Drafting a Tight End = Bad Idea

[cowboyec]

I'd take Ian Thomas,Indiana and let him school behind Witten.
There are not alot of "complete" TEs but Thomas seems to be...I also like Troy Fumagalli,Wisconsin.
It all depends on the board tho.
If Thomas is there in the 4th,Id take him.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

So what you're saying is that the Cowboys need a tight end more than a tackle, guard, linebacker and defensive tackle.

I disagree.

And any tight end you get in the 5th round or later isn't likely to be the type of tight end you say they need...

 

[kskboys]

mid/late rounds only. Sure.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

"LOL. Anyone who thinks what Witten did there and what Ertz did is the same thing is going to be hard to take seriously at this point."

So somebody diving for a td into the end zone scores more points that someone who catches the ball and basically strolls upright into the end zone?

Doesn't matter how you get there, it's 6 pts either way.

But I get it, the flashy play is just better, eh?

 

[LACowboysFan1]

"The other 4 TEs on the roster are just guys. Nothing more"

How would we know? None of them have had more than maybe 10 passes a year thrown to them, one of them might be the next Gronk. Not likely, but if you just want to get rid of Witten because he's too slow, then please note Hanna ran a 4.43 at the combine in 2012, pretty sure he's still at least close to that speed...

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

The reality is Witten is not even "Dak friendly" in that he provides little to no catch radius other than what comes within reach of his extended arms flat footed. When you have a QB with erratic accuracy you need your receivers to help him out.

Witten is the Cal Ripken of baseball. He's put up a few nice seasons numbers wise but his stats are primarily a byproduct of sheer volume and his durability.

I hate being critical of Witten because he is a legend and surefire HOFer, but thinking he's still a viable weapon at age 36 is crazy.

 

[kskboys]

The reality is Witten is not even "Dak friendly" in that he provides little to no catch radius other than what comes within reach of his extended arms flat footed. When you have a QB with erratic accuracy you need your receivers to help him out.

Witten is the Cal Ripken of baseball. He's put up a few nice seasons numbers wise but his stats are primarily a byproduct of sheer volume and his durability.

I hate being critical of Witten because he is a legend and surefire HOFer, but thinking he's still a viable weapon at age 36 is crazy.

Can't disagree.

Witten reminds me a lot of Emmit and Irvin. Both of them were short yardage chain movers. The thing is, w/ Witten, they simply haven't surrounded him w/ talent. I'm not sure our starting WR's would start for most teams, so you're left w/ other teams being able to fill Witten's primary territory w/ defenders.

However, Witten is old. He should start seeing a reduction in snaps, and for bog's sake get a TE in here who can both catch and block.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

"thinking he's still a viable weapon at age 36 is crazy."

7th rated tight end in 2017. 12th in yards, 10th in tds.

So I guess someone's a viable weapon at tight end only if they're one of the top 5 tight ends in the game.

In that case since you want to move up from the 7th tight end to the top 3, better draft a tight end at 19.

And kiss Dak goodbye...

 

[LACowboysFan1]

Getting a top tight end in the draft is sort of like putting 140 mph rated tires on a VW bug that can only go 80 mph.

Lots of capability but you're not able to use it.

But go ahead, draft a tight end high and watch Dak get buried in the pass rush while your shiny new tight end is 30 yards downfield and wide open...

 

[Sydla]

So what you're saying is that the Cowboys need a tight end more than a tackle, guard, linebacker and defensive tackle.

I disagree.

And any tight end you get in the 5th round or later isn't likely to be the type of tight end you say they need...

No, what I am saying is that the Cowboys shouldn't view TE as fine or OK like you seem to be doing and that if an opportunity presents itself to upgrade in FA or in the draft because a TE fell to them say in the 3rd round that they have high on their board they should absolutely take it.

Sure we need players at other positions but TE isn't exactly our strength right now.

Frankly, what I would do is see what Tyler Eifert's market value is given he's coming off of back surgery. If cheap, I'd bring him in to go with Witten, Gathers, and whomever else they want to keep. Then that frees up the draft for other positions. But if they don't look to try to upgrade TE in FA, then it absolutely should be a position they look at in the draft depending on how their draft falls.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

No, what I am saying is that the Cowboys shouldn't view TE as fine or OK like you seem to be doing and that if an opportunity presents itself to upgrade in FA or in the draft because a TE fell to them say in the 3rd round that they have high on their board they should absolutely take it.

Sure we need players at other positions but TE isn't exactly our strength right now.

Frankly, what I would do is see what Tyler Eifert's market value is given he's coming off of back surgery. If cheap, I'd bring him in to go with Witten, Gathers, and whomever else they want to keep. Then that frees up the draft for other positions. But if they don't look to try to upgrade TE in FA, then it absolutely should be a position they look at in the draft depending on how their draft falls.

I understand your position, though I don't agree with it. But to me the Cowboys HAVE to draft an OT, LB, DL and OG (assuming there's good ones available at each spot) with the first 4 picks, and by the 5th round, I seriously doubt there will be a tight end available in the draft that you can have realistic expectations of being better than ANY of the current tight ends on the team...

 

[Sydla]

"LOL. Anyone who thinks what Witten did there and what Ertz did is the same thing is going to be hard to take seriously at this point."

So somebody diving for a td into the end zone scores more points that someone who catches the ball and basically strolls upright into the end zone?

Doesn't matter how you get there, it's 6 pts either way.

But I get it, the flashy play is just better, eh?

Ummm yeah.............. because it shows one has athleticism that the other simply doesn't have. And if you can't admit that, then you clearly have an issue admitting reality.

 

[Sydla]

"The other 4 TEs on the roster are just guys. Nothing more"

How would we know? None of them have had more than maybe 10 passes a year thrown to them, one of them might be the next Gronk. Not likely, but if you just want to get rid of Witten because he's too slow, then please note Hanna ran a 4.43 at the combine in 2012, pretty sure he's still at least close to that speed...

So you are one of these guys that thinks Hanna and Swaim are diamonds in the rough who will explode once they get more PT?

Oy vey.

 

[Sydla]

I understand your position, though I don't agree with it. But to me the Cowboys HAVE to draft an OT, LB, DL and OG (assuming there's good ones available at each spot) with the first 4 picks, and by the 5th round, I seriously doubt there will be a tight end available in the draft that you can have realistic expectations of being better than ANY of the current tight ends on the team...

They don't "have" to draft those four positions with their first four picks. WR is also a need. So is TE. Shoot, S is a need as well. Guess what? DE isn't exactly stocked either. For all the talk about Lawrence and his sacks, the Cowboys were middle of the pack in the NFL in sacks and QB pressures. So they could absolutely use another legit edge player.

Locking yourself into the 4 positions you state is silly IMO because it overrates the depth and skill at some other positions.

You overrated Witten and underrate the importance of the TE position, especially for this offense and Dak (or shoot any future QB), who clearly needs some more weapons on offense.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

"You overrated Witten and underrate the importance of the TE position, especially for this offense and Dak (or shoot any future QB), who clearly needs some more weapons on offense.:

That's your opinion and you're welcome to it...

 

[LACowboysFan1]

"So you are one of these guys that thinks Hanna and Swaim are diamonds in the rough who will explode once they get more PT?"

Don't know that they are, don't know they aren't.

What I'm saying is anyone thinks Witten needs to be phased out or replaced, they should try what they've got before taking a chance on a total unknown draftee, who's never played a down of NFL football...

 

[cnuball21]

If you can get a very good TE in the draft, possibly your next future HOF TE in the draft...you take it.
You give that guy a chance to learn from the best and play with the best and hope Witten passes the torch on to him.

We went years after Novacek looking for our next good, to great TE...we finally hit on Witten in the third. We got lucky other teams wiffed by taking other TEs in that draft as Jason was rated as a first rounder.

You don't pass on a good TE that might be our next great one just because the current one has a cap friendly deal in place...Heck if anything, that cap friendly deal in place makes it a better set of circumstances to draft a TE in a higher round if they are worth it.

I agree wit this.

There's not any great TE talent in this draft but one is available next year I'm down.

 

[Sydla]

"So you are one of these guys that thinks Hanna and Swaim are diamonds in the rough who will explode once they get more PT?"

Don't know that they are, don't know they aren't.

What I'm saying is anyone thinks Witten needs to be phased out or replaced, they should try what they've got before taking a chance on a total unknown draftee, who's never played a down of NFL football...

He needs to be phased out. He's a 36 year old TE that offers little in terms of any downfield threat. He doesn't need to be outright replaced but thinking TE is in good hands for 2018 is simply homerism or Witten fanboism or whatever else you want to come up with.

The Cowboys do not "need" to come out of this draft with a TE. But it's also not a position they should ignore if the opportunity presents itself in this draft (or even FA) to land a TE they really like in the first 3, or even 4, rounds of the draft.

You simply have a much higher opinion of our roster, I guess, if you think TE isn't a need and that it's really just OG, OT, LB and DL are our only needs.

 

[Hardline]

You do realize Witten was the 7th rated tight end last year? 7th in receptions, 12th in yards and 10th in tds (only 3 behind the much heralded Ertz, Gronkowski and Kelce)?

His average per catch was 80th, but that's more a function of the team not going downfield much to anybody, since Dak was under pressure a lot. And Witten is Dak's security blanket, Witten hangs around close to the line of scrimmage so Dak can dump the ball off to Witten to avoid a loss of yardage. He's not going downfield because of the offensive scheme, not Witten's lack of speed. He never had better than an 11.9 average per catch, he was never fast, but speed doesn't help you if you can't get open.

And you have to make your tight end a focus of the offense for him to have the great stats, and the Cowboys are set up for Elliot to be the focus, tight end is not going to be a big part of your offense in that case.

But the Cowboys do need to develop Hanna or Gathers or whoever, no doubt about that, Witten won't play forever. And drafting a tight end in later rounds wouldn't hurt, Gronkowski was a second round pick. Jimmy Graham was a third round pick. So there's tight end talent in later rounds.

Like receiver, imho, tight end is not at the top of the list for needs on this team...

Glad to see someone other than me sees this.
This is the truth and undebatable.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

"thinking he's still a viable weapon at age 36 is crazy."

7th rated tight end in 2017. 12th in yards, 10th in tds.

So I guess someone's a viable weapon at tight end only if they're one of the top 5 tight ends in the game.

In that case since you want to move up from the 7th tight end to the top 3, better draft a tight end at 19.

And kiss Dak goodbye...

If you think these numbers are irreplaceable then I can't help you.

63 rec.
560 yards
8.9 YPC
5 TDs

I