Does being selected to the Pro Bowl mean anything?

[Vintage]

But since pro bowl balloting is influenced by three different groups, using Newman and Hall as examples, three basic questions come to mind:

1. What percentage of fans preferred Newman or Hall more?
2. What percentage of their fellow players preferred Newman or Hall more?
3. What percentage of coaches preferred Newman or Hall more?

All three groups opinions weigh equally upon deciding who gets selected and who doesn't.

Exactly. The coaches, fans, and players didn't think Newman deserved the Pro Bowl over Hall or anyone else.

So if the Pro Bowl means something.....

 

[2233boys]

Any pro bowl/All Star game that allows Joe Fan to participates means nothing.

That makes as much sense as allowing parents to decide all state canidates for high school sports.

 

[DallasEast]

Exactly. The coaches, fans, and players didn't think Newman deserved the Pro Bowl over Hall or anyone else.

So if the Pro Bowl means something.....

Not necessarily. A player only needs a majority of the three voting groups' decision. For example, it could be that Newman won the coaches' vote, while losing the fans and players vote, and Hall won via a 2/3 majority decision.

 

[superpunk]

It's a nice honor for people. At the least, it means you're a very talented player, who has a good reputation. You had to get that reputation from somewhere, so generally you're one of the best players at your position, or were at one time and are living off your reputation.

I've heard several interviews with players who acknowledge that they just kind of go by ESPN highlights when voting. Coaches are probably similar. These guys are a little busy on sundays during the football season - unless they're voting on a player they played against, they likely don't know much more about the players' performance than your average casual fan. Case in point - Gurode was likely not a pro-bowl caliber center last year. But for a few weeks, he was the talk of the town at a position that doesn't get much attention - he kicked Haynesworth around, and then got real famous because Haynesworth kicked him (literally). So he got himself noticed. Does that mean he's a great ("pro-bowl") quality center? Likely not. But I couldn't begin to tell you who I'd have replaced him with.

Other positions where you can be dominant while not compiling stats have similar problems in the casual evaluations made by fans, players and coaches. DBs are judged on INT and PDs....because what else can you grab onto when taking 15 minutes to evaluate an entire conference? OL are picked by how well you know their name.

It means alot for certain positions. At spots like RB and QB, you can readily tell who the best in the league are. It matters less for others.

 

[DallasEast]

Another thing I think is wrong about Pro Bowl balloting is the reporting of the votes. Sure, they announce the popular (fan) voting results, but they do not publish the players and coaches votes. If the NFL wanted to insert more intrigue and debate into the process, let everyone see how players are ranked in the eyes of fans, players and coaches.

 

[DallasEast]

It's a nice honor for people. At the least, it means you're a very talented player, who has a good reputation. You had to get that reputation from somewhere, so generally you're one of the best players at your position, or were at one time and are living off your reputation.

I've heard several interviews with players who acknowledge that they just kind of go by ESPN highlights when voting. Coaches are probably similar. These guys are a little busy on sundays during the football season - unless they're voting on a player they played against, they likely don't know much more about the players' performance than your average casual fan. Case in point - Gurode was likely not a pro-bowl caliber center last year. But for a few weeks, he was the talk of the town at a position that doesn't get much attention - he kicked Haynesworth around, and then got real famous because Haynesworth kicked him (literally). So he got himself noticed. Does that mean he's a great ("pro-bowl") quality center? Likely not. But I couldn't begin to tell you who I'd have replaced him with.

Other positions where you can be dominant while not compiling stats have similar problems in the casual evaluations made by fans, players and coaches. DBs are judged on INT and PDs....because what else can you grab onto when taking 15 minutes to evaluate an entire conference? OL are picked by how well you know their name.

It means alot for certain positions. At spots like RB and QB, you can readily tell who the best in the league are. It matters less for others.

As much as I may hate to admit it, I believe that Haynesworth played a somewhat substantial part in getting Gurode selected.

 

[Phoenix-Talon]

Probowl candidates have bragging rights, and add another notch onto their resume. That said, it can't hurt to have "x-number" of probowls under your belt when sportswriters start looking at your file for HOF consideration.

Speaking of Hawaii, I'll be there next month on a business assignment ...

PT

 

[Stash]

As much as I may hate to admit it, I believe that Haynesworth played a somewhat substantial part in getting Gurode selected.

