.

Hehe, I remember before the game when they announced the referee crew just before the game I turned to my wife and commented on how bad he sucked, and we weren't going to get great officiating.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Coach Jerry wants to see Romo play first?

 

[Paniolo22]

It's ironic that both obvious penalties were not called, but were bad enough to be fined. Ref bias?

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I think taking the ball first is crazy and it is one of the things that drives me nuts.

The crowd in Dallas is fueled by offense not defense, yet we keep taking the ball and the crowd is all wild and loud while we have the ball, and then on the flipside of that the crowd is always returning to their seats and quiet to start the third when the visiting team keeps getting the ball.

Its insane, How could you not want to start on defense and have the ball to start the third. Especially in Dallas.

I understand both reasons of why you would defer and why you would not. You want to be the first to have points up. Now if we're talking Madden on 360? I always kick lol. But in the real game if you put the first points up it challenges your opponent and already puts their back against the wall. No one wants to go down by more than 7. Now for the Cowboys this rarely happens because they RARELY score 7 points on the opening drive. I like the Cowboys chances of winning if they start the game out 7-0.

But I can also see wanting to have your defense out there with their adrenaline pumping and feeding off the defense. I see both reasons but I prefer to put the 7 up first and have the opposing offense answer the challenge.

 

[Hostile]

OK, so now I'm turning to you guys. What could be the reason? The Cowboys went 4-1 when they deferred after winning the toss. They are 7-3 when they win and receive and they are 1-5 when they lose the toss.

First of all, we are 15-6 on the coin toss? That's pretty unreal.

Okay, it's fairly simple to figure out why the change. We are 5-6 when the other team gets the ball first. 7-3 when we get it first. I realize we were winning 4 of 5 when deferring, but overall it has been less effective. Meanwhile winning and receiving has been quite effective.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Four NFL Fines Came Out Of KC Game
Posted by nickeatman at 10/17/2009 1:50 PM CDT on truebluefanclub.com


[FONT=verdana,geneva]Talk about giving back. The NFL is definitely making a point to crack down on various penalties, regardless if they’re called the game or not. The league fined four different players – two from each team – after Sunday’s game against the Chiefs. However, only one of them were resulted in a penalty. [/FONT]

[FONT=verdana,geneva]Alan Ball was fined $5,000 for hitting a defenseless receiver in the head and he was called for a foul, that gave the Chiefs a first down instead of a punt. [/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,geneva][/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,geneva]Defensive tackle Igor Olshansky was fined $7,500 for an illegal clip. The Chiefs got some calls, too. Safety Jon McGraw should’ve been flagged for a helmet-to-helmet on Tony Romo around the goal line. The league fined him $5,000 and linebacker Demorrio Williams got a $7,500 fine for a horse collar tackle on Miles Austin. It sounded like the refs didn’t flag Williams for that play because the officials said Austin stepped out of bounds before running down the sideline. [/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,geneva][/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,geneva]Earlier this season, Flozell Adams has been fined for three separate incidents in the first three games and running back Felix Jones had to pay for a leg whip. [/FONT]

 

[Temo]

First of all, we are 15-6 on the coin toss? That's pretty unreal.

Okay, it's fairly simple to figure out why the change. We are 5-6 when the other team gets the ball first. 7-3 when we get it first. I realize we were winning 4 of 5 when deferring, but overall it has been less effective. Meanwhile winning and receiving has been quite effective.

Probability of winning 15 or more coin flips out of 21 is about 3.9%. Not too unreal, but definitely unlikely.

It's too small a sample size to say that deferring is better. It's as simple as figuring out what percent of teams who receive the ball to start a game go on to win, over a long period of time. I don't have that number, but I'm guessing it's pretty much 50%, making the deferring issue moot.

 

[Kevinicus]

First of all, we are 15-6 on the coin toss? That's pretty unreal.

Okay, it's fairly simple to figure out why the change. We are 5-6 when the other team gets the ball first. 7-3 when we get it first. I realize we were winning 4 of 5 when deferring, but overall it has been less effective. Meanwhile winning and receiving has been quite effective.

That's not necessarily true. It said we are 1-5 when the other team wins the toss, but made no mention of if those teams received or deferred in those situations.

In general, I prefer to defer every time, but especially if they're at home.

 

[AdamJT13]

It sounded like the refs didn’t flag Williams for that play because the officials said Austin stepped out of bounds before running down the sideline.

So it's OK to commit a personal foul after the runner steps out of bounds?

That makes no sense.

 

[Biggems]

I had a debate with my dad, and I was actually wrong for once.

His argument was that once the ref shows both sides....whatever side is on top when he is going to flip it, is the one you should call. he said 9 times out of 10 it will land on that side.

I tested this with a half dollar coin. I did 10 flips starting with tails and it landed on tails 8 times. I then started with heads and it landed on heads 7 times. I guess there was some serious validity to my dad's argument.

Normally I would just choose tails.....cause Tails never fails....but, now, based on my extensive research, if I were able to call the toss, I would choose the side that was showing pre-flip.

Once I won the toss, I determine receive or kick based on the following criteria (and this is pretty much set in stone before we go out to do the coin flip)

1. Home vs Road
2. Opponent record
3. Opponent offensive ranking
4. Opponent defensive ranking
5. Our health
6. Weather

More often than not, I would receive.....however, if we are playing an opponent with a poor offense, the weather is crappy, or other aspects seem to be in our favor, I would most likely defer.

 

[AdamJT13]

Romo's career rating in the first quarter: 69.2.

Romo's career rating in the third quarter: 102.8.

I would defer.

 

[dogunwo]

Romo's career rating in the first quarter: 69.2.

Romo's career rating in the third quarter: 102.8.

I would defer.

Great stat

 

[Hostile]

That's not necessarily true. It said we are 1-5 when the other team wins the toss, but made no mention of if those teams received or deferred in those situations.

In general, I prefer to defer every time, but especially if they're at home.

Follow me here. We've lost the flip 6 times. 1-5 in those games.

You with me?

We've won the flip and deferred 5 times. 4-1 in those games.

Still with me?

4 + 1 = 5 wins.
1 + 5 = 6 losses.

5-6 when we do not have the ball first.