DMN:The Power struggle of Wade Phillips and Jason Garrett

[Yoshimitsu]

I still think Garrett leaks this stuff about how much better he'd do without Wade holding him back to his media buddies. I've even heard Galloway say that Garrett believes this kind of thing on his show, though in fairness he did start ripping RJ later in the year.

But Mosley's first tidbit about this story was the first you've ever heard from "Wade's side". You hear it about Garrett all the time. Not a coincidence, I don't think.

But yes, Garrett spends tons of time with his side of the ball when Wade can't even be there. So it's absurd to think that RJ is somehow powerless to do anything to his players.

And I ask again, why is it that all these stories come from the offensive side of the ball? Many, many players on defense had their best years ever this year. Meanwhile, almost the entire offense went backwards this year.

And yet it's all the head coach's fault and not the coordinator's?

Exactly.

I still don't understand the Wade hate around here. Wade has did what he has came here to do. Which was fix the defense. If the offense was at all competent this year we probably would have had a better outcome. All you hear this off-season is the problems with the offensive side of the ball. The chemistry problems are what is wrong with the offense. And if you seen how out of sync they were this year than you can see the chemistry wasn't there.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Garrett just went 0 for 6 looking for work.

Wade hasn't won a playoff game, ever.

There isn't much power between those two.

 

[cowboyjoe]

who is rj suppose to stand for?

 

[Apollo Creed]

who is rj suppose to stand for?

Red-Jesus.

 

[Doomsday]

Exactly.

I still don't understand the Wade hate around here. Wade has did what he has came here to do. Which was fix the defense. If the offense was at all competent this year we probably would have had a better outcome. All you hear this off-season is the problems with the offensive side of the ball. The chemistry problems are what is wrong with the offense. And if you seen how out of sync they were this year than you can see the chemistry wasn't there.

That is a cop out, Wade was hired to be the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys not just make the defense better.

Wade's great improvements on defense really paid off vs the Rams.

 

[CoCo]

I still think Garrett leaks this stuff about how much better he'd do without Wade holding him back to his media buddies. I've even heard Galloway say that Garrett believes this kind of thing on his show, though in fairness he did start ripping RJ later in the year.

But Mosley's first tidbit about this story was the first you've ever heard from "Wade's side". You hear it about Garrett all the time. Not a coincidence, I don't think.

But yes, Garrett spends tons of time with his side of the ball when Wade can't even be there. So it's absurd to think that RJ is somehow powerless to do anything to his players.

And I ask again, why is it that all these stories come from the offensive side of the ball? Many, many players on defense had their best years ever this year. Meanwhile, almost the entire offense went backwards this year.

And yet it's all the head coach's fault and not the coordinator's?

I'm not giving Garrett a free pass. The offense has undoubtedly had its problems for which Garrett should be accountable.

Garrett should have as much power over his players as the HC deems appropriate. These stories make it appear as if the two guys haven't discussed that. I find that hard to believe.

What I don't find hard to believe is that Wade doesn't ever appear to be a credible leader beyond his DC role. That is the scent you get about his entire career and if anyone thought that was all total fabrication then you probably also thought that all the drama around TO w/Philly & SF was totally other people's fault. Both those folks are who they are.

Does it mean their weaknesses cannot be overcome? Not necessarily. But folks, buyer beware! You should know by now exactly what you are getting with Wade & TO. Expect it and don't fool yourself by blaming others for it who fail to compensate for those weaknesses.

In the end, its a package deal. If you want Wade & TO then you better make sure you have the pieces in place to compensate for their weaknesses. Right now, Jerry & Garrett as other keys in this mix are not adequately doing so. Heck, Jerry has as many holes because of his style. But he ain't gonna be fired.

Its certainly conceivable that you could fire Garrett and find an OC who would be a better complement to Wade and TO. I don't think that means Garrett is a bad guy or incapable. Rather he's maybe not the right complement for other pieces at this time.

So Jerry needs to decide - can 1 or more adjust? Wade & TO? NO! Garrett? Perhaps. If none can, then Jerry needs to decide which is his most valuable piece of the future. And the reality is that Wade & TO have little to no future in this organization. TO because of age, then temperment. And Wade because he's just not a strong HC plus he's getting on in years.

I think the looming possibilities of Holmgren & Shanny, in that order, have made Jerry less reluctant about Garrett leaving but not enough to push him out the door.