If memory serves, Gurode was simply a replacement for the guy who actually got voted in.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Not necessarily. A player only needs a majority of the three voting groups' decision. For example, it could be that Newman won the coaches' vote, while losing the fans and players vote, and Hall won via a 2/3 majority decision.

Or on the flip side, TO won the fan vote, but not the coaches or players. It's all relative.

I would put good money down that Newman makes it this year. He's getting a lot of pub now. Folks are starting to take notice. Which, IMO, is two years late. 2006 wasn't as good a year as 2005, but the hype machine is building.

 

[DallasEast]

If memory serves, Gurode was simply a replacement for the guy who actually got voted in.

True, but I'm left wondering if he would've even been designated as an alternate if Haynesworth wouldn't have tried to gorge his eyes out.

 

[AdamJT13]

But since pro bowl balloting is influenced by three different groups, using Newman and Hall as examples, three basic questions come to mind:

1. What percentage of fans preferred Newman or Hall more?

Hall received 272,198 votes. Newman got 167,599.

2. What percentage of their fellow players preferred Newman or Hall more?
3. What percentage of coaches preferred Newman or Hall more?

We'll never know the answers to either of those questions.

 

[BouncingCheese]

It's a nice accolade to have and all, but real NFL fans and press know who is the real deal...

 

[DallasEast]

Or on the flip side, TO won the fan vote, but not the coaches or players. It's all relative.

You know, that's the exact scenario I've always thought actually happened myself...

I would put good money down that Newman makes it this year. He's getting a lot of pub now. Folks are starting to take notice. Which, IMO, is two years late. 2006 wasn't as good a year as 2005, but the hype machine is building.

I feel it in my bones that IF Phillips can implement and attacking defense, it will force quarterbacks into making the mistake of throwing at Newman's receiver first before scanning for another receiver. IF that happens, I have no doubt that Newman will get voted into next year's Pro Bowl. No doubt whatsoever.

 

[DallasEast]

Hall received 272,198 votes. Newman got 167,599.




We'll never know the answers to either of those questions.

ADAM!

http://cowboyszone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1517971&postcount=25

 

[iceberg]

Pretty simple, choose one.

I don't see where the "poll" option is, so I cannot make it a poll.

I should have clarified. Does the Pro Bowl mean anything to you when trying to defend/criticise another player.

Obviously it matters to the players for recognition/salary...but I don't care about their opinions.

I am just trying to find out how fans here view the Pro Bowl.


_______________________________________


My choice is no.

no, it's not that simple. in the end people will still use it as a guildeline or a stupid standard based on how they feel about a player emotionally or otherwise.

if you're trying to argue "for" the player, the pro bowl means something.

if you're arguing against the player, you immeiately discredit the probowl with a bunch of those who were there but shouldn't have been - in their opinion.

yet if the one aruging against a player were to *like* someone in question, suddenly the pro-bowl is a valid yard stick again.

in the end people will feel how they feel about someone - stats, recognition or otherwise.

 

[BouncingCheese]

no, it's not that simple. in the end people will still use it as a guildeline or a stupid standard based on how they feel about a player emotionally or otherwise.

if you're trying to argue "for" the player, the pro bowl means something.

if you're arguing against the player, you immeiately discredit the probowl with a bunch of those who were there but shouldn't have been - in their opinion.

yet if the one aruging against a player were to *like* someone in question, suddenly the pro-bowl is a valid yard stick again.

in the end people will feel how they feel about someone - stats, recognition or otherwise.

It really is all about stats; London Fletcher ( I know he isn't a probowl player but follow me here) gets boat loads of tackles, but alot of them come from him chasing down the running back after he gain a bundle of yards. People who aren't in that market don't really see that, so we instead look at the tangible stuff like stats. DeAngelo Hall was beaten MUCH more than Newmann last year from what I saw, but people only see the int's and Hall's big mouth.

 

[GlitzCowboy]

Like everyone else; Yes it did/does, but not really anymore because of the fan voting. Kinda screws the league in a way too.. Suddendly Donald Driver after receiving all the anti-TO votes thinks he's better then one of the absolute bests and will go into his next contract talks with that same diluted head. He's not even in the same league yet he's going to get paid for it one day, and in the process drive the cost of WRs up even higher. I mean seriously, if TNew and other DBs, along with just players, are the only one's doing the voting, who do you think they chose if they're really being honest; TO or Driver? The guy who spins dirt in their face or the guy that is only known because of the QB throwing to him?