And I think all these possibilities and all this uncertainty has Jerry being incredibly patient about 2009 directions because there are no obvious rights or wrongs to him.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

That is a cop out, Wade was hired to be the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys not just make the defense better.

Wade's great improvements on defense really paid off vs the Rams.

Good to see someone giving credit to Wade for the offense of 2007.

Sorry, Tony Sparano and Garrett, it wasn't you.

 

[Yoshimitsu]

That is a cop out, Wade was hired to be the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys not just make the defense better.

Wade's great improvements on defense really paid off vs the Rams.

Right.

But what was the main reason why he was hired???

Because of the defense.

 

[RoadRunner]

Right.

But what was the main reason why he was hired???

Because of the defense.

More like he was hired to be a yes man to Jerry, and an easier going, friendlier personality because the players didn't like the taskmaster Parcells.

 

[slick325]

That Washington game was one of Garrett's best gameplans, too. The Commanders had to deal with Marion Barber. Garrett was getting the ball out of Romo's hand faster and still taking his shots down the field.

I'm beggining to think it would be best to hand this team to Jason Garrett right now. The situation is really, really bad, like you know. It's worse than I thought, and I thought it was really bad.

What good is a lame duck coach? If you want Garrett running the team in 2010, just do it now. The team would miss Phillips' defensive mind, but this team is totally screwed up. It needs one voice and one leader.

I agree with you. The buck stops with Wade Phillips. Saying that he "didn't want to step on Garrett's toes" is really weak if that is indeed true. Mosley has good connections, and he reported this in his blog. I tend to believe him based on Phillips not asserting himself, in regards to helping Garrett manage the field position in some of the games the Cowboys lost. For a head coach to just stand there and do nothing, is unacceptable. Phillips needs to go to assertiveness class 101.

The Cowboys need a head coach that will stand up to Jerry Jones and put him in his place. This guy needs to be willing to get fired on his principles. I think Garrett was ready to walk now. If Phillips wouldn't assert himself on the field by helping Garrett manage some field position, he probably isn't asserting himself to the owner.

Although I agree that Wade as head coach should handle all player problems no matter what unit the player is on. I have to disagree with your opening line. I think the 1st Washington game was one of Garrett's worst called games in his tenure.

Felix got no touches. MBIII barely touched the football and the passing game never made adjustments following Greg Blatche's adjustment to the Witten TD early. Not a shining moment for Garrett at all. The rest of the season wasn't much better for him or his unit either.

 

[theogt]

Let's see, you're hired before the head coach is even hired, you're annointed by the media as the heir apparent, you've been personal friends with the owner/GM for over a decade, and yet you feel powerless to discipline one of the player you personally are coordinating?

What's the excuse he'll use if he's head coach? "Gosh, guys, I thought it was Jerry's job to discipline players."

As CL said, this is just Garrett making excuses to the media for his poor performance. It's damage control for him, because his reputation C R A P.

 

[CoCo]

Let's see, you're hired before the head coach is even hired, you're annointed by the media as the heir apparent, you've been personal friends with the owner/GM for over a decade, and yet you feel powerless to discipline one of the player you personally are coordinating?

What's the excuse he'll use if he's head coach? "Gosh, guys, I thought it was Jerry's job to discipline players."

As CL said, this is just Garrett making excuses to the media for his poor performance. It's damage control for him, because his reputation C R A P.

Do we know what the agreement is between Wade & Garrett about Garrett disciplining players?

Do we know that Jerry & Wade would back Garrett if he tried to sink some teeth into TO?

Garrett certainly entered the organization 2 years ago as Jerry's fair-haired one but that doesn't mean he has the appropriate backing for carrying out discipline.

Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't. A+B does not always equal C at VR.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Garrett graduated from an Ivy league school, studied under one of the best QBs to ever play the game, played for a great psychological coach, and has been through the highs and lows of being a professional player and coach of this league.

I think our offense, and its simplicity last year had a lot to do with the IQ of a lot of our players. I'm certain our offensive line has 2 very dumb people on it, Flo and Gurode - when they speak it pains me to listen. I'd hate to have to coach them.

Roy Wi11iams broke the huddle with the dumb face every time last year, and then proceeded to run terrible routes and contributed nothing.

How can you establish continuity with those kinds of deficincies.

Its hard to coach around ignorance. And we've got plenty of that.

 

[theebs]

I still think Garrett leaks this stuff about how much better he'd do without Wade holding him back to his media buddies. I've even heard Galloway say that Garrett believes this kind of thing on his show, though in fairness he did start ripping RJ later in the year.

But Mosley's first tidbit about this story was the first you've ever heard from "Wade's side". You hear it about Garrett all the time. Not a coincidence, I don't think.

But yes, Garrett spends tons of time with his side of the ball when Wade can't even be there. So it's absurd to think that RJ is somehow powerless to do anything to his players.

And I ask again, why is it that all these stories come from the offensive side of the ball? Many, many players on defense had their best years ever this year. Meanwhile, almost the entire offense went backwards this year.

And yet it's all the head coach's fault and not the coordinator's?

all valid and true points.

I like garrett more than wade, but there is no doubt the media will favor garrett.

For a number of reasons though. In a sense he is like the backup qb, they always look better when the starter is struggling. Last year the team and wade struggled so naturally people start blaming him and favoring the backup.

If the roles were reversed I think the same would be said.

But I do agree, there is no doubt garrett has way more friends in the media. I know from just listening to them, aikman, sham, laufenberg etc really love the garretts.

and the last reason garrett gets sympathy is he has to be the direct coach of 81, so with 81 hated so much people are going to have sympathy for him and take his side.

but even having said that, even the wade supporters have to admit he doesnt handle his buisness as the head coach. He should be the one to clean up messes, but he doesnt, he just waves things off all the time as no big deal and makes excuses.

The thing is a mess.

 

[theogt]

Garrett graduated from an Ivy league school, studied under one of the best QBs to ever play the game, played for a great psychological coach, and has been through the highs and lows of being a professional player and coach of this league.

I think our offense, and its simplicity last year had a lot to do with the IQ of a lot of our players. I'm certain our offensive line has 2 very dumb people on it, Flo and Gurode - when they speak it pains me to listen. I'd hate to have to coach them.

Roy Wi11iams broke the huddle with the dumb face every time last year, and then proceeded to run terrible routes and contributed nothing.

How can you establish continuity with those kinds of deficincies.

Its hard to coach around ignorance. And we've got plenty of that.

They were apparently too stupid in 08, but not too stupid in 07. Is Roy Williams too stupid to run a slant?

 

[Apollo Creed]

They were apparently too stupid in 08, but not too stupid in 07. Is Roy Williams too stupid to run a slant?

We just got exposed down the stretch of 07. Teams started taking Owens out the gameplan and we failed to adjust. We were our most successful when we were getting the ball in 81s hands early and often, and then pounding them with Barber late.

This board and slants. I remember us running several slants last year, that got intercepted, nearly intercepted or broken up almost every time.

 

[theogt]

We just got exposed down the stretch of 07. Teams started taking Owens out the gameplan and we failed to adjust. We were our most successful when we were getting the ball in 81s hands early and often, and then pounding them with Barber late.

This board and slants. I remember us running several slants last year, that got intercepted, nearly intercepted or broken up almost every time.

Not to Roy Williams, you didn't. He didn't run one until the last game of the season. I really couldn't care if he runs 1 or 20, it's just indicative of the idea that the routes they're running are predictable and simplistic.

As for '07, the offense got more simplistic as the year went on for some reason. I kept thinking we were just holding stuff back at the end of the year because we had already clinched the playoffs.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Not to Roy Williams, you didn't. He didn't run one until the last game of the season. I really couldn't care if he runs 1 or 20, it's just indicative of the idea that the routes they're running are predictable and simplistic.

As for '07, the offense got more simplistic as the year went on for some reason. I kept thinking we were just holding stuff back at the end of the year because we had already clinched the playoffs.

We had loads of success with the route trees before teams started double Owens. Once they took away our big play threat, it was up to Roy, Crayton, and Witten to get separation. They couldn't.

 

[theogt]

We had loads of success with the route trees before teams started double Owens. Once they took away our big play threat, it was up to Roy, Crayton, and Witten to get separation. They couldn't.

Gotta love a game plan that your players have to overcome to be successful.

 

[tyke1doe]

And some thought it was a good idea to hire Jason Garrett as offensive coordinator-head coach to be.

Wow. This franchises is so dysfunctional it's not even funny anymore. Well, except for non-Cowboys fans